The climate with Jerry is too toxic for success

[cowboyblue22]

so do u believe the talent is there or not if the cowboys had a really good game day coach would there record still be 6 and 5 whatever u think of jerry and the front office they have given the clown and his clown staff some quality players if its not the coaches it the players if the players are talented and good enough then its the coaches the clown just does not get his team ready to play he is way to conservative they just are not taught the little details that win games if the game against the pats and jets and Vikings and saints don't show u these things don't know what to tell u

 

[Chocolate Lab]

I think this thread is more like Jerry and Steven are ego maniacs who have to get credit and have to be heard creating a situation where Coaches are not the final voice or most important person to the players which in turn leaves us with only being able to hire guys like Jason Garrett.

Don't get me wrong, do I wish the Jones boys would shut up like Kraft? Sure I do.

But I also say we don't know the extent to which Jerry holds people back. For one thing, more and more owners want to be involved. That doesn't mean they make calls, but they want to sit in on meetings, too. It's not just Jerry doing this anymore.

For another, with the explosion in assistant coaching salaries, it doesn't happen that often that coaches get to hire everyone they want. This isn't the 80s or 90s where the head coach was in charge of everything. That only happens in rare cases like a Belichick or Gruden who have skins on the wall.

Bottom line, I don't buy the thinking that poor Jason would be a great coach except for Jerry handcuffing him. Jerry isn't ideal, to be sure. But I also don't buy that he's to blame for bad coaching. At the very least, it's not Jerry's fault that the HC can't manage a clock, can't communicate with his special teams during a game, and can't make the right call on when to go for it on 4th down.

Maybe Jason isn't a good coach and it's just that simple.

 

[BleedinBlue]

Don't get me wrong, do I wish the Jones boys would shut up like Kraft? Sure I do.

But I also say we don't know the extent to which Jerry holds people back. For one thing, more and more owners want to be involved. That doesn't mean they make calls, but they want to sit in on meetings, too. It's not just Jerry doing this anymore.

For another, with the explosion in assistant coaching salaries, it doesn't happen that often that coaches get to hire everyone they want. This isn't the 80s or 90s where the head coach was in charge of everything. That only happens in rare cases like a Belichick or Gruden who have skins on the wall.

Bottom line, I don't buy the thinking that poor Jason would be a great coach except for Jerry handcuffing him. Jerry isn't ideal, to be sure. But I also don't buy that he's to blame for bad coaching. At the very least, it's not Jerry's fault that the HC can't manage a clock, can't communicate with his special teams during a game, and can't make the right call on when to go for it on 4th down.

Maybe Jason isn't a good coach and it's just that simple.

guess you have never hired anyone. Would you hire a guy that couldn't do all of the things you listed above and if you hired said person and he failed who's at fault?

 

[BoysForLife]

Watching the firestorm with Jerry moment after moment day after day with him responding to questions and the continuing pressure punctuates where our core issue still resides.

The culture and climate is still too toxic for anyone to have success and or any control in Cowboys Football.

The conflict of interest with Jerry wearing both hats of owner and GM continues to be our greatest obstacle with him promoting his product on one hand and football decisions on the other. It’s a disaster.

It’s time for Garrett to walk after this season even if we were to win out which I wouldn’t bet the farm on. It’s likely to get worse. It’s just not a healthy climate in Frisco. I’d get the hell out of dodge ASAP. Good luck to the next puppet in this media circus climate with the biggest Bozo in the NFL.

there's absolutely some validity to what you are saying but the fact is, it's been done before.

Jimmy proved it. IT just takes a guy who is more strong willed, more hard headed, more stubborn and insistent and focused than anyone we've had since Jimmy (Parcells included)

it literally takes someone like Jimmy who was willing to basically get in Jerry's face and tell him to shut the blank up when needed
I think Parcells to some extent was that guy but I also think at that point in his career, Bill P was tired and didn't want to fight. I think if we had Parcells from 20 years earlier for example (during his prime with the Giants) then he could have made it work here also.

So, the next question is--is that guy out there? Who is that guy who is not only a top coach, but also has the stones to tell Jerry to go pound sand and cut checks?

if that guy is out there, that guy can win here. For my money, the only guy that comes close is Urban Meyer.
I honestly don't see another option out there that gives us any real chance of being a contender in the near future.

You are correct, the chain of command here makes it more difficult to win than anywhere else in the league with the possible exception of Detroit or Washington.

 

[Chocolate Lab]

guess you have never hired anyone. Would you hire a guy that couldn't do all of the things you listed above and if you hired said person and he failed who's at fault?

Oh, of course Jerry is to blame for hiring and retaining him this long. No doubt about that.

I'm talking about the Diehardblues point of view that no coach can possibly win here because Jerry interferes day-to-day, prevents the coach from doing his job, etc.

 

[kskboys]

there's absolutely some validity to what you are saying but the fact is, it's been done before.

Jimmy proved it. IT just takes a guy who is more strong willed, more hard headed, more stubborn and insistent and focused than anyone we've had since Jimmy (Parcells included)

it literally takes someone like Jimmy who was willing to basically get in Jerry's face and tell him to shut the blank up when needed
I think Parcells to some extent was that guy but I also think at that point in his career, Bill P was tired and didn't want to fight. I think if we had Parcells from 20 years earlier for example (during his prime with the Giants) then he could have made it work here also.

So, the next question is--is that guy out there? Who is that guy who is not only a top coach, but also has the stones to tell Jerry to go pound sand and cut checks?

if that guy is out there, that guy can win here. For my money, the only guy that comes close is Urban Meyer.
I honestly don't see another option out there that gives us any real chance of being a contender in the near future.

You are correct, the chain of command here makes it more difficult to win than anywhere else in the league with the possible exception of Detroit or Washington.

Jerry won't hire a HC like that.

 

[BleedinBlue]

there's absolutely some validity to what you are saying but the fact is, it's been done before.

Jimmy proved it. IT just takes a guy who is more strong willed, more hard headed, more stubborn and insistent and focused than anyone we've had since Jimmy (Parcells included)

it literally takes someone like Jimmy who was willing to basically get in Jerry's face and tell him to shut the blank up when needed
I think Parcells to some extent was that guy but I also think at that point in his career, Bill P was tired and didn't want to fight. I think if we had Parcells from 20 years earlier for example (during his prime with the Giants) then he could have made it work here also.

So, the next question is--is that guy out there? Who is that guy who is not only a top coach, but also has the stones to tell Jerry to go pound sand and cut checks?

if that guy is out there, that guy can win here. For my money, the only guy that comes close is Urban Meyer.
I honestly don't see another option out there that gives us any real chance of being a contender in the near future.

You are correct, the chain of command here makes it more difficult to win than anywhere else in the league with the possible exception of Detroit or Washington.

didn't hurt for Jimmy to have a contract that stipulated he had the say in the roster either.

 

[BoysForLife]

WILL MCclay has been the saving grace for this franchise. The day he leaves will be a sad one.The best hire they ever made since hiring Jimmy Johnson.

Lot of truth to that

 

[BoysForLife]

Jerry won't hire a HC like that.

Unfortunately you are probably right.
But if we're talking about what it would take, this is the guy it would take.
Another puppet = lather, rinse, repeat.

 

[Reverend Conehead]

Watching the firestorm with Jerry moment after moment day after day with him responding to questions and the continuing pressure punctuates where our core issue still resides.

The culture and climate is still too toxic for anyone to have success and or any control in Cowboys Football.

The conflict of interest with Jerry wearing both hats of owner and GM continues to be our greatest obstacle with him promoting his product on one hand and football decisions on the other. It’s a disaster.

It’s time for Garrett to walk after this season even if we were to win out which I wouldn’t bet the farm on. It’s likely to get worse. It’s just not a healthy climate in Frisco. I’d get the hell out of dodge ASAP. Good luck to the next puppet in this media circus climate with the biggest Bozo in the NFL.

Is "toxic" the right word though? My all accounts, Jerry's a decent guy who treats people with respect. His problems seem to be mismanagement of the team, not being toxic toward people. I could be wrong, of course, because I'm not there, but that was the impression I got.

 

[kskboys]

Unfortunately you are probably right.
But if we're talking about what it would take, this is the guy it would take.
Another puppet = lather, rinse, repeat.

Jerry's control is what dooms us.

 

[BoysForLife]

Jerry's control is what dooms us.

Well, I'm not *hoping* when I post this, but the fact is nobody lives forever.

if you are correct, will it change when Stephen has the keys?

 

[kskboys]

Is "toxic" the right word though? My all accounts, Jerry's a decent guy who treats people with respect. His problems seem to be mismanagement of the team, not being toxic toward people. I could be wrong, of course, because I'm not there, but that was the impression I got.

He's toxic for the franchise because he doesn't comprehend personnel and won't let the coaches just do their job. For example, rescinding the fines that Wade tried to levy for players who were late to meetings.

 

[BoysForLife]

Is "toxic" the right word though? My all accounts, Jerry's a decent guy who treats people with respect. His problems seem to be mismanagement of the team, not being toxic toward people. I could be wrong, of course, because I'm not there, but that was the impression I got.

I think you are both saying the same essential thing in different ways.
I think your statements here are correct.

I think Greg is saying that the climate is "toxic" when it comes to building a winning organization.
Not necessarily a commentary about how Jerry treats people. But that the way the organization is structured, it makes it almost impossible to win.

I don't want to put words in his mouth but that's what I'm seeing by his choice of the word toxic.

 

[Rayman70]

IF Jerry is being sincere and he really wants to win a trophy before he is dead..then I could see him hiring a bigtime HC..like a hail Mary hire if you will. We are about to see how badly he really wants to win.

 

[cowboygo]

Watching the firestorm with Jerry moment after moment day after day with him responding to questions and the continuing pressure punctuates where our core issue still resides.

The culture and climate is still too toxic for anyone to have success and or any control in Cowboys Football.

The conflict of interest with Jerry wearing both hats of owner and GM continues to be our greatest obstacle with him promoting his product on one hand and football decisions on the other. It’s a disaster.

It’s time for Garrett to walk after this season even if we were to win out which I wouldn’t bet the farm on. It’s likely to get worse. It’s just not a healthy climate in Frisco. I’d get the hell out of dodge ASAP. Good luck to the next puppet in this media circus climate with the biggest Bozo in the NFL.

winning cures all. if we get on a run, we will be fine. doubt it though.

 

[kskboys]

Well, I'm not *hoping* when I post this, but the fact is nobody lives forever.

if you are correct, will it change when Stephen has the keys?

Hard to say.

Stevie is over the financials. If he'll keep his head in the books, maybe. He has stated that when he takes over he will hire a GM. Stevie is also a football dummy, but he doesn't appear to have his dad's inane insistence to be the GM, a job at which he is terrible.

 

[BotchedLobotomy]

Anything using the word "toxic" be it a person or situation should be banned from the human language. One of the most overused and misused words in existence right now.

 

[CowboyRoy]

Watching the firestorm with Jerry moment after moment day after day with him responding to questions and the continuing pressure punctuates where our core issue still resides.

The culture and climate is still too toxic for anyone to have success and or any control in Cowboys Football.

The conflict of interest with Jerry wearing both hats of owner and GM continues to be our greatest obstacle with him promoting his product on one hand and football decisions on the other. It’s a disaster.

It’s time for Garrett to walk after this season even if we were to win out which I wouldn’t bet the farm on. It’s likely to get worse. It’s just not a healthy climate in Frisco. I’d get the hell out of dodge ASAP. Good luck to the next puppet in this media circus climate with the biggest Bozo in the NFL.

The problem is he hires losers like Garrett to run the show.

The same head coach you keep defending day in and day out on here.

Just look what your doing right now!!! Portraying Garrett as the victim. LOL

 

[Reverend Conehead]

I think you are both saying the same essential thing in different ways.
I think your statements here are correct.

I think Greg is saying that the climate is "toxic" when it comes to building a winning organization.
Not necessarily a commentary about how Jerry treats people. But that the way the organization is structured, it makes it almost impossible to win.

I don't want to put words in his mouth but that's what I'm seeing by his choice of the word toxic.

I think you're right. We're using different meanings of the word "toxic." I do agree that he's done poor management that creates barriers to making a winning culture.