Zeke’s PFF Grade Explained

[mattjames2010]

At some point you need to realize spamming this just shows you really have no counter argument.

 

[McKDaddy]

Or coached an NFL team..... or built and NFL roster ..... or owned an NFL team.... etc... etc...

True, but Einstein never went to space yet was able to figure out many things about space, time and the forces of the universe. I've seen people petting full grown lions. I've never been upclose & personal with a lion but I am able to figure out it isn't a good idea without a whole lot of steel or glass between us regardless of what someone who has petted one might tell me.

Point is, its more important to be able to weed out psuedo facts from real facts and then make logical conclusions from those facts. PFF makes an article out of a mix of psuedo facts and facts and hey it sounds reasonable until you balance it against reality. Zeke was ranked by his peers as the 7th best player in the league after his rookie season. 54th after the suspension shortened sophomore season. And i would suspect somewhere between those two spots when the next rankings are revealed. He has led the league in rushing two of the three years & likely would have or been very close in his 2nd season if not for the suspension bull crap. You don't do those things in the NFL as the 30th best back. He is universally regarded as a top 3 RB and many would argue that he is the best all around back. To rank him 30th among running backs is a demonstration as to why PFF has lost credibility.

 

[Clarkson]

PFF is a bunch of dudes who have never played football grading people who play football... Not my cup of tea but hey to each their own.

most sports franchises are run by people who never played the game.
playing the game gives little incite into player eval.

*not saying PFF is great*

 

[mattjames2010]

True, but Einstein never went to space yet was able to figure out many things about space, time and the forces of the universe. I've seen people petting full grown lions. I've never been upclose & personal with a lion but I am able to figure out it isn't a good idea without a whole lot of steel or glass between us regardless of what someone who has petted one might tell me.

Point is, its more important to be able to weed out psuedo facts from real facts and then make logical conclusions from those facts. PFF makes an article out of a mix of psuedo facts and facts and hey it sounds reasonable until you balance it against reality. Zeke was ranked by his peers as the 7th best player in the league after his rookie season. 54th after the suspension shortened sophomore season. And i would suspect somewhere between those two spots when the next rankings are revealed. He has led the league in rushing two of the three years & likely would have or been very close in his 2nd season if not for the suspension bull crap. You don't do those things in the NFL as the 30th best back. He is universally regarded as a top 3 RB and many would argue that he is the best all around back. To rank him 30th among running backs is a demonstration as to why PFF has lost credibility.

Zeke had 50+ more carries than the RB behind him. That's why he led the league in rushing - if Barkley had similar carries, he would have topped Zeke.

And when did 1,400 rushing yards become spectacular? When did getting 6 rushing TDs on 300+ TDs become anything more than mediocre?

What exactly did Zeke do in 2018 that makes you think he was anything more than just a good RB with large amount of carries?

 

[Super_Kazuya]

Well they explained their thinking, whether you want to accept it or not is on you. But they did explain it quite thoroughly.
To me the explanation seems to be “Zeke runs through big holes created by the OL” which at a glance reviewing the games is not a crazy statement. For me it boils down to how much does Elliott’s vision and ability to cut back factor in to getting to those holes? I definitely believe in the concept of the replaceable RB but there are many things difficult to quantify.

 

[gimmesix]

Have at it, everyone

https://www.profootballfocus.com/ne...as-cowboys-rb-ezekiel-elliotts-2018-pff-grade

I get the feeling they would have ranked Emmitt Smith in his prime as low as they rank Elliott because of the argument that he should get more yards because of his offensive line.

 

[windward]

I get the feeling they would have ranked Emmitt Smith in his prime as low as they rank Elliott because of the argument that he should get more yards because of his offensive line.

“Sure Emmitt’s good, but let me tell you why Charlie Garner is better”

 

[kskboys]

I get the feeling they would have ranked Emmitt Smith in his prime as low as they rank Elliott because of the argument that he should get more yards because of his offensive line.

Emmit was not a tackle breaker and often when down on first contact and was not a long HR threat at all.

 

[aria]

I have no problem with your opinion. But I will find fault with anyone who excludes Zeke as one of the best. If he is not in the discussion there is a problem with whatever formula your using, that was my point.

For the record, I do think he’s top 3, maybe even top 2 with Barkley being 1. Obviously that can change year to year based on several factors.

 

[jterrell]

this is the problem with pff, lol. a bunch of metrics that do not really correlate to anything jammed together blindly to create a score.

zeke is the BEST in between tackles runner in the NFL and he faces the most loaded boxes as teams know DAL wants to be run first.
as for breaking tackles... lolololol. that is truly rubbish.
zeke is hard to tackle and delivers blows falling forward on contact which do not count as forcing a missed tackle in their metric but do very much count as an extra couple yards gained per play.

a guy like kamara may make more people miss but kamara was also knocked so silly by jaylon smith that he went MIA.
zeke eats those type of hits and takes 2 plays off.

 

[beware_d-ware]

Saquon had many, many more receptions than Zeke so it could be argued he actually had a higher workload and our injured O line was still light years better then the Giants starting O line. They also had a middling passing game since Odiva was out a good portion of the season.

Zeke: 304 rushes, 77 catches, 381 total touches
Saquon: 261 rushes, 91 catches, 352 total touches.

Zeke had about an extra game and a half worth of touches versus Barkley.

 

[Toruk_Makto]

I'm just guessing, but it seems like we ran out of "11" personnel more often later in the season, which would bring down the percentage of total runs with 8+ in the box.

The difference is that I'd at least try to make sense. But then, I'm not rushing to put out product.
https://cowboyszone.com/threads/pffs-top-rated-qbs-through-2-weeks.357474/page-2#post-6839142
https://cowboyszone.com/threads/pffs-top-rated-qbs-through-2-weeks.357474/page-2#post-6841335

What happens is that people largely would agree with PFF rankings but focus on outliers.

Also you can have a great traditional passer rating and play poorly. Just this past year on Monday night Mariota had a "perfect" passer rating. If you watched that game and thought he played well I have a bridge to sell you.

But fundamentally at odds is to state "PFF is great data collection but terrible player rankings."

Given that PFF's data collection is inherently qualitative...what was a pressure....what was catchable....what was accurate....was that a good run block...etc....trusting them to get that qualitative data correct but then to somehow be "oh em gee so worthless" in their rankings is intellectually inconsistent.

 

[beware_d-ware]

What happens is that people largely would agree with PFF rankings but focus on outliers.

Also you can have a great traditional passer rating and play poorly. Just this past year on Monday night Mariota had a "perfect" passer rating. If you watched that game and thought he played well I have a bridge to sell you.

But fundamentally at odds is to state "PFF is great data collection but terrible player rankings."

Given that PFF's data collection is inherently qualitative...what was a pressure....what was catchable....what was accurate....was that a good run block...etc....trusting them to get that qualitative data correct but then to somehow be "oh em gee so worthless" in their rankings is intellectually inconsistent.

Ehhh, I'm no PFF fan, but some of their data is easy to quantify and some of it isn't. Yards per route run - use the box score stats for a WR, divide it by the number of patterns he ran. That one's simple. Pressures can be iffy, but QB hits and sacks are easy to cpimt, and they make up the bulk of the Pass Rush Productivity stat.

Now stuff like "catchable balls" and "yards per cover snap" (if it's zone, who are you covering? Who's a deep safety supposed to cover? etc) gets way more dicey IMO.

 

[aria]

Zeke: 304 rushes, 77 catches, 381 total touches
Saquon: 261 rushes, 91 catches, 352 total touches.

Zeke had about an extra game and a half worth of touches versus Barkley.

Ok, not “many, many more receptions” but still more. So what’s your point? Barkley still had more all purpose yards.

 

[Future]

Zeke gets penalized by PFF for not breaking tackles.

His running style - vision, essentially - is so that he doesn't even get touched.

PFF is dumb, and their evaluation of Zeke is even dumber.

 

[Falco78]

Zeke had 50+ more carries than the RB behind him. That's why he led the league in rushing - if Barkley had similar carries, he would have topped Zeke.

And when did 1,400 rushing yards become spectacular? When did getting 6 rushing TDs on 300+ TDs become anything more than mediocre?

What exactly did Zeke do in 2018 that makes you think he was anything more than just a good RB with large amount of carries?

The fact that teams specifically game planned towards making stopping him their top priority.

 

[Romonater]

The fact that this article has to explain their rating pretty much sums up their fears of what we might think about them as a whole. It shows their system is flawed and judging by the tone of the writer, they know it too.

Zeke Elliott has led the NFL 2 out of 3 years. The year he didn't was due to a suspension and has done so with an erratic qb. Some of you claiming "we shouldn't sign him again" will get a reality check when he leaves and this becomes Prescott's team. I could make a case that Elliott deserves a contract extension more than any other person this offseason.

 

[beware_d-ware]

Ok, not “many, many more receptions” but still more. So what’s your point? Barkley still had more all purpose yards.

"It could be argued Saquon had a higher workload..."

Nope. Not close.

Zeke's receiving usage only blew up in the second half of the season as well, if we used him the first 8 weeks like we did the last 8 weeks he would have cracked 100 catches.

 

[mattjames2010]

The fact that teams specifically game planned towards making stopping him their top priority.

But this is just wrong - and again, you think teams weren't game planning for Barkley? Why was it that he could bust off multiple long runs through the year while Zeke struggled to get 20+?

People pretend like Zeke was seeing 5 guys in the backfield on every play. That simply isn't the truth.

 

[mattjames2010]

The fact that this article has to explain their rating pretty much sums up their fears of what we might think about them as a whole. It shows their system is flawed and judging by the tone of the writer, they know it too.

Zeke Elliott has led the NFL 2 out of 3 years. The year he didn't was due to a suspension and has done so with an erratic qb. Some of you claiming "we shouldn't sign him again" will get a reality check when he leaves and this becomes Prescott's team. I could make a case that Elliott deserves a contract extension more than any other person this offseason.

This is dumb - just because fanboys and your average dopey football fan don't understand grades, doesn't mean their grade is inherently wrong. Take the homer glasses off. 1,400 yards and 6 TDs has never and will never be a spectacular season.