Is Dak a so-called bus driver?

TwentyOne

Well-Known Member
Messages
8,585
Reaction score
4,246
There are 7,530,000,000 people in the world.

There are 32 nfl starting QB's.

There are about 3-5 guys that no one will argue are not bus drivers.

There are about 15 guys that are barely holding on.

There are about 12 guys that are capable of consistently winning if the rest of the talent is right. (Dak, Goff, Wentz, Newton, Watson ect).

There are about 100 people that will read this and wonder what my point is.

There are 25 people that will read this and consider giving me a 'like' but are stingy with their 'likes'.

There is 1 that knows my point and he isnt telling. (me)

Just to put your numbers in perpective: not everybody in the world wants to be a QB and not everybody in the world is competing for that position.
 

jazzcat22

Staff member
Messages
77,217
Reaction score
95,794
CowboysZone ULTIMATE Fan
There are 7,530,000,000 people in the world.

There are 32 nfl starting QB's.

There are about 3-5 guys that no one will argue are not bus drivers.

There are about 15 guys that are barely holding on.

There are about 12 guys that are capable of consistently winning if the rest of the talent is right. (Dak, Goff, Wentz, Newton, Watson ect).

There are about 100 people that will read this and wonder what my point is.

There are 25 people that will read this and consider giving me a 'like' but are stingy with their 'likes'.

There is 1 that knows my point and he isnt telling. (me)

7,530,000,000?
Not 7,753,649,203? I mean what are the odds of it being an exact number? About the same as us winning a SB in 23 years? :lmao2:
 

OmerV

Well-Known Member
Messages
25,864
Reaction score
22,388
CowboysZone ULTIMATE Fan
How do you define "bus driver". I think most would say it's a player who rarely ever carries the team with his arm and relies more on safe passes and a running game to gain yardage and score points.

However, if one followed that by saying that defines Troy Aikman, they likely would backpedal. The reality is, Troy never had a 20 TD season, and he averaged less than 200 yards per game over his career (199.6).

So, that leaves the question of whether there are assets aside from passing stats that can elevate a player above "bus driver" status.

With Aikman, most would point to his leadership, and his demand for excellence and precision and hard work and dedication. He was the man in control and that directed the offense on the field. Dak seems to have some of that, but I can't say it's enough to put him in the same category with Aikman. Dak does put up better passing stats though, and has a better QB rating.

So where does that leave us? For me, I would say Dak is more than a bus driver. What I don't yet know is how far he can take us given the current team, including coaching and players.
 

jazzcat22

Staff member
Messages
77,217
Reaction score
95,794
CowboysZone ULTIMATE Fan
The games without Zeke and before Amari prove me right and you wrong.

Again, whats our record when Zeke gets the ball over 20 time?

It proves nothing. And it is not about being right or wrong.
Last time I checked it is a team sport, not a QB w/l contest.
 

Doomsday101

Well-Known Member
Messages
107,762
Reaction score
39,034
A Bus driver? A person whose job is to get people to their destination while the passengers sit back? Sure why not. I really do not care about a 1 man show I want this team to achieve the team goal of winning the SB and yes I think Dak can be an important part of that goal.
 

TwentyOne

Well-Known Member
Messages
8,585
Reaction score
4,246
Well, what constitutes a QB that isn’t a game manager? Game managers can have good stats too. Let’s see:

1. Just went through all of Dak’s game winning drives. He has never won an NFL game when his team was down 2 scores with 10 min left in the fourth quarter. He only has 1 4th quarter comeback ever when he was down 2 scores, and that’s because his kicker brought it within 1 score right away in the period. So if you can get up by 9-10 points into the 4th quarter, thusfar in his career that is his deathknell.

2. Dak Prescott is 4-7 when the Cowboys don’t rush for 100 yards as a team. For context, Eli Manning has won 6 such games in that timespan. 7 for Andy Dalton. 16 for Matthew Stafford. Nick Foles even had 4 in only 13 starts. Ryan Tannehill has 7(!) despite missing all of 2017. Joe Flacco even has a whopping 9 wins in that span, he’s almost better when he’s forced to throw a lot... many losses with 100+ rushing yards. Just some QBs I commonly see Dak ranked higher than on this site.

3. Dak has a 53.3 QB rating on fourth down in his career. That is easily the worst in the NFL for any Quarterback with at least 30 starts over the last 3 years. Carson Wentz 97.6. Eli Manning 76.8. Andy Dalton 119.7. Joe Flacco 81.6. It’s the only down that’s almost guaranteed to be a pass, and QBs can’t rely on defenses stacking the box. 53.3.

4. Dak’s QB rating when leading? 101. Opponents eat up that I-formation. When trailing? 88.... Russell Wilson has over 100 qb rating when trailing. Think about that. Philip Rivers is 92 for his career while trailing, and he’s had some bad years in there. 107 though last year, staggeringly good. Eli Manning QB rating is the same when he’s trailing or leading. Andy Dalton difference in trailing/leading is half what Dak’s is. Carson Wentz’s is less of a drop than Dak’s is, and his trailing QB ratings were 101 and 96 over the last 2 years after his mediocre rookie year. Tannehill is only a 6 point difference between trailing and leading. Flacco an 8 point difference, also has had some bad years in that career. Dak drops 13 points when he has to take the wheel. Will take me awhile to confirm whether or not that’s unprecedented.

I’m in no way saying it’s confirmed, but it’s not necessarily fair to say the argument doesn’t have a leg to stand on. Think about all the great QBs who don’t have historically good rbs and Olines, and what that might to do skyrocket their stats as well.

Good example that it needs detailed work when it comes to interpreting statistics.

Thanks alot for this. It matches so much more with what you see on TV when he plays.
 

ShiningStar

Well-Known Member
Messages
14,146
Reaction score
7,490
Define a "bus driver"

all qbs are bus drivers, lets face facts, if the NFL does not screw dez and Cowboys do beat the Packers, is this a debate? Dak hasnt been fairlyy used. Dallas thinks it can do with Dak that it did with Romo ad thats nnot fair.
 

Irvin88_4life

Well-Known Member
Messages
22,440
Reaction score
26,292
No not really IMO but hes also not a tier one guy hes top of tier 2 and thats reality.

the issue isnt keeping Dak as our Franchise QB, its what he and his camp FEEL/THINK, they are worth in the outrageous QB market.. IMO hes not worth a penny over 25 and thats being nice..maybe he earns more on his third contract like RW did but hes done squat in true QB stats to get elite top tier money.. IMO hes out of the top 10 slightly so his pay should reflect what the so called market is for 10-15 range QBs.. thats not slight on Dak, its reality..RW took a decent deal for his first big contract and Dak needs to do the same.. if he gets better , A lot better as passer and in the pocket then he will get more.. if he wont give a team friendly deal like Brady did and jump from 800k to 23mil per and not be happy, hes living with Alice down the rabbit hole in Wonderland.. just because hes starting QB thats had some team success, doesnt mean he gets 30mil or more..

im sick of hearing the market, the market is like Homes you are worth the COMPS in your area, Daks comps are not Wilson , and I realize a few teams made mistakes ie Cousins and Carr but the market for dak is top 10-15 pay and that reality..take it or leave it..2020 a good draft for QBs dont be strong armed by someone living in his own mind..

I like dak but feel I like him more at below 25 per, 4 years 100mil, 65 guaranteed and lets see how you progress or NOT..
I agree with you he isn't top 10 yet but i have him around the 12 range. I wouldn't mind 23 a year because anytime you get a player cheaper it's a good thing. Wilson is making 35 a year now i think and QBs like Goff, Mahomes, Wentz etc. are going to get more than Dak. Personally i think Dak gets between 25-28, I'm ok with that as other QBs will get more. 28 is borderline and no way he should get more than that, 28 should be his starting point and we negotiate down from there.
 

Aerolithe_Lion

Well-Known Member
Messages
10,789
Reaction score
11,698
Define a "bus driver"

all qbs are bus drivers, lets face facts, if the NFL does not screw dez and Cowboys do beat the Packers, is this a debate? Dak hasnt been fairlyy used. Dallas thinks it can do with Dak that it did with Romo ad thats nnot fair.

Wasn’t Romo the QB for the non-catch? What does that have to do with Dak? In fact, if Romo won that game, he may have gone to the Suoer Bowl and thus he probably wouldn’t have been benched for Dak at the end of 2016, and may have very well come back for 2017. literally the opposite of your point.
 

cowboyblue22

Well-Known Member
Messages
9,927
Reaction score
8,606
he is not close to a Russell Wilson he is a middle of the road qb who u could win with IF the coaching was up to nfl standard no way he is worth Russell Wilson money but he will get because the jones believe he is the end all be all I think they will regret it but that's just me
 

Doomsday101

Well-Known Member
Messages
107,762
Reaction score
39,034
he is not close to a Russell Wilson he is a middle of the road qb who u could win with IF the coaching was up to nfl standard no way he is worth Russell Wilson money but he will get because the jones believe he is the end all be all I think they will regret it but that's just me

Romo could not win either was that also the coaching standard? I agree in that Dak should not be in line for a deal similar to Wilson. Stephen has already said they will not be paying Dak Rodgers type money which is that is the case then they will not be paying out Wilson money
 

cowboyblue22

Well-Known Member
Messages
9,927
Reaction score
8,606
Romo could not win either was that also the coaching standard? I agree in that Dak should not be in line for a deal similar to Wilson. Stephen has already said they will not be paying Dak Rodgers type money which is that is the case then they will not be paying out Wilson money
the coaching didn't help Romo's cause either
 
Top