Convince me Payton is that much better than McCarthy

[loublue22]

Brees may not be the most physically imposing quarterback. But he has always been a stud. He was a stud at Purdue. Probably the best Big 10 QB ever.

Brees was the first pick of the second round and only fell that far because of his height.

The point is. It’s not like Brees became a success out of nowhere. He was an amazing college QB, and a high draft pick. He wasn’t some diamond in the rough.

I agree with you, I'm just saying I think that's why Payton is given more credit. Also, if you were starting a team and I offered you prime Rodgers or Brees, that's an easy choice.

 

[darthseinfeld]

That is pretty staggering though

 

[jterrell]

I clearly stated that he was garbage in his final TWO years.

Largely because he relied on AR to be the hall of fame QB he thought he was.
Those GB teams also faced cap mgmt issues and other things.

You won't find any coach that has no warts.

 

[kskboys]

Brees may not be the most physically imposing quarterback. But he has always been a stud. He was a stud at Purdue. Probably the best Big 10 QB ever.

Brees was the first pick of the second round and only fell that far because of his height.

The point is. It’s not like Brees became a success out of nowhere. He was an amazing college QB, and a high draft pick. He wasn’t some diamond in the rough.

And Brees had already broken out his last year in SD, but he had an arm injury and SD had just acquired Rivers, so they let him walk.

 

[Fmart322]

....Rodgers is about as much of a choker. Brees has, at the very least, beat winning teams while trailing. Rodgers record there is terrible.

McCarthy is getting way too much crap on this board and most of it is baseless. If you want Dak to take the next step, you bring in McCarthy.

I will say that McCarthy will be motivated when he comes back to coaching next year.

 

[WillieBeamen]

I agree with you, I'm just saying I think that's why Payton is given more credit. Also, if you were starting a team and I offered you prime Rodgers or Brees, that's an easy choice.

Not to me

Prime Brees: 2011-71% completion 5400 yards 46 TDs

Prime Rodgers: 2011-68% completion 4600 yds 45 TDs

 

[nightrain]

I clearly stated that he was garbage in his final TWO years.

Check this out.

https://syndication.bleacherreport.com/amp/2828649-what-happened-in-green-bay.amp.html

I think Rodgers is an undermining, DB.

 

[Cas2800]

Not a Payton fan by you got to remember McCarthy got an extra playoff win gifted by the Dez Catch game and Payton got screwed against the Rams.

 

[kskboys]

I think Rodgers is an undermining, DB.

Agree. He's that anal retentive little jerk who whispers problem-causing nothings into others' ears about how badly he's been treated.

 

[Nav22]

Largely because he relied on AR to be the hall of fame QB he thought he was.
Those GB teams also faced cap mgmt issues and other things.

You won't find any coach that has no warts.

See what Aaron Jones did this year compared to 2017-18.

That’s on McCarthy. Stevie Wonder could see that Jones was a stud who should’ve been the lead back. McCarthy couldn’t.

 

[xwalker]

Jerry isn't giving Payton operational control. Not based off 1 SB win a decade ago.
He might give him more leeway in selecting his staff and such but again it doesn't really matter because Stephen is the guy who will call the shots longer term.

The McClay as GM, Stephen as Team President stuff isn't optional to any Coach not even Belichek.
Jerry isn't handing over control outside the "family".

Payton leaves that to "his" GM Mickey Loomis.

Payton does not want to be separated from Loomis but it's unlikely any team would hire both of them as as a package deal and it's unlikely that the Saints would let that happen anyway.

 

[jterrell]

Brees may not be the most physically imposing quarterback. But he has always been a stud. He was a stud at Purdue. Probably the best Big 10 QB ever.

Brees was the first pick of the second round and only fell that far because of his height.

The point is. It’s not like Brees became a success out of nowhere. He was an amazing college QB, and a high draft pick. He wasn’t some diamond in the rough.

Brees gets through progressions very quickly and is very accurate.
He will go into the Hall of Fame.

Payton earns lots of kudos for Brees and should but just because you develop one guy into a HOF QB does NOT means you can simply repeat it.

In the words of Jay -Z --"Ok if you made me, simply make another me".
Still not another Jay Z from Dame Dash or anyone else.

 

[kskboys]

Not to me

Prime Brees: 2011-71% completion 5400 yards 46 TDs

Prime Rodgers: 2011-68% completion 4600 yds 45 TDs

I agree. Very tough choice.

 

[nightrain]

Agree. He's that anal retentive little jerk who whispers problem-causing nothings into others' ears about how badly he's been treated.

See it every week.

 

[Nav22]

I think Rodgers is an undermining, DB.

And yet Rodgers is now 13-3 with a rookie head coach, sitting pretty with a 1st round bye.

McCarthy’s unemployed after going 11-16-1 in his last 2 years.

We’re furious at Garrett when he goes 8-8 with Tony Romo or Dak Prescott. McCarthy was worse than that with Aaron Rodgers.

 

[WillieBeamen]

Im not at all caping for McCarthy, but tbh, he may be the best option as far as candidates with NFL experience.

Some are okay with giving up picks for Payton, and passing on McCarthy

 

[xwalker]

Jerry isn't giving Payton operational control. Not based off 1 SB win a decade ago.
He might give him more leeway in selecting his staff and such but again it doesn't really matter because Stephen is the guy who will call the shots longer term.

The McClay as GM, Stephen as Team President stuff isn't optional to any Coach not even Belichek.
Jerry isn't handing over control outside the "family".

Payton is given credit by the media for the GM's success; whereas McCarthy was clearly minimally involved in the GM's decisions in Green Bay.

 

[darthseinfeld]

Has that kind of feel to it, doesn't it?

He has a point though. Biggest question with McCarthy is what did he actually learn from his last two years in GB. If you want us to fire a HC with NFL head coaching experience, McCarthy is your only decent option.

Thats why I would prefer we go with a college guy or coordinator. Id take the inexperience as an NFL HC to gain a fresh perspective

 

[nightrain]

And yet Rodgers is now 13-3 with a rookie head coach, sitting pretty with a 1st round bye.

McCarthy’s unemployed after going 11-16-1 in his last 2 years.

Don't forget those Smith Bros. They finally did something with that defense.

 

[DOUBLE WING]

McCarthy lost his team and his HOF QB’s respect. AFAIK Payton and Brees are still good with each other. I would also say the Saints play in a tougher division over the time frame. Also, as good as Brees is he’s not Aaron Rodgers. Winning one SB with Brees is excusable. Not doing more with Rodgers is not IMO. But as far as records go, yeah they are essentially the same.

Rodgers is a complete mental case who has basically ostracized his entire family. Google it. Publicly beefed with his brother, and apparently shut his parents out of his life. I'd take whatever issue he had with McCarthy with a complete grain of salt as it pertains to McCarthy's coaching abilty.