How Special is Ezekiel?

[G2]

RBBC doesn't work.

 

[uvaballa]

RBBC doesn't work.

Says who

 

[G2]

Says who

ObviouslyI just did.

 

[aikemirv]

There were literally 21 running backs who added more expected points per rush than Zeke did in the red zone last year. Two were running backs from the Dolphins. There was Chubb from the Browns. There was a Jets running back. Ditto Denver. Somehow backs from these teams who weren't offensive juggeranuts all performed better.

It's amazing how all the success Zeke gets is because of him. All his failures are due to others...because...reasons.

So Dallas was 26th in red zone efficiency last year. Are you telling me this is Zeke's shortcoming?

Obviously it is a team problem. I would throw that one stat completely out the window. It is meaningless by itself. Dak is in the bottom quarter of the league in compl % inside the 20, tds inside the 20 and tds inside the 10.... That does not have any effect on Zekes numbers?

 

[sacowboysfan513]

I appreciate the stats!

I really wish we could see Dak/Zeke play out the year just to see what we can accomplish before paying them.

I feel like this is the year to do something. They have had a few years together already, and now with Cooper added there's no reason why we should win less than 11 games barring injuries of course. Defense is better, Oline is still good. We should be making noise this year.

But I would hate to get them paid and then we go 9-7 again or 10-6 out in first round like usual. At that point it gives me no hope for the near future.

But of course they want their money now.

 

[aikemirv]

It might be the "least" important but it's not near the top, that's for sure.

The importance of your RB/running game is in direct correlation to the quality of your defense.

 

[Kaiser]

There were literally 21 running backs who added more expected points per rush than Zeke did in the red zone last year.

Then post the list of RBs if it supports your argument. You won't, because it will show a bunch of specialty backs and backs who only had a handful of carries.

 

[big dog cowboy]

I really wish we could see Dak/Zeke play out the year just to see what we can accomplish before paying them.

You haven't see enough already?

 

[CapnCook]

So what you're saying is Zeke is so special that we can't quantify his talent? And that is why he doesn't break long runs or forced missed tackles? And even when the box isn't stacked more than it is for other RBs it's this keen awareness from the defense that makes him fail on short yardage and in the red zone? Consistently and for 3 stataight years?

That's... A take.

No, mostly what I was saying was thanks for the time you took to make the post. It was very informative. And yes, for me, there is an 'eye' test, and I know what the offense looks like with a good back and without one. I am not strong on Zeke, necessarily, but unless Pollard is of the DeMarco Murray caliber, then I will worry. And Zeke's blocking is the best I've seen since (and perhaps better than) Emmit's.

But mostly, appreciating a real football post - they are rare around here this time of year.

 

[Toruk_Makto]

The same Chubb that didnt even break 1000 yards last year?

You are seriously trying to argue he is better than Zeke...……………...wow...…………...no words

I'm arguing that Zeke hasn't been more efficient than a lot of RBs.

Maybe he isn't as good as we thought?

Maybe sharing the workload means each back in the committee is able to have increased efficiency?

Maybe we should consider the implications here?

Perhaps this is why even though Zeke would e signing the most recent RB contract the Cowboys aren't willing to make him the most highly paid?

Maybe you should understand what i'm saying before making general statements?

 

[Toruk_Makto]

No, mostly what I was saying was thanks for the time you took to make the post. It was very informative. And yes, for me, there is an 'eye' test, and I know what the offense looks like with a good back and without one. I am not strong on Zeke, necessarily, but unless Pollard is of the DeMarco Murray caliber, then I will worry. And Zeke's blocking is the best I've seen since (and perhaps better than) Emmit's.

But mostly, appreciating a real football post - they are rare around here this time of year.

I can respect this. Cheers.

 

[Toruk_Makto]

Then post the list of RBs if it supports your argument. You won't, because it will show a bunch of specialty backs and backs who only had a handful of carries.

I literally addressed this issue in post #1 of this thread. I even included a pretty picture. Go take a look.

 

[Toruk_Makto]

So Dallas was 26th in red zone efficiency last year. Are you telling me this is Zeke's shortcoming?

Obviously it is a team problem. I would throw that one stat completely out the window. It is meaningless by itself. Dak is in the bottom quarter of the league in compl % inside the 20, tds inside the 20 and tds inside the 10.... That does not have any effect on Zekes numbers?

Dallas as a team was 10th in EPA in the red zone.

Zeke ranked 16th in EPA and 28th in success rate.

 

[Toruk_Makto]

Yours is not a fact based opinion. Yours is a results based opinion based on some pretty odd measurables that were created by stat nerds.

And you fail to take in consideration the fact based gameplans of DC's around the league. Nobody has those facts and they are the most important ones in the equation.

The stats are applied uniformly to all RBs. You can argue they are bad stats. You can argue they undersell Zeke's value. You can argue DCs gameplan more for Zeke than others (though alignment data disagrees here).

But you can't argue that i'm not fact based. I am. I have presented those facts. You sir, have not.

 

[Toruk_Makto]

He's 'already wearing down'? Where, exactly, do you see his diminished performance? The following stats (quoted from the OP) are despite every opponent making Zeke their priority to stop.

2016: 1,631 || League Rank: #1; League Rank Per Game: #1

2017: 983 || League Rank: #10; League Rank Per Game: #1

2018: 1,434 || League Rank: #1; League Rank Per Game: #1

Also, the notion that RBs are simply plug-n-play is absurd. We've tried the running back by committee approach and it doesn't work.

WAR (wins above replacement) is much more specious in football than it is in baseball. Analyzing a baseball player is done, by its nature, in a vacuum. That isn't possible in football, though I'm sure the analytics guys will beg to differ, at least by varying degrees.

Is the RB position the same as it was in the early 90's? No. Is it the 'least important position within the offense'? One must be mighty high to think that's true.

leading the league in rushing volume and yards is not indication that you aren't slowing down.

Zeke does not look the same player from 3 years ago to me. He's bigger. He's slower. He cannot make many people miss.

That's what my eyes tell me. The stats tell me he's inefficient runner benefiting more from our run blocking than we are benefiting from his talent.

Going back to college have we ever seen Zeke run behind a truly bad run blocking unit? Ever?

 

[Fletch]

Really hope that the above was therapeutic for you.

Lol. A month’s worth of work to say Zeke sucks.

 

[jay94]

I guess my overarching question to the original question is this:

I'm reading that Zeke is average. I've long read that Dak is average. I've been reading for even longer that Witten was washed up, and that his replacements were non-existent last year. The almighty offensive line is in decline. Oh, and our head coach and GM stink.

How in the world has this franchise been so consistently strong for the last three seasons?

I realize none of this addresses the root question, but it's just the follow-up question that rings in my mind as we all -- myself included -- tear down our roster.

Definitely did not get average of reading on Zeke. He unfortunately is at the position with the least amount of importance and wants a significant amount of money to keep playing, if you can some how combine those two of factors into one, because of salary cap implications average could be a word you could hypothesize.

 

[aikemirv]

The stats are applied uniformly to all RBs. You can argue they are bad stats. You can argue they undersell Zeke's value. You can argue DCs gameplan more for Zeke than others (though alignment data disagrees here).

But you can't argue that i'm not fact based. I am. I have presented those facts. You sir, have not.

Drawing a conclusion without all of the facts is valid based on the facts presented, however, without all the facts your conclusion could be completely wrong!

 

[uvaballa]

ObviouslyI just did.

LOL you don’t watch other teams play then.

 

[Kaiser]

I literally addressed this issue in post #1 of this thread. I even included a pretty picture. Go take a look.

I should have known your self-own was listed somewhere in the Unabomber Manifesto already.

You listed three guys "above" Zeke in a made up stat who had 5 carries, 7 and 7 respectively. There were only four with a statistically significant number of carries rated above Zeke - Kamara, Gurley, AD and Gus Edwards. None of those four were playing behind a patchwork OL with Linehan calling the plays.

So I looked, and its more ax-grinding using made up stats. Shocker.