Why hasn't Dez signed yet

SloMo_Joe

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All Dez is going to receive is a one or two year base contract with a lot of incentives.....
That is all he deserves until he shows he is putting forth the effort to perfect his craft. Better route running, better timing, and better concentration. When he does that then he can ask for guarantees.
 

kskboys

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Cut Zac Martin in the morning and he would be resigned by the end of the day.

Cut Dez and you can make fun of his inability to get signed for an eternity. It must be really hard for the Dez Fan Bois right now.
Teams would be cap strapping themselves and pushing money down the road w/ restructures to get Martin under the cap.
 

Cap12

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[QUOTE="Verdict, post: 8077698, member: 381"]Dez is considered a piss poor receiver, who runs bad routes, has a ten cent brain, a mental midget and a cancer. It was a very good comparison which is why I made it.

Zac Martin wouod get scooped up tomorrow because teams want him. Dez can't get siigjed in 10 days because no on wants him.[/QUOTE]

Wow... your Dez hate is remarkable. It blinds you to the facts and stats that tell another story. You don't get to be among the franchise leaders in virtually every receiving stat if you are as bad as you say he is. Dez didn't start looking average until Dak showed up. Coincidence?
 

Fla Cowpoke

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All things being equal, no one pays Watkins more than Dez...simply because Watkins is still all about potential. All things being equal, no one pays Hurns more than Dez.

Hurns is a productive receiver with no baggage other than some injury concerns. Dez is a productive receiver with that has lots of baggage, whose bad three years coincide with some significant FACTS. In 2015, he broke his foot with a very bad injury for a receiver and tried to come back too soon, coupled with the loss of Romo. In 2016, he was playing with a rookie QB that was playing a limited offense in a run heavy scheme and missed a few games with injury. In 2017, the QB play actually regressed as the QB was faced with having to do more and the running game failed. So far Dak has not been able to show that he can use Bryant in the ways that he is most effective and the coaching staff as well has not concentrated on getting Dez the ball in the situations where he is a tough cover, such as slants, posts and dig routes. When a guy that isn't a speed receiver is running 9 routes on probably half his snaps it makes no sense.

Dez surely is not without blame, as he had issues with concentration and has not been as explosive and spectacular. Jump ball type situations were almost a guaranteed catch for years with Dez, but now they aren't even 50-50. He lets DB's get in his head and get him out of the game.

Dez numbers the last few years suggest his market value should be around 10m a year based on the pure production and comparison to deals other receivers signed. So I would suggest that a number close to that would be where he probably will sign. That doesn't really consider him taking a deal for less in order to get into a situation he feels is the best. What is interesting is whether he ultimately ends up looking at the big picture and goes to a team which gives him the best chance to get to a Super Bowl, or whether he goes to a spot where he thinks he has the best chance to show the Cowboys they screwed up. That is not necessarily the same team.
 

Verdict

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All things being equal, no one pays Watkins more than Dez...simply because Watkins is still all about potential. All things being equal, no one pays Hurns more than Dez.

Hurns is a productive receiver with no baggage other than some injury concerns. Dez is a productive receiver with that has lots of baggage, whose bad three years coincide with some significant FACTS. In 2015, he broke his foot with a very bad injury for a receiver and tried to come back too soon, coupled with the loss of Romo. In 2016, he was playing with a rookie QB that was playing a limited offense in a run heavy scheme and missed a few games with injury. In 2017, the QB play actually regressed as the QB was faced with having to do more and the running game failed. So far Dak has not been able to show that he can use Bryant in the ways that he is most effective and the coaching staff as well has not concentrated on getting Dez the ball in the situations where he is a tough cover, such as slants, posts and dig routes. When a guy that isn't a speed receiver is running 9 routes on probably half his snaps it makes no sense.

Dez surely is not without blame, as he had issues with concentration and has not been as explosive and spectacular. Jump ball type situations were almost a guaranteed catch for years with Dez, but now they aren't even 50-50. He lets DB's get in his head and get him out of the game.

Dez numbers the last few years suggest his market value should be around 10m a year based on the pure production and comparison to deals other receivers signed. So I would suggest that a number close to that would be where he probably will sign. That doesn't really consider him taking a deal for less in order to get into a situation he feels is the best. What is interesting is whether he ultimately ends up looking at the big picture and goes to a team which gives him the best chance to get to a Super Bowl, or whether he goes to a spot where he thinks he has the best chance to show the Cowboys they screwed up. That is not necessarily the same team.

I understand you are discussing the pros and cons and attempting to fairly establish a value for Dez. I believe that you are overstating Dez' value compared to Watkins and Hurns. Granted it is impossible to definitively know how much of Dez' diminished valuation is based on Dez' performance, how much is on his baggage/antictics/mental migetry and how much of it is the timing of his release.

Since teams are signing "problem children" that can still play at a high level all over the NFL, I believe some of you guys are underestimating how poorly Dez has played over the past 3 years and how large of a factor that is.

If we did not significantly overinflate his stats by forcing the ball to him repeatedly his stats would have been shockingly low.
 

Fla Cowpoke

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I understand you are discussing the pros and cons and attempting to fairly establish a value for Dez. I believe that you are overstating Dez' value compared to Watkins and Hurns. Granted it is impossible to definitively know how much of Dez' diminished valuation is based on Dez' performance, how much is on his baggage/antictics/mental migetry and how much of it is the timing of his release.

Since teams are signing "problem children" that can still play at a high level all over the NFL, I believe some of you guys are underestimating how poorly Dez has played over the past 3 years and how large of a factor that is.

If we did not significantly overinflate his stats by forcing the ball to him repeatedly his stats would have been shockingly low.

For the record, while I am a Dez fan, I am completely fine with the move. I am certainly not "butt hurt" about it and can see the benefits to the team, from the salary cap ramifications to the team atmosphere. I definitely think we can get out of Hurns what we got from Dez last year. I think in Hurns you are getting the best he has to offer if he duplicates what he has done the past couple years. I think in Dez there is still the potential to be much more if he stays healthy.

I hate the perception that we HAVE to draft a WR early and I hope the team doesn't fall into that trap. I really don't think there is any first year receiver that is going to come in and light the world on fire, especially in our offense. We will still be run first and we still aren't going to be overly creative in our passing attack. We are going to need improved play from Dak.

I think we would be much better served with our premium picks to get two players that are basically sure starters. To me, that means a G, and we should have a shot to get either Wynn or Hernandez in the first, and a LB in the second, like Josey Jewell, an Iowa LB that has a lot of similarities to the last Iowa LB we drafted. Some might say too high for Jewell but Brugler has him at 61 overall, which isnt a huge reach from our spot. We might be able to trade down some and pick up another pick or we might be able to move up for him from the third. I would be very happy with a trade down and getting Wynn or Hernandez, and then getting Jewell and maybe a WR like Chark or Miller with our first three picks.
 

Cap12

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I understand you are discussing the pros and cons and attempting to fairly establish a value for Dez. I believe that you are overstating Dez' value compared to Watkins and Hurns. Granted it is impossible to definitively know how much of Dez' diminished valuation is based on Dez' performance, how much is on his baggage/antictics/mental migetry and how much of it is the timing of his release.

Since teams are signing "problem children" that can still play at a high level all over the NFL, I believe some of you guys are underestimating how poorly Dez has played over the past 3 years and how large of a factor that is.

If we did not significantly overinflate his stats by forcing the ball to him repeatedly his stats would have been shockingly low.
A big part of Dez's decline in production is due to Dak. Outside of his 6 drops, most of Dez's unsuccessful targets were due to Dak throw aways or passes that were late or off target. Did Dez get upset and overreact when this happened? Yeah. That does not make it his fault when Dak was late or off target though.
 

Cap12

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For the record, while I am a Dez fan, I am completely fine with the move. I am certainly not "butt hurt" about it and can see the benefits to the team, from the salary cap ramifications to the team atmosphere. I definitely think we can get out of Hurns what we got from Dez last year. I think in Hurns you are getting the best he has to offer if he duplicates what he has done the past couple years. I think in Dez there is still the potential to be much more if he stays healthy.

I hate the perception that we HAVE to draft a WR early and I hope the team doesn't fall into that trap. I really don't think there is any first year receiver that is going to come in and light the world on fire, especially in our offense. We will still be run first and we still aren't going to be overly creative in our passing attack. We are going to need improved play from Dak.

I think we would be much better served with our premium picks to get two players that are basically sure starters. To me, that means a G, and we should have a shot to get either Wynn or Hernandez in the first, and a LB in the second, like Josey Jewell, an Iowa LB that has a lot of similarities to the last Iowa LB we drafted. Some might say too high for Jewell but Brugler has him at 61 overall, which isnt a huge reach from our spot. We might be able to trade down some and pick up another pick or we might be able to move up for him from the third. I would be very happy with a trade down and getting Wynn or Hernandez, and then getting Jewell and maybe a WR like Chark or Miller with our first three picks.

I wouldn't mind a G, but think we can do better with a LB (I'd like Evans, but would settle for VDE). Of course, I'd be happy to give up 50 for to get either Smith or Edmunds if they fall or even D. James. At any rate, it is unlikely that any WR we draft this season will impact the team greatly this year (regardless of round).
 

Jipper

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[QUOTE="Verdict, post: 8077698, member: 381"]Dez is considered a piss poor receiver, who runs bad routes, has a ten cent brain, a mental midget and a cancer. It was a very good comparison which is why I made it.

Zac Martin wouod get scooped up tomorrow because teams want him. Dez can't get siigjed in 10 days because no on wants him.

Wow... your Dez hate is remarkable. It blinds you to the facts and stats that tell another story. You don't get to be among the franchise leaders in virtually every receiving stat if you are as bad as you say he is. Dez didn't start looking average until Dak showed up. Coincidence?[/QUOTE]

Dez was also jured when dak showed up, he never recovered completly....is that daks fault too?

Calling some one a Dez hater then you do the same with dak....a bit hypocritical
 

Verdict

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A big part of Dez's decline in production is due to Dak. Outside of his 6 drops, most of Dez's unsuccessful targets were due to Dak throw aways or passes that were late or off target. Did Dez get upset and overreact when this happened? Yeah. That does not make it his fault when Dak was late or off target though.

It doesn't appear that very many NFL teams agree with your assessment. If they bought into that narrative he would have been signed by a mega contract by now.
 

Verdict

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Wow... your Dez hate is remarkable. It blinds you to the facts and stats that tell another story. You don't get to be among the franchise leaders in virtually every receiving stat if you are as bad as you say he is. Dez didn't start looking average until Dak showed up. Coincidence?

[Quote Dez was also jured when dak showed up, he never recovered completly....is that daks fault too?Calling some one a Dez hater then you do the same with dak....a bit hypocritical[/QUOTE]

Dez has sucked for three years. It doesn't matter if he was Superman before that. He sucks NOW. Stop living in the past.

I'm neutral on Dak. I think he may be the leader of the franchise. He may not.

What Dak does or doesn't do really has no bearing on Dez failing to get open.

Keep in mind that the narrative that Dez is open even when he is not open only emerged because Dez was never open to begin with.
 

Verdict

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Wow... your Dez hate is remarkable. It blinds you to the facts and stats that tell another story. You don't get to be among the franchise leaders in virtually every receiving stat if you are as bad as you say he is. Dez didn't start looking average until Dak showed up. Coincidence?

Dez was also jured when dak showed up, he never recovered completly....is that daks fault too?

Calling some one a Dez hater then you do the same with dak....a bit hypocritical[/QUOTE]

It's funny how you guys always want to blame Dak for Dez' ineptness. It's comical.
 

kskboys

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The blame is on both Dak and Dez. I think most people know that, but the polar bears are insisting that it's on one or the other. Dak missed some throws, Dez dropped some passes and ran the wrong route at times. Both.
 

CyberB0b

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A big part of Dez's decline in production is due to Dak. Outside of his 6 drops, most of Dez's unsuccessful targets were due to Dak throw aways or passes that were late or off target. Did Dez get upset and overreact when this happened? Yeah. That does not make it his fault when Dak was late or off target though.
I see an aging receiver who has had multiple lower body injuries as he enters his 30s
 

Fla Cowpoke

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Dez was also jured when dak showed up, he never recovered completly....is that daks fault too?

Calling some one a Dez hater then you do the same with dak....a bit hypocritical

It's funny how you guys always want to blame Dak for Dez' ineptness. It's comical.[/QUOTE]

Well, since Dez has shown to be anything but inept with a legit NFL QB, I don't think it is unfair to question Dak's ability as a QB. He is young and hopefully improving however.
 

ESisback

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The blame is on both Dak and Dez. I think most people know that, but the polar bears are insisting that it's on one or the other. Dak missed some throws, Dez dropped some passes and ran the wrong route at times. Both.
This is it! Right here!
 

Verdict

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The blame is on both Dak and Dez. I think most people know that, but the polar bears are insisting that it's on one or the other. Dak missed some throws, Dez dropped some passes and ran the wrong route at times. Both.

The total production may be on both. But you can't blame Dak for Dez' poor route running, Dez drop rate, Dez mental migetry, Dez' meltdowns, Dez lawsuits, Dez' need for a babysitter or any number of other things
 

kskboys

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The total production may be on both. But you can't blame Dak for Dez' poor route running, Dez drop rate, Dez mental migetry, Dez' meltdowns, Dez lawsuits, Dez' need for a babysitter or any number of other things
That's why I said it was both.

Dak has some work to do, but the promise is definitely there.
 
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