Well well well. Mayer still available

Sydla

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cnuball21 said:
Gibbs at 12 might be the worst pick of the 1st.

They have a 1st rounder in Swift and didn’t they just sign the dude from CHI?

Woof.
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I don't know, coming back and taking Campbell at 18 was kinda weird to me.
 
Spottswoode

Spottswoode

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OR, maybe Detroit wanted those players and felt there were other teams in play behind them. If they would have checked the internet consensus boards, they would have known better.

I’d be willing to bet they were confident Campbell wouldn’t last to pick 34. I would also bet that they had concerns about a few teams closer behind pick 18. Likely similar concerns with Gibbs at 12.

This positional value being the sole driver of picks is silly. If a team wants a player, they are going to take that player in an area they value him whether it is a G like Skoronski at #11, a RB like Bijan at #8 or Gibbs at #12, or a TE like Kincaid at #25. The goal of the team is to improve, not to make salary cap management decisions 5 years in advance.
 

Sydla

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Spottswoode said:
OR, maybe Detroit wanted those players and felt there were other teams in play behind them. If they would have checked the internet consensus boards, they would have known better.

I’d be willing to bet they were confident Campbell wouldn’t last to pick 34. I would also bet that they had concerns about a few teams closer behind pick 18. Likely similar concerns with Gibbs at 12.

This positional value being the sole driver of picks is silly. If a team wants a player, they are going to take that player in an area they value him whether it is a G like Skoronski at #11, a RB like Bijan at #8 or Gibbs at #12, or a TE like Kincaid at #25. The goal of the team is to improve, not to make salary cap management decisions 5 years in advance.
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I wouldn't say it's the sole driver of picks but reality is, in a capped world, there clearly is value in certain positions relative to others. And it's not about just what you might have to pay that guy 3-4-5 years down the road.

Take TB. The league clearly shows you can build great run games with spare parts if you have other pieces in place. The AAV for a first round TB taken in the late teens now would rank in the Top 20 of all TB AAVs across the league. Now take an OT. A first round OT in the late teens has an AAV that would only rank in the Top 70 or so. So which is better value, including from a cap perspective? Cleary the OT. If I hit on my OT, I have a guy that I am getting great production from for a fraction of the cost relative to what I might have to spend to fill that hole with a vet. Conversely, if I hit on the TB at say 18, I am still paying a premium for that guy relative to other TBs in the league.
 

cnuball21

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Spottswoode said:
OR, maybe Detroit wanted those players and felt there were other teams in play behind them. If they would have checked the internet consensus boards, they would have known better.

I’d be willing to bet they were confident Campbell wouldn’t last to pick 34. I would also bet that they had concerns about a few teams closer behind pick 18. Likely similar concerns with Gibbs at 12.

This positional value being the sole driver of picks is silly. If a team wants a player, they are going to take that player in an area they value him whether it is a G like Skoronski at #11, a RB like Bijan at #8 or Gibbs at #12, or a TE like Kincaid at #25. The goal of the team is to improve, not to make salary cap management decisions 5 years in advance.
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Yep - they liked their guys and they took them. But in no universe is having 2 1st round RBs and a 6 million FA RB a good recipe for success.

Detroit didn’t have issues scoring points last year but their defense was a dumpster fire. Even if you don’t believe in positional value not taking Gonzalez or their best defender available is wild.
 
Spottswoode

Spottswoode

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Sydla said:
I wouldn't say it's the sole driver of picks but reality is, in a capped world, there clearly is value in certain positions relative to others. And it's not about just what you might have to pay that guy 3-4-5 years down the road.

Take TB. The league clearly shows you can build great run games with spare parts if you have other pieces in place. The AAV for a first round TB taken in the late teens now would rank in the Top 20 of all TB AAVs across the league. Now take an OT. A first round OT in the late teens has an AAV that would only rank in the Top 70 or so. So which is better value, including from a cap perspective? Cleary the OT. If I hit on my OT, I have a guy that I am getting great production from for a fraction of the cost relative to what I might have to spend to fill that hole with a vet. Conversely, if I hit on the TB at say 18, I am still paying a premium for that guy relative to other TBs in the league.
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I understand that. And yet, 2 RB’s were taken in the top 12. Internet boards and TV talking heads are much more obsessed with “value position” focused draft strategies than the teams. McCarthy and the coached are concerned with improving the team and winning now, not in 5 years. If they don’t show progress, they will be sitting on the couch eating Cheetos when their contracts are up.
 

cnuball21

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Sydla said:
I wouldn't say it's the sole driver of picks but reality is, in a capped world, there clearly is value in certain positions relative to others. And it's not about just what you might have to pay that guy 3-4-5 years down the road.

Take TB. The league clearly shows you can build great run games with spare parts if you have other pieces in place. The AAV for a first round TB taken in the late teens now would rank in the Top 20 of all TB AAVs across the league. Now take an OT. A first round OT in the late teens has an AAV that would only rank in the Top 70 or so. So which is better value, including from a cap perspective? Cleary the OT. If I hit on my OT, I have a guy that I am getting great production from for a fraction of the cost relative to what I might have to spend to fill that hole with a vet. Conversely, if I hit on the TB at say 18, I am still paying a premium for that guy relative to other TBs in the league.
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Well said
 
Rockport

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CATCH17 said:
I felt all along he looked like a 2nd round prospect. The lack of athleticism was a major red flag.

Glad to see he’s still available..

The cherry on top would be if the NFL take Laporta over him who probably has more upside.

So glad we passed on him. Even for a 2 down run stuffer that was a waste of a 1st rounder.
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Well, well well, Parsons is still on the team and is a game changer while Mahomes is winning SB’s. You’re still crapping on these guys.
 
Spottswoode

Spottswoode

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cnuball21 said:
Yep - they liked their guys and they took them. But in no universe is having 2 1st round RBs and a 6 million FA RB a good recipe for success.

Detroit didn’t have issues scoring points last year but their defense was a dumpster fire. Even if you don’t believe in positional value not taking Gonzalez or their best defender available is wild.
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You should be crowned the king of hot sports opinions. I’m not sure why every team just doesn’t cut their scouting staffs and consult with you. Have you always been the smartest guy in the room?

The only thing you know about Detroit is what is fed to you. To think you know more about Detroit’s team needs and direction than Dan Campbell and his staff is laughable. You’ve drank your own Kool-aid too long and it’s given you a permanent sugar high.
 

cnuball21

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Spottswoode said:
You should be crowned the king of hot sports opinions. I’m not sure why every team just doesn’t cut their scouting staffs and consult with you. Have you always been the smartest guy in the room?

The only thing you know about Detroit is what is fed to you. To think you know more about Detroit’s team needs and direction than Dan Campbell and his staff is laughable. You’ve drank your own Kool-aid too long and it’s given you a permanent sugar high.
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Have you ever thought of just ignoring my posts and not responding?
 
beware_d-ware

beware_d-ware

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Gibbs at #12 is still wild to me. T
Sydla said:
I wouldn't say it's the sole driver of picks but reality is, in a capped world, there clearly is value in certain positions relative to others. And it's not about just what you might have to pay that guy 3-4-5 years down the road.

Take TB. The league clearly shows you can build great run games with spare parts if you have other pieces in place. The AAV for a first round TB taken in the late teens now would rank in the Top 20 of all TB AAVs across the league. Now take an OT. A first round OT in the late teens has an AAV that would only rank in the Top 70 or so. So which is better value, including from a cap perspective? Cleary the OT. If I hit on my OT, I have a guy that I am getting great production from for a fraction of the cost relative to what I might have to spend to fill that hole with a vet. Conversely, if I hit on the TB at say 18, I am still paying a premium for that guy relative to other TBs in the league.
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This.

In a league where every team has the same amount of money to spend, the biggest advantage you can have is locking in players under their true market value.
 

Sydla

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Spottswoode said:
I understand that. And yet, 2 RB’s were taken in the top 12. Internet boards and TV talking heads are much more obsessed with “value position” focused draft strategies than the teams. McCarthy and the coached are concerned with improving the team and winning now, not in 5 years. If they don’t show progress, they will be sitting on the couch eating Cheetos when their contracts are up.
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Two RBs were taken in the first 12 picks by teams that frankly aren't thought of as smart or successful teams. Philly has a need for a big threat at TB and could have made a move for either Robinson or taken Gibbs. They passed. Because they are smart, well run, and their GM understands the cap, relative cost, etc. better than most GMs.

Detroit is even stranger because they signed a FA TB and used a first round pick on a TB a few years ago. And then did it again.
 
Mac_MaloneV1

Mac_MaloneV1

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Spottswoode said:
You should be crowned the king of hot sports opinions. I’m not sure why every team just doesn’t cut their scouting staffs and consult with you. Have you always been the smartest guy in the room?

The only thing you know about Detroit is what is fed to you. To think you know more about Detroit’s team needs and direction than Dan Campbell and his staff is laughable. You’ve drank your own Kool-aid too long and it’s given you a permanent sugar high.
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It's not that Dan Campbell doesn't know his team needs its that Dan Campbell's priorities for what the team needs is wrong. I don't care if Gibbs and Campbell are All-Pros, that's horrible value in the first round, especially when you traded down from a spot where you could have taken a premier player at a premier position.
 
Spottswoode

Spottswoode

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Sydla said:
Two RBs were taken in the first 12 picks by teams that frankly aren't thought of as smart or successful teams. Philly has a need for a big threat at TB and could have made a move for either Robinson or taken Gibbs. They passed. Because they are smart, well run, and their GM understands the cap, relative cost, etc. better than most GMs.

Detroit is even stranger because they signed a FA TB and used a first round pick on a TB a few years ago. And then did it again.
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Just to be clear, what you are saying is the reason why a team drafted different than your value position fixation is because they are dumb? Same with a G at #11 and a TE at #25.
 
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