Why the "Dak is elite" narrative is so flawed

[KJJ]

Wahhhhh

If it bothers you then good.

Better hope you don’t eventually bother the mods with it.

 

[Calvin2Tony2Emmitt2Julius]

I’m saying Dak is average to slightly above average. Not a scrub. But also not the anointed savior of the franchise that others make him out to be.

If that makes me a member of a circle jerk universe, I guess I need to go get the lotion.

Anointed savior ? I didn't know a billion dollar plus franchise needed a savior. Dak Prescott is one player, He'll play as long as his time permits. and when its up, its up

and if you've never said he's a scrub then that wasn't directed at you. Words mean things and average is 16th rated. slightly above average would be about 14 rated.

Numbers disagree with you because Dak was ranked 8th. So what does that say about him does that make him elite???? Not without a Super Bowl win or two. but average???

Again my man I've got no problem with you and I apologize if it seems I was talking about you. I wasn't. I was talking to all those convinced Dak is a scrub, he sucks and Dallas is

Doomed as long as he is in Dallas, and that they are right and anybody else is delusional

Now put away the lube

 

[KJJ]

Good for you.

You're such a hero lol

That’s more than I can say for you.

 

[Gangsta Spanksta]

Elite is one of the most overused and misused terms in sports right now. Dak is nowhere near elite.

Elite should be proven in the playoffs.

 

[Calvin2Tony2Emmitt2Julius]

Oh yeah I see why you thought I was going at you. It just seemed like a good place to jump in Due to all of the hate and Venom of others in the thread my bad.

 

[SultanOfSix]

What Romo did 15 years ago is much more impressive than what Dak did this year.

And I believe both guys are losers.

It depends upon how you’re equivocating on the term loser.

Romo was an overachiever from where he was drafted. The mere fact that a UFA finished as a top 10 all time passer when he retired contradicts almost every definition of the term.

And he’s certainly not a loser when it comes to financial and career success in life.

 

[DFWJC]

Dak has played 5 seasons where he started the majority of the games

In Passer Rating (just one measurement, but we'll use that)

0 seasons #1
2 of 5 seasons top 5
2 of 5 seasons below top 10, so
3 of 5 seasons in top 10
1 of 5 seasons out of top 15
0 seasons out of top 20

Do with it what you wish. I think the average is in the 9-11 range

 

[DFWJC]

It depends upon how you’re equivocating on the term loser.

Romo was an overachiever from where he was drafted. The mere fact that a UFA finished as a top 10 all time passer when he retired contradicts almost every definition of the term.

And he’s certainly not a loser when it comes to financial and career success in life.

In all 8 of his season, he finished in the top 10 in passer rating.
He also became the first QB to lead the league in Passer rating in both the playoffs and regular season in the same year.
Furthermore, his team never had a losing season in the 8 seasons he started most of the games.
5 winning seasons and 3 .500 seasons.

 

[FiveSuperBowls]

I thought we were passed the Dak is elite topics? Let’s move on to the draft. Oops, wrong forum.

 

[Calvin2Tony2Emmitt2Julius]

↑
Elite is one of the most overused and misused terms in sports right now. Dak is nowhere near elite.
.
Elite should be proven in the playoffs.

My man that's a very subjective way of looking at it. That's your right. it is what it is.

It is one of the most overused and misused terms in sports.

How is elite measured? Super Bowls, Wins, Playoff wins?

Drew Brees was he elite for just his Super Bowl season, was Dan Marino ever elite. Was Fran Tarkenton ,Dan Fouts was he just ok

was Phil Simms elite ?? He won didn't he ? Jim McMahon? What makes a QB elite.

I am a Dak Prescott fan, He is my teams QB and I want him to be the best. I have never said he is elite. Personally I don't believe in Elite

To me its an argument I don't care to waste my time on. I don't believe Mike or Lebron is Best. I don't believe Barry Bonds or Mark McGuire were the best hitters

It's a casual fans argument as far as I'm concerned

 

[shabazz]

I thought we were passed the Dak is elite topics? Let’s move on to the draft. Oops, wrong forum.

very true. So far, so bad, but the final story hasn’t been written yet…..how bout that draft!

 

[Qcard]

Dak broke some franchise records in 2021. I'm not here to deny that. What I will deny, though, is the significance and relevance of those records.

QB stats in 2021 are very disproportionately inflated, even compared to ~15 years ago. Take a look at this:

In the 2005-2006 season

• 11 QBs passed for more than 20 TDs. One threw for 30+TDs (C. Palmer).
• Not a single QB threw for over 4,500 yards. Only two QBs threw for over 4,000 yards.

In the 2006-2007 season

• 10 QBs passed for more than 20 TDs. One threw for 30+TDs (P. Manning).
• Not a single QB threw for over 4,500 yards. Only two QBs threw for over 4,000 yards.

"Greatness" is relative to the the era of NFL that a QB plays. Style of play and pass-happy rules in 2021 makes the NFL a drastically different league than it was even 15 years ago.

In the 2021-2022 season

• 19 QBs passed for more than 20 TDs. 9 threw for 30+TDs.
• 6 QBs threw for over 4,500 yards. 10 QBs threw for over 4,000 yards.

And for those who will invariably try to "get me" by pointing out the 17 game schedule this year, more QBs threw for 30+ TDs in 2020 than 2021 and more QBs threw for over 4,000 yards in 2020 than 2021.

If he were teleported to 2005 and became the Cowboys starting QB, Dak would throw for 19 TDs and ~3,400 yards. That's just the reality. He'd be the equivalent of Kerry Collins or Gus Frerotte. A $40 million Gus Frerotte LOL!

People need to stop conflating gaudy passing stats to greatness. Greatness is much more nuanced than the # of passing TDs a guy has. Great players have "it" when the pressure is on. Dak doesn't.

Watch this video.. it summarizes what I'm saying very well

I agree Troy Aikman is eliteness was flawed too....Dang Free Agency Era!!

Dak Haters have zero concept of History!

 

[817Gill]

Dak broke some franchise records in 2021. I'm not here to deny that. What I will deny, though, is the significance and relevance of those records.

QB stats in 2021 are very disproportionately inflated, even compared to ~15 years ago. Take a look at this:

In the 2005-2006 season

• 11 QBs passed for more than 20 TDs. One threw for 30+TDs (C. Palmer).
• Not a single QB threw for over 4,500 yards. Only two QBs threw for over 4,000 yards.

In the 2006-2007 season

• 10 QBs passed for more than 20 TDs. One threw for 30+TDs (P. Manning).
• Not a single QB threw for over 4,500 yards. Only two QBs threw for over 4,000 yards.

"Greatness" is relative to the the era of NFL that a QB plays. Style of play and pass-happy rules in 2021 makes the NFL a drastically different league than it was even 15 years ago.

In the 2021-2022 season

• 19 QBs passed for more than 20 TDs. 9 threw for 30+TDs.
• 6 QBs threw for over 4,500 yards. 10 QBs threw for over 4,000 yards.

And for those who will invariably try to "get me" by pointing out the 17 game schedule this year, more QBs threw for 30+ TDs in 2020 than 2021 and more QBs threw for over 4,000 yards in 2020 than 2021.

If he were teleported to 2005 and became the Cowboys starting QB, Dak would throw for 19 TDs and ~3,400 yards. That's just the reality. He'd be the equivalent of Kerry Collins or Gus Frerotte. A $40 million Gus Frerotte LOL!

People need to stop conflating gaudy passing stats to greatness. Greatness is much more nuanced than the # of passing TDs a guy has. Great players have "it" when the pressure is on. Dak doesn't.

Watch this video.. it summarizes what I'm saying very well

Not sure how many people think he’s elite, I think that’s a very small minority of fans. Most people say 6-10/8-12 range.

The loudest battles on here come from people responding to people who think he’s bad or people who think he’s elite. The fringe opinions are what create the harsh arguments. Most of us are centered and think he’s a 8-10ish guy give or take a few spots.

 

[America's Cowboy]

Agreed. Romo was mistake prone, especially the first 5-6 years of his career.

But Romo did phenomenal things with way less surrounding talent than Dak ever has. Romo made others better.

With the possible exception of TE, Dak makes those around him worse because of his inconsistencies.

Romo was surrounded by a franchise record 13 Pro Bowlers in 2007 after his 2nd year starting. Count them: 13! He kept most of those players through the 2009 season. 3+ seasons surrounded by a franchise record 13 Pro Bowlers.

But, yeah, let's keep chirping how Romo never had talent around him.

 

[Qcard]

Romo was surrounded by a franchise record 13 Pro Bowlers in 2007 after his 2nd year starting. Count them: 13! He kept most of those players through the 2009 season. 3+ seasons surrounded by a franchise record 13 Pro Bowlers.

But, yeah, let's keep chirping how Romo never had talent around him.

It was Patrick Crayton's Fault Romo threw an INT targeting Terry Glenn on the next play

 

[Calvin2Tony2Emmitt2Julius]

Are you upset that I'm talking about Dak in a Dak thread?

What else did you expect? If you don't like to see people talking about Dak then don't look at Dak threads.



Come on now buttercup! Be for real ! I mean serious. I've seen you doggin Dak in threads that have nothing to do with Dak

But it's the kind of disingenuous BS I've come to expect from you and your Ilk

See conversations must be made in good faith otherwise their just hateful diatribes.

You sir are the board winner of hateful diatribes directed at Dak Prescott.

It's cool but you don't have to be a lying piece of trash about it

Then again...........................Yeah, you do

 

[Calvin2Tony2Emmitt2Julius]

Not sure how many people think he’s elite, I think that’s a very small minority of fans. Most people say 6-10/8-12 range.

The loudest battles on here come from people responding to people who think he’s bad or people who think he’s elite. The fringe opinions are what create the harsh arguments. Most of us are centered and think he’s a 8-10ish guy give or take a few spots.

I'm with this guy.!!!!!

 

[Flamma]

↑
Elite is one of the most overused and misused terms in sports right now. Dak is nowhere near elite.
.
Elite should be proven in the playoffs.

My man that's a very subjective way of looking at it. That's your right. it is what it is.

It is one of the most overused and misused terms in sports.

How is elite measured? Super Bowls, Wins, Playoff wins?

Drew Brees was he elite for just his Super Bowl season, was Dan Marino ever elite. Was Fran Tarkenton ,Dan Fouts was he just ok

was Phil Simms elite ?? He won didn't he ? Jim McMahon? What makes a QB elite.

I am a Dak Prescott fan, He is my teams QB and I want him to be the best. I have never said he is elite. Personally I don't believe in Elite

To me its an argument I don't care to waste my time on. I don't believe Mike or Lebron is Best. I don't believe Barry Bonds or Mark McGuire were the best hitters

It's a casual fans argument as far as I'm concerned

None of us need to look at stats to determine whether or not we're watching a good, very good, or great player. Romo never won crap, but I didn't sit there and think, man, this quarterback is holding us back. Dak is what he is, a slightly above average player. One could say he is a little better than that, ok, but I don't see from him what I saw from Joe Montana, Peyton Manning, or Dan Marino. Regardless of SBs.

 

[movaughn88]

Not sure how many people think he’s elite, I think that’s a very small minority of fans. Most people say 6-10/8-12 range.

The loudest battles on here come from people responding to people who think he’s bad or people who think he’s elite. The fringe opinions are what create the harsh arguments. Most of us are centered and think he’s a 8-10ish guy give or take a few spots.

That's a fair assessment. I'm more in the 6-10 range but can't holler all over anyone in the 8-12 grouping.

Here's the thing though...let's just put him at #9 for giggles. Brady retired so next year he's #8.

There is a vocal minority on this board that want to SEND THE 8TH BEST QB IN THE NFL into the wastebin! Cut. Gone. Just reroll a 5-10% chance of drafting one who might be better. Madness. Or trade massive draft capital for someone like Wilson who is only marginally better.

And before anyone squawks about his contract. Every QB in the top 10 from here on out will get paid more than Dak.

 

[Calvin2Tony2Emmitt2Julius]

Let's say Dak is ranked at 8 , for the sake of discussion. That would put him in the top 25% of the league. Top 25% of 32 teams.

Now you tell me, In what parallel universe is that average or slightly better than average?