How Special is Ezekiel?

Kaiser

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The amazing thing is nobody here has taken the approach of trying to prove why Zeke is special. Instead they simply attack analysis that was calculated for all backs and say "No this doesn't apply to Zeke".... Because... Reasons.

Over the last three years Zeke has 600 more yards rushing than any other player in the NFL, even after missing 8 of the 48 games. He is also a superior receiver and blocker.

You started a thread to say he was "quite average". The burden is on you to prove a laughable statement, not on us to disprove the babblings of an idiot.
 

Beast_from_East

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You’ve heard me say it a million times that I do not want to pay a RB. I do not believe in it. It is the least important position on offense. Elite production can be found more readily later in the draft. Yeah I said it. And i've said it before. I also know that the Cowboys are going to keep Zeke. This isn't about that.

A funny thing happens when I say I would not pay a RB. They point to Emmitt and other big time RBs that have led their teams to the promised land. They say they agree with me in theory but that I need to be more nuanced. I need to make exceptions for truly transcendent talents. So is Zeke that….a transcendent talent?

That's the question right?

I've always assumed he would be awesome. When we drafted him i'd assumed he would be awesome. As he's racked up awards I've assumed he was awesome. I was wrong. Let's investigate.


The counting stats speak for themselves...

Rushing yards:

2016: 1,631 || League Rank: #1; League Rank Per Game: #1

2017: 983 || League Rank: #10; League Rank Per Game: #1

2018: 1,434 || League Rank: #1; League Rank Per Game: #1


His receiving work has shown steady improvement

Receptions Per Game:

2016: 2.13

2017: 2.6

2018: 5.13


Receiving Yards Per Game:

2016: 24.2

2017: 26.9

2018: 37.8


The awards speak for themselves.

2x Pro Bowl (2016, 2018)

First-Team All Pro (2016)

Second-Team All Pro (2018)

PFWA All-Rookie Team (2016)

FedEx Ground Player of the Year (2016)


If you stop the analysis here Zeke is unarguably the most accomplished RB league wide since he has put on The Star. You could at least squint and make the argument that you pay transcendence.

However, we are better than our fathers and grandfathers. We now know that efficiency is more important than volume in everything from financial analysis, to online marketing and yes also to professional football. So how efficient is Zeke relative to his peers?

Well here we can look to PFF’s RB statistics. Now I don’t like PFF when they try to evaluate players but they can count things like a missed tackle or a fumble. And they do!
Source: https://www.pff.com/news/pro-explaining-dallas-cowboys-rb-ezekiel-elliotts-2018-pff-grade


Forced missed tackles per game among RBs

2016: 31st

2017: 40th

2018: 35th

*Last year Zeke was 1st in total yards after contact but 18th in yards after contact per carry.


Breakaway Percentage among Rbs (percentage of yards a RB gains on runs of more than 15 yards)

2018: 15th


Fumbles among RBs

2018: 1st


Yards per route run among RBs:

2016: 24th

2017: Did not qualify due to suspension

2018: 19th


Put all together and PFF’s Eric Eager found Zeke’s production in 2018 was worth just 0.2 wins above a replacement player. Zero. Point. Two. For the laymen out there...that is not a lot. For reference Mahomes who led the league in the metric checked in at 7.49. That is 37.45 times higher than Zeke. If Zeke is worth 15MM a year what do should the Chiefs pay Patrick?

Look this is not good. But what many have told me is that the Cowboys offensive line combined with Zeke is where his true value lies. Instead of having just a good running game with our line we have a great running game with Zeke. A truly overbearing force they say! So surely the results of Zeke and the line together is what is most important and we can point to that dominance right? The problem? We know rushing efficiency is not correlated with winning. We know passing efficiency is correlated with winning. Putting this aside we could argue that at the very least situational running is important right (think red zone work, short yardage situations to extend drives and running out the clock in the 4th quarter)? That is where Zeke can point to his value?

Thankfully FiveThirtyEight ran the numbers.
Source: https://fivethirtyeight.com/features/ezekiel-elliott-is-not-worth-the-money-he-wants/

Because winning matters, let’s start with closing out games.

If we look at all runs in the 4th quarter when the Cowboys were ahead we can look at how each run increased or decreased our win probability.


Win Probability Added in the 4th:

2018: Cowboys ranked 7th overall (Hat tip to Dak)

2018: Zeke ranked 22nd

Last 3 years: Zeke lead in attempts but ranked 26th in win probability added.





Field goals in the red zone get teams beat. Surely Zeke shined in the red zone?


Red zone runs by expected points added:

2018: Cowboys ranked 10th overall

2018: Zeke ranked 16th in EPA and 28th in success rate

Last 3 years: Zeke ranked 11th in EPA and 10th in success rate


eikpj.png



Staying on the field and wearing opposing defenses down is something we have preached since Zeke was drafted. Hopefully this year we don’t fear sending out our defense as much as we have in our recent past. How much has Zeke helped our defense by extending drives on the ground?


Short yardage runs in open field by expected points added:

2018: Cowboys ranked 4th overall

2018: Zeke’s EPA ranked 10th, his success rate of 67% was good for 11th


c40pf.jpg



Well Zeke helps Dak right? And QB is the most important position in all of sports right? Zeke draws extra defenders into the box and makes our play action more effective right?



So yes QBs do well when they run play-action. No, we don't need an efficient RB/game to achieve that enhancement.

Look, as I have long acknowledged and accepted and stated as much in this post….The Cowboys are very likely to pay Zeke, make him fabulously wealthy and set some benchmarks other RBs look to hurdle (cough) in coming years. So let’s talk about salary cap efficiency since we’re here

“According to data from Overthecap, the share of average team salary allocated to all rostered running backs has fallen from 6.8 percent of spending in 2013 to 4.5 percent in 2019. Zeke’s salary alone in his optioned fifth year will represent 4.5 percent of the Cowboy’s salary cap. If Zeke signs an extension before the 2020 season, his cap hit combined with the rest of Dallas’s spend at the running back position will likely be double the league average.”

So if Zeke is going to lead to the Cowboys spending roughly double what the league will then we should expect Zeke to be worth double what a replacement level back is worth, right? Well you remember his 2018 wins above replacement number? Zero. Point. Two.

So is Zeke a transcendent talent? What exactly other than volume and counting stats would make you think he was?

And before you answer take a look at this:



^^^

This is a good take. Speciilty backs who post big efficiency numbers on minuscule volume are likely not better than Zeke. If they were they'd get more volume! However, Zeke likely isn't appreciably better than a lot of RBs who are in committees and share the load. He's just higher paid, more famous and in a better offense.

As we stand and breath nothing but the Cowboys stuffing Zeke with volume and inflating his counting stats points to Zeke being a transcendent talent. In fact you could say he’s been quite average. And this is depressing. When not wanting to pay Zeke I at least knew he was tremendous. I knew he was a special talent. At least we were paying a Hall of Famer! An objective look at his 3 years career to date presents a very different picture. Cognitive dissonance will cause many to dismiss this post. That's fine.

Everyone is entitled to their own opinion. But no one is entitled to their own facts.

I see you failed to mention our horrendous coaching as a factor. In fact, our red zone offense was so bad that the OC got chit canned and the HC is on a one year "show me" deal because he sucks too bad to get an extension right now. But yeah, go ahead and blame Zeke for that too.

If you think Zeke is just an average back and nothing special, then its understandable why you are posting your vast knowledge on an internet message board and not working in the league. Zeke is universally considered the best RB in the whole dam league, this is by GMs and analyst that do this for a living.

And stats are just stats...…….its the interpretation that is the key and a lot of these facts you have interpreted wrong my friend.
 

Beast_from_East

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When this “great offense (LOL BTW)” falls off a cliff without Zeke I’ll wait for people like you to come in and make thread after thread explaining that with all kinds of reasons except the absence of Zeke

Exactly.

Its going to be hilarious when our trash replacement backs can barely break 50 yards rushing a game and we are in last place in the division.

NO Zeke = NO playoffs
 
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Beast_from_East

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Cognitive dissonance is strong and typical behavioral responses are running rampant.

Nobody disputes the analysis. It. Just. Doesn't. Matter. Because. Reasons.

Zeke doesn't forced missed tackles? SO WHAT
Zeke doesn't break long runs? SO WHAT
Zeke fumbles more than any other RB? SO WHAT
Zeke wasn't efficient as a ball catcher? SO WHAT
Zeke wasn't special/efficient in the red zone, 4th quarter or open field in short yardage situations? SO WHAT
Dak would benefit from play action with or without Zeke? SO WHAT
Despite all this Zeke would cause us to spend twice the league average at RB? SO WHAT

Yikes. Could not be me.

I always assumed Zeke was in the conversation for best back in football. However, when my information changes, I alter my conclusions. What do you do, Zone?
The Zone will live in reality where Zeke is the best RB in football...………….you continue to live in your "Zeke is just an average back" world.;)
 

Beast_from_East

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Hilarious, so the OP posts one of the most comprehensive breakdowns of Zeke’s career, with FACTS to back it up and all the Zeke lovers can do is say “screw stats” except when they want to use his total yards as the reason for him being the best RB.

Then all they can do is mock the OP for posting a lengthy, factual and sensible post as to why Zeke isn’t worth it and he ain’t all that. That pretty much sums up homerism to a T.
If Zeke is nothing special, then answer me this.

Why did the Cowboys draft him 4th overall and why have they already offered him a top 5 contract? Stephen Jones said the Cowboys offered top 5 money to all of the triplets.

So, why are you not advising the Cowboys with your vast knowledge and letting them know they are foolishly offering top 5 money to just an average back that is nothing special?
 
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Toruk_Makto

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I see you failed to mention our horrendous coaching as a factor. In fact, our red zone offense was so bad that the OC got chit canned and the HC is on a one year "show me" deal because he sucks too bad to get an extension right now. But yeah, go ahead and blame Zeke for that too.

If you think Zeke is just an average back and nothing special, then its understandable why you are posting your vast knowledge on an internet message board and not working in the league. Zeke is universally considered the best RB in the whole dam league, this is by GMs and analyst that do this for a living.

And stats are just stats...…….its the interpretation that is the key and a lot of these facts you have interpreted wrong my friend.
Always love the....your fact based opinion isn't valid because you don't work in the league but my opinion that I just believe is valid because...reasons.
 

Toruk_Makto

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Over the last three years Zeke has 600 more yards rushing than any other player in the NFL, even after missing 8 of the 48 games. He is also a superior receiver and blocker.

You started a thread to say he was "quite average". The burden is on you to prove a laughable statement, not on us to disprove the babblings of an idiot.
Yes, he has more yards because he has more volume.

He is indeed a great blocker no doubt about it.

What makes him a "superior receiver"? He ranked 19th among RBs in yards per route run.
 

Beast_from_East

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Always love the....your fact based opinion isn't valid because you don't work in the league but my opinion that I just believe is valid because...reasons.
I will give you a reason...……...COACHING!!!

Why do you think the OC was fired and the HC is in a lame duck year? Because they are so awesome?

A lot of the red zone issues you mentioned were due to the OC and HC, not Zeke...…………..that is a fact, hence the OC getting fired.
 

Toruk_Makto

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Who said demoralizing was a statistics? That’s what the article said not I, and it clearly didn’t call it a statistic. Your embarrassing yourself.

The reality is by VOLUME, Zeke ran more than those backs. Higher Percentage is irrelevant. Zeke still ran way MORE against stacked boxes. Keep spinning though..
He also ran MORE against non-stacked boxes.

The stats are per carry.

Is this real life?
 

Toruk_Makto

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1. And as an investor, none of what you stated necessitate you know statistics.

2. You posted a whole bunch of numbers including efficiency short yardage situations, comparing Zeke with his plus 40 rushes to guys ‘more efficient’ not even breaking 17 rushes.

3. You actually said a lot of things, among them Zeke doesn’t rush MORE against stacked boxes. You said people argue his number per carry are affected because he runs MORE against stacked boxes.

Percentage is not the same as volume. And it absolutely does matter once again, because when you run more, you, for example, get more exhausted, which would impact your efficiency. Otherwise, which you continue to ignore, Hambrick would be worth more than Emmitt because he was more ‘efficient’ than Emmitt as his back-up.
So what the hell are we paying Zeke for if because he runs more he gets "more exhausted" and therefore runs less efficiencly than guys in a committee.

Like what a ridiculous statement.

Also why do you get more tired running into a stacked box than not when most runs end with a tackle?

This is amazing the shapes people will twist themselves into to deny something the statistics, many statistics, wide ranging statistics, from different sources all suggest.
 

Toruk_Makto

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I will give you a reason...……...COACHING!!!

Why do you think the OC was fired and the HC is in a lame duck year? Because they are so awesome?

A lot of the red zone issues you mentioned were due to the OC and HC, not Zeke...…………..that is a fact, hence the OC getting fired.
There were literally 21 running backs who added more expected points per rush than Zeke did in the red zone last year. Two were running backs from the Dolphins. There was Chubb from the Browns. There was a Jets running back. Ditto Denver. Somehow backs from these teams who weren't offensive juggeranuts all performed better.

It's amazing how all the success Zeke gets is because of him. All his failures are due to others...because...reasons.
 

Beast_from_East

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There were literally 21 running backs who added more expected points per rush than Zeke did in the red zone last year. Two were running backs from the Dolphins. There was Chubb from the Browns. There was a Jets running back. Ditto Denver. Somehow backs from these teams who weren't offensive juggeranuts all performed better.

It's amazing how all the success Zeke gets is because of him. All his failures are due to others...because...reasons.
The same Chubb that didnt even break 1000 yards last year?

You are seriously trying to argue he is better than Zeke...……………...wow...…………...no words:facepalm:
 
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BAT

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You are still sore that Cowboys drafted Zeke 4th over Jalen Ramsey.

You were a hater and still a hater, it colors every discussion you have regarding Elliott. Your conclusion on this player has been consistently negative.q

"There 3 kinds of lies: lies, damned lies and statistics."

- Mark Twain
 

LovinItAll

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Bravo!

I agree with this 100%.

I have been off the sign Zeke bandwagon for a while now. I just don't see anything special about him and I see a guy that is already wearing down. He knows it as well, that is why he is holding out now.

The Cowboys better not pay him.

He's 'already wearing down'? Where, exactly, do you see his diminished performance? The following stats (quoted from the OP) are despite every opponent making Zeke their priority to stop.

2016: 1,631 || League Rank: #1; League Rank Per Game: #1

2017: 983 || League Rank: #10; League Rank Per Game: #1

2018: 1,434 || League Rank: #1; League Rank Per Game: #1

Also, the notion that RBs are simply plug-n-play is absurd. We've tried the running back by committee approach and it doesn't work.

WAR (wins above replacement) is much more specious in football than it is in baseball. Analyzing a baseball player is done, by its nature, in a vacuum. That isn't possible in football, though I'm sure the analytics guys will beg to differ, at least by varying degrees.

Is the RB position the same as it was in the early 90's? No. Is it the 'least important position within the offense'? One must be mighty high to think that's true.
 

G2

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Over the last three years Zeke has 600 more yards rushing than any other player in the NFL, even after missing 8 of the 48 games. He is also a superior receiver and blocker.

You started a thread to say he was "quite average". The burden is on you to prove a laughable statement, not on us to disprove the babblings of an idiot.
You can't use volume of rushing yards unless it's to support another RB ;)
 

aria

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If Zeke is nothing special, then answer me this.

Why did the Cowboys draft him 4th overall and why have they already offered him a top 5 contract? Stephen Jones said the Cowboys offered top 5 money to all of the triplets.

So, why are you not advising the Cowboys with your vast knowledge and letting them know they are foolishly offering top 5 money to just an average back that is nothing special?
How about this? You stop making things up to try and prove a point? I could easily sit here and quote things you never said but that’s juvenile and what people who are grasping at straws do.

I’ll answer your question when you stop lying and phrase it correctly without making things up. Let’s start with this, where did I say he was just an average back? Answer me that and I’ll answer you’re ridiculously obvious questions.
 

aikemirv

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Always love the....your fact based opinion isn't valid because you don't work in the league but my opinion that I just believe is valid because...reasons.

Yours is not a fact based opinion. Yours is a results based opinion based on some pretty odd measurables that were created by stat nerds.

And you fail to take in consideration the fact based gameplans of DC's around the league. Nobody has those facts and they are the most important ones in the equation.
 

CATCH17

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Zeke is probably the most instinctual back I can remember besides probably Emmitt.

He is just born to play the position.

A lot of these RB's are just exceptional athletes playing RB but they don't have the combo of balance, vision, blocking, receiving, and all of those things that come with playing that position.

You just know what a natural RB looks like and Zeke is that.


As far as who is the best? All of the top guys will produce and be good in any given game but I do like that Zeke can get the tough yards consistently and also hit the home run.
 

Sydla

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If Zeke is nothing special, then answer me this.

Why did the Cowboys draft him 4th overall and why have they already offered him a top 5 contract? Stephen Jones said the Cowboys offered top 5 money to all of the triplets.

So, why are you not advising the Cowboys with your vast knowledge and letting them know they are foolishly offering top 5 money to just an average back that is nothing special?

Where he was drafted doesn't really matter at this point. I mean Rick Mirer and Ryan Leaf were also Top 5 picks. Were they special?

And yes, the Cowboys might be making a mistake paying a TB top 5 money. Why do people assume this franchise can't make a bad decision?
 

Sydla

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He's 'already wearing down'? Where, exactly, do you see his diminished performance? The following stats (quoted from the OP) are despite every opponent making Zeke their priority to stop.

2016: 1,631 || League Rank: #1; League Rank Per Game: #1

2017: 983 || League Rank: #10; League Rank Per Game: #1

2018: 1,434 || League Rank: #1; League Rank Per Game: #1

Also, the notion that RBs are simply plug-n-play is absurd. We've tried the running back by committee approach and it doesn't work.

WAR (wins above replacement) is much more specious in football than it is in baseball. Analyzing a baseball player is done, by its nature, in a vacuum. That isn't possible in football, though I'm sure the analytics guys will beg to differ, at least by varying degrees.

Is the RB position the same as it was in the early 90's? No. Is it the 'least important position within the offense'? One must be mighty high to think that's true.

It might be the "least" important but it's not near the top, that's for sure.
 
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