Rule on arm moving forward

[Runwildboys]

I think its pretty straightforward actually. When you throw something, the second it leaves your hand, it's a throw. The hand has to release the ball to make it a throw.

Well if you wanna go that route. Are you throwing something after it leaves your hand, or are you throwing it while it's in your hand?

 

[glimmerman]

Cock the arm and fire. Anything knocked out during the ball coming back or before the hand and arm going forward is a fumble. Once the arm and or hand starts going forward it’s a pass.

 

[Gaede]

Well if you wanna go that route. Are you throwing something after it leaves your hand, or are you throwing it while it's in your hand?

You're throwing something while it's in your hand, but it's not thrown until it leaves your hand.

 

[Runwildboys]

You're throwing something while it's in your hand, but it's not thrown until it leaves your hand.

So he was throwing the ball, but it wasn't a pass?

 

[Gaede]

So he was throwing the ball, but it wasn't a pass?

Yeah. Why would it be considered a throw if it wasn't actually thrown? Attempted throw does not equal a throw.

Runners and receivers either posses the ball or not, regardless of the motion they're undertaking prior to losing possession. Why is it different for QBs?

 

[Runwildboys]

Yeah. Why would it be considered a throw if it wasn't actually thrown? Attempted throw does not equal a throw.

Runners and receivers either posses the ball or not, regardless of the motion they're undertaking prior to losing possession. Why is it different for QBs?

The QB is in the process of throwing the ball when his arm starts moving forward. Until that point, he's not attempting to throw the ball, therefore it's a fumble. Once the arm is moving forward with the ball in hand, it's being passed, and it can either be completed, incomplete, or intercepted. The result of the pass is irrelevant. when a runner or receiver takes possession of the ball, the result is the deciding factor.

 

[Gaede]

The QB is in the process of throwing the ball when his arm starts moving forward. Until that point, he's not attempting to throw the ball, therefore it's a fumble. Once the arm is moving forward with the ball in hand, it's being passed, and it can either be completed, incomplete, or intercepted. The result of the pass is irrelevant. when a runner or receiver takes possession of the ball, the result is the deciding factor.

It's not the result of the pass that matters. It's the fact that it's not a pass until it leaves the hand.

 

[Runwildboys]

It's not the result of the pass that matters. It's the fact that it's not a pass until it leaves the hand.

He's passing the ball while it's in his hand. Once it leaves his hand he's no longer passing the ball. So DLaw hit the ball while he was passing it.

 

[Gangsta Spanksta]

Unfortunately it was called correctly. It was a pass attempt per the rules.

Not even unfortunately in this case. Its a good rule and consistant. It would be unfortunately if we would've lost, but since we won it is not unfortunately in my eyes.

 

[Gaede]

He's passing the ball while it's in his hand. Once it leaves his hand he's no longer passing the ball. So DLaw hit the ball while he was passing it.

We're just going to have to agree to disagree here.

 

[Runwildboys]

We're just going to have to agree to disagree here.

Okay, have a good night, brother.

 

[Gangsta Spanksta]

its a good rule because it is simple and the solves the problem of the perception that it is still in his hand versus it actually still being in his hand. the fingers could actually not be touching the ball at one point of the throw motion but on camera it looks like he is still holding it. It's not like its not a loss of down once it is judge to be a pass versus a fumble. I like this rule much more than judging what a football move is.

 

[BrassCowboy]

You actually make my point. The Dez catch was obvious and the technicality of the rule was wrong. Hence they changed it.

they made it clearer, as in a football move meant you caught and possessed the ball. I think the arm moving forward should should constitute a pass, simple... otherwise thjere would be a lot of questionable calls.

 

[BrassCowboy]

agree 100%. Just like parts of the catch rule, the roughing the QB rules, PI rules…they are terrible, don’t pass the common sense test, and make the league look like a joke. I don’t care that it was a Cowboy game and I know it was the right call per the current rule…but common sense says that’s a fumble as the QB hadn’t voluntarily released that football from his hand before it was knocked out, the fact his arm was going forward is irrelevant in common sense land

i fully agree with your idea of roughing the passer calls and PI rules being horrible, but the arm moving forward one that we are talking about. this keeps the game honest. The less you leave up for interpretation by the ref, the better. Arm moving forward = simple. no guesswork as to whether it was a real fumble and not just a botched pass. they should keep this rule as is.

 

[kskboys]

You're throwing something while it's in your hand, but it's not thrown until it leaves your hand.

I cannot comprehend why you're having such a hard time w/ this very simple rule. Changing it would be ludicrous and would lead to all sorts of messes. Think, man, you do not want this rule changed.

 

[GMO415]

That reminds me....take away one of Brady's SBs. Hahaha

 

[Gaede]

I cannot comprehend why you're having such a hard time w/ this very simple rule. Changing it would be ludicrous and would lead to all sorts of messes. Think, man, you do not want this rule changed.

I think its a great example of the NFL making up a very technical rule that both defies common sense (imagine trying to understand what constitutes a catch and/or fumble as a layperson) and puts more power in the officials hands to affect the game.

I really don't care about this particular rule, to be honest. I am trying to make a point that the NFL, overall, employs many nonsensical rules that only make sense because they consistently employ them, and that these overly technical, nonsensical rules degrade the quality of the game.

 

[Runwildboys]

I think its a great example of the NFL making up a very technical rule that both defies common sense (imagine trying to understand what constitutes a catch and/or fumble as a layperson) and puts more power in the officials hands to affect the game.

I really don't care about this particular rule, to be honest. I am trying to make a point that the NFL, overall, employs many nonsensical rules that only make sense because they consistently employ them, and that these overly technical, nonsensical rules degrade the quality of the game.

But this rule (definition of a pass) simplifies things by taking the judgement call of the ball leaving the QB's hand away from the officials, and uses the more easily apparent criterion of the arm moving forward with the ball.

Edit: Sorry, I forgot we agreed to disagree. Lol But I'm not deleting the post.

 

[Whirlwin]

No. The ball has toove forward after being release by the QB's hand for it to be a forward pass.

The ball did not go forward after leaving his hand. The ball was literally pushed backwards off his hand by DLaw.

I'm sure you've seen those dollie videos where the QB goes to throw the ball bit it goes backwards? Same concept.

It was a fumble.

OK I just learned something. It’s not that the ball was going forward before His arm was hit. It was that the ball never went forward after he lost it. I know how to determine but is this true

 

[Whirlwin]

It was a pass

No it was not. The rule states the ball never went forward after he lost it