Dak vs. Romo - Deep passing

[erod]

Good stuff, except you are underrating his arm strength. He has a "live arm" and throws the ball w/ good zip.

Agree w/ everything else.

His zip is nowhere near Romo's, and I only thought Romo was above average, not elite, in that category. His specialty was accuracy and touch.

Dak has to wind up for velocity, and it makes his throws wobbly and inaccurate. When he rolls out, he can throw his body into it, and coverage breaks down so he can throw it up for wide open receivers to go get.

 

[Northern_Cowboy]

Their signature stats say that he is mediocre. Their deep ball project includes 15-20 yard passes which is asinine as it is obviously intermediate. It also does not consider how Dak has to alter his mechanics on longer throws.

And you pick and choose PFF's subjective calls. On the one hand, what is catchable, what is a drop, etc that I was pointing out to you in the beginning is fine. Their grades are not although they used the accuracy metric that you initially supported and thought was used on their deep ball stats. Obvious bias is obvious.

I agree they say he is mediocre but only for 2017, he was above average in 2016, that is the problem with this exercise, we only have 2 seasons and they were very much different. After this season we will know who we have in Dak

 

[FuzzyLumpkins]

I agree they say he is mediocre but only for 2017, he was above average in 2016, that is the problem with this exercise, we only have 2 seasons and they were very much different. After this season we will know who we have in Dak

That is fair. I'm willing to think it is a sophomore slump but Dak struggled to place balls and his accuracy was at best described as erratic last season.

 

[Sarge]

Here are some other QB's and their stats from last season (2017) as far as throwing the ball 10+ downfield


Brady 190 times out of 581 attempts.....32.7%
Rivers 194 times out of 575 attempts....33.7%
Stafford 173 times out of 565 attempts...30.6%
Brees 123 times out of 536 attempts....22.9% (see note at the bottom about him)
Big Ben 217 out of 561 attempts...38.6%
Matt Ryan 161 out of 529 attempts...30.4%
Cousins..154 out of 540 attempts...28.5%
Wilson..185 out of 553 attempts..33.4%
Goff....142 out of 447 attempts 30.9%
Wentz...160 out of 44 attempts..36.3%
Dak....136 out of490 attempts..27.2%


* It would seem Dak does throw the ball (at least as far as last year) downfield much less than other QB's do.
** I found Brees' number to be quite low so i went back and looked at his numbers from 2010-2016 and they were 35.1%, 33%, 32.3%, 33.7%, 29.1%, 28.3%, 23.7% and last year 22.9%. Drew Brees is now 39 years old and it would seem by those numbers that maybe he is not able to throw the ball downfield as much as he use too, there has been a steady decline the last 2-3 seasons

Drew Brees now has a sick running game. Doesn't have the need to throw deep as in years prior.

 

[Northern_Cowboy]

Drew Brees now has a sick running game. Doesn't have the need to throw deep as in years prior.

Her has it now did he have it 3-4 years ago? There is a pattern in the numbers i posted. I just think as he has gotten older he can't throw downfield as much as he use to

 

[Sarge]

Her has it now did he have it 3-4 years ago? There is a pattern in the numbers i posted. I just think as he has gotten older he can't throw downfield as much as he use to

He was hurt two (or three) years ago. Shoulder injury and admittedly could not throw deep that year. It's probably a combination of everything.

 

[Northern_Cowboy]

He was hurt two (or three) years ago. Shoulder injury and admittedly could not throw deep that year. It's probably a combination of everything.

Could be, either way there is a decline for whatever reason

 

[HungryLion]

Could be, either way there is a decline for whatever reason

Brees’ lack of size may be impacting him now that he has gotten older. What I mean is, the taller, bigger QB’s have an easier time throwing the ball deep. Brees’ arm strength might be coming down a bit with his age since he doesn’t have that advantage.

That being said his accuracy is still pinpoint laser.

 

[kskboys]

His zip is nowhere near Romo's, and I only thought Romo was above average, not elite, in that category. His specialty was accuracy and touch.

Dak has to wind up for velocity, and it makes his throws wobbly and inaccurate. When he rolls out, he can throw his body into it, and coverage breaks down so he can throw it up for wide open receivers to go get.

We're not going to agree on this one. I think you're referring to the times coverage broke down and he threw off his back foot, something that needs correcting.

 

[kskboys]

Drew Brees now has a sick running game. Doesn't have the need to throw deep as in years prior.

The one year Brees won the super bowl, he threw for fewer yards than in the years surrounding.

 

[HungryLion]

The one year Brees won the super bowl, he threw for fewer yards than in the years surrounding.

I believe his defense led the league in turnovers that season they won the super bowl. That could be part of the effect. No need to air it out as often when the defense is giving you short fields to work with.

 

[erod]

We're not going to agree on this one. I think you're referring to the times coverage broke down and he threw off his back foot, something that needs correcting.

He's just terrible in the pocket, pure and simple. Apparently we're about to see much more of the college RPO offense he ran at miss state.

 

[Toruk_Makto]

Well, for accuracy, he could have tied for 17th last year. But both of those are out of many more than 32 qualifying quarterbacks. He was in the top half last year out of 41 quarterbacks. Not that IAY really means anything skill-wise when Aaron Rodgers and Drew Brees ranked 38th and 39th out of 41.

Wish we had data for Romo.

 

[zerofill]

Drew Brees now has a sick running game. Doesn't have the need to throw deep as in years prior.

Which is what makes him all the more deadly. You can not stack the box with Brees no team is that brave.

 

[zerofill]

I agree they say he is mediocre but only for 2017, he was above average in 2016, that is the problem with this exercise, we only have 2 seasons and they were very much different. After this season we will know who we have in Dak

I agree... This is the season that should tell us who Dak is... he either is the franchise QB or he isn't. Enough pieces have been shuffled around to make it Dak friendly. Looks like Tyron will be back to normal hopefully. Zeke will be back there, he has a new receiver crew. This is the telling season. This should determine his status as the face of the franchise after this season. 3 years as the starter, you will know what you have, and what you don't.

 

[Aviano90]

Which is what makes him all the more deadly. You can not stack the box with Brees no team is that brave.

Last year Mark Ingram faced stacked boxes on 42% of his rushing attempts. For comparison purposes, Zeke faced a stack box 35% of his attempts.

 

[zerofill]

Last year Mark Ingram faced stacked boxes on 42% of his rushing attempts. For comparison purposes, Zeke faced a stack box 35% of his attempts.

How any of those 42% stacked boxes did Brees make them pay? And how many of those were 1st down plays, etc? Does it show that anywhere? Just curious.

 

[Aviano90]

How any of those 42% stacked boxes did Brees make them pay? And how many of those were 1st down plays, etc? Does it show that anywhere? Just curious.

Not sure.

 

[zerofill]

Not sure.

I know I sure wouldn't want to stack the box with him... even if you beat him up it doesn't typically phase him mentally.

 

[SuspectCorner]

Late-career Romo was a Jedi compared to the #9 who got his first start. I believe Dak is comparable to Romo in his salad days as the young starter - and Romo was in his fourth season when that occurred.

Patience. Visible progress. Realistic expectations. Give Dak a fair opportunity to develop. It's difficult for the typical fan.