Video: All of Darren McFadden's 2014 rushes (All-22) [39:25]

[xwalker]

This just cut to the core Fuzz. And here I thought all this time the team really listened to my opinions and made decisions based on what i thought was best for them. Are you telling me nothing of what we say here has any impact on the team's decision making? Please say it isn't so.......



So was it a good line or wasn't it? Or was it only a good line when Murray had some success but when he didn't, he just couldn't "hold his own?" My original post in this thread was when someone claimed, after reviewing the all-22 of course, that Murray would have had the same results as DMAC behind Oakland's line. That completely negates the fact that Murray played behind some horrid lines manned by scrubs and still had some success. That same line that took multiple first round picks to rebuild. That same line that gives you and others the confidence that any back or a committee of backs could do what Murray did.

But I'll ask again, when was the last time Dallas won playoff games or a SB with a RBBC approach?

DeMarco Murray always played on a team with a significant passing threat. The Raiders rarely if ever had a significant passing threat that would eliminate 8 men in the box against the run.

 

[Dodger12]

DeMarco Murray always played on a team with a significant passing threat. The Raiders rarely if ever had a significant passing threat that would eliminate 8 men in the box against the run.

Valid point but in 2012, Palmer threw for over 4,000 yards yet McFadden had his worst statistical year averaging 3.3 YPC. On the flip side, Romo has played without the benefit of a consistent running game prior to 2014 (under Garrett) and still put up numbers. Adrian Peterson had Tavaris Jackson, Gus Ferote, Christian Ponder, Matt Cassel, a 1 and 5 Donavan McNabb, Josh Freeman, Kelly Holcomb, Bruce Bollinger and Joe Webb at QB and still made the Pro-Bowl on multiple occassions.

Sometimes, players are successful because they're just good players. The excuse making for DMAC after 7 years in NFL where he hasn't lived up to his draft status is just outright bizarre, as is silly comments about what a successful back would have done playing behind the same line and your opinion is he would have had the same results. But I guess you need to believe that because you're hoping that the opposite holds true; that Randle, DMAC, etc. can do what Murray did behind the same line in Dallas. Problem is, it doesn't work that way.

 

[xwalker]

Valid point but in 2012, Palmer threw for over 4,000 yards yet McFadden had his worst statistical year averaging 3.3 YPC. On the flip side, Romo has played without the benefit of a consistent running game prior to 2014 (under Garrett) and still put up numbers. Adrian Peterson had Tavaris Jackson, Gus Ferote, Christian Ponder, Matt Cassel, a 1 and 5 Donavan McNabb, Josh Freeman, Kelly Holcomb, Bruce Bollinger and Joe Webb at QB and still made the Pro-Bowl on multiple occassions.

Sometimes, players are successful because they're just good players. The excuse making for DMAC after 7 years in NFL where he hasn't lived up to his draft status is just outright bizarre, as is silly comments about what a successful back would have done playing behind the same line and your opinion is he would have had the same results. But I guess you need to believe that because you're hoping that the opposite holds true; that Randle, DMAC, etc. can do what Murray did behind the same line in Dallas. Problem is, it doesn't work that way.

1. It has been widely discussed that the Raiders had problems in 2012 because they tried to convert to a Zone Blocking Scheme. Murray also had his worst ypc the 1st year of the Zone scheme.

2. Lets stay with RBs, not QBs.

3. Adrian Peterson is a top 5 RB in NFL history and might be #1 in overall ability. Comparisons to him are meaningless.

I originally pulled up the All-22 of McFadden not expecting much; however, what I saw was a guy that still has talent but that had very little tot work with on the vast majority of plays. The game footage is a much better indicator of ability than stats.

I don't know that he will be great or even good, but I can't find any indications from watching the game footage that he can't be really good.

I'm only expecting him to get 1/2 of the carries at most. Somebody else has to step up and take a big share or the carries. Hopefully Randle can be that guy. In regards to #3 RBs, Williams and/or Dunbar seem to have enough talent to hold down that spot.

 

[BigD_95]

Valid point but in 2012, Palmer threw for over 4,000 yards yet McFadden had his worst statistical year averaging 3.3 YPC. On the flip side, Romo has played without the benefit of a consistent running game prior to 2014 (under Garrett) and still put up numbers. Adrian Peterson had Tavaris Jackson, Gus Ferote, Christian Ponder, Matt Cassel, a 1 and 5 Donavan McNabb, Josh Freeman, Kelly Holcomb, Bruce Bollinger and Joe Webb at QB and still made the Pro-Bowl on multiple occassions.

Sometimes, players are successful because they're just good players. The excuse making for DMAC after 7 years in NFL where he hasn't lived up to his draft status is just outright bizarre, as is silly comments about what a successful back would have done playing behind the same line and your opinion is he would have had the same results. But I guess you need to believe that because you're hoping that the opposite holds true; that Randle, DMAC, etc. can do what Murray did behind the same line in Dallas. Problem is, it doesn't work that way.

Amen brother! Tell it like it is ! Some on here are living in a fantasy world.

You do realize that Run DMC lost his starting job to a nobody and they were better behind the same O-line

 

[FuzzyLumpkins]

Not sure why Fuzzy liked the post because it only proves what I'm saying. Behind a bad OL, Murray still had a respectable average (minus the Rams game) on the team where the HC refused to committ to the run. In 7 years as a pro, DMAC has only had two seasons where he's avereaged better than 4.6 YPC which is something Murray did 3 out of his 4 years behind an OL that was so bad it needed 4 years and multiple first round picks to rebuild.

Because unlike you I enjoy discussion and not only what affirms what I say.

You are still trying to couch it in the Murray vs DMC paradigm I see. Arguing individual points afraid to lose even one.

I never said Murray wasn't better. Keep flailing.

 

[reddyuta]

DeMarco Murray always played on a team with a significant passing threat. The Raiders rarely if ever had a significant passing threat that would eliminate 8 men in the box against the run.

This might be true but we face a lot of 8 man box too and Dmac still has to churn off the tough yards.

 

[CATCH17]

You guys have broke this down way too far.


Runningback is all about physical ability.. Does he have it or not.

IMO, he does. The Raiders were really just that bad as you can clearly see.

If you believe that big lightning fast backs with vision, hands, and blocking ability are not going to do well here then go ahead and be my guest to believe that.

 

[Toruk_Makto]

Valid point but in 2012, Palmer threw for over 4,000 yards yet McFadden had his worst statistical year averaging 3.3 YPC. On the flip side, Romo has played without the benefit of a consistent running game prior to 2014 (under Garrett) and still put up numbers. Adrian Peterson had Tavaris Jackson, Gus Ferote, Christian Ponder, Matt Cassel, a 1 and 5 Donavan McNabb, Josh Freeman, Kelly Holcomb, Bruce Bollinger and Joe Webb at QB and still made the Pro-Bowl on multiple occassions.

Sometimes, players are successful because they're just good players. The excuse making for DMAC after 7 years in NFL where he hasn't lived up to his draft status is just outright bizarre, as is silly comments about what a successful back would have done playing behind the same line and your opinion is he would have had the same results. But I guess you need to believe that because you're hoping that the opposite holds true; that Randle, DMAC, etc. can do what Murray did behind the same line in Dallas. Problem is, it doesn't work that way.

Do you know what bad teams do when they are behind? They throw a lot.

I wonder how much garbage yards Carson threw for that year. I wonder how many 4th quarter carries Darren averaged.

 

[Dodger12]

1. It has been widely discussed that the Raiders had problems in 2012 because they tried to convert to a Zone Blocking Scheme. Murray also had his worst ypc the 1st year of the Zone scheme.

This would be relevent if you didn't have 7 years worth of results. In this thread alone, you've blamed the line, the QB (or lackthereof) and now the scheme. Keep going; you're on a roll.....

2. Lets stay with RBs, not QBs.

When you bring the QB position into the equation as yet another excuse for a guy you're pimping, then I can go there as an example without going off point.

3. Adrian Peterson is a top 5 RB in NFL history and might be #1 in overall ability. Comparisons to him are meaningless.

Really? Mcfadden was drafted higher than Peterson one year appart. The comparisons are far from meaningless especially when you bring up the passing game and 8 man fronts as another justification. But OK, let's go elswhere. Marshawn Lynch has had JP Loseman, Trent Edwards, Matt Hasselback, Chrlie Whitehurst, Tavaris Jackson and still was an All-Pro level RB. Arian Foster made the Pro-Bowl in 2014 with Ryan Fitzpatrick, Case Keenum and Ryan Mallet. Frank Gore had a young Alex Smith (74 QBR), Trent Dilfer, Shaun Hill, Chris Weinke, JT O'Sullivan, a rookie Colin Kaepernick and was still successful. Jamaal Chrles had Matt Cassel, Brodi Croyle and Brady Quinn and was still successful. Steven Jackson was still successful (Pro-Bowl level) with Jamie Martin, Kyle Boller, Keith Null and Sam Bradford with his 79 QBR.

I originally pulled up the All-22 of McFadden not expecting much; however, what I saw was a guy that still has talent but that had very little tot work with on the vast majority of plays. The game footage is a much better indicator of ability than stats.

I don't know that he will be great or even good, but I can't find any indications from watching the game footage that he can't be really good.

These guys don't get drafted in any round without some talent, let alone the 1st round. Do you think teams draft these guys without an indication that they can't be good? But sometimes it doesn't pan out. Sometimes you just can't measure the intangilbles, the heart, the vision, the intelligence, etc.

Having said that, your review of the all-22 is not better than that of the Raiders staff and coaches who get paid to do it and have done it for years. The gave up on a guy the drafted in the top 10. Dallas signed him to the bare minimum hoping to strike lighting in a bottle. It's a no risk move. We all get that. But to talk yourself into believing that it was never DMAC's fault in 7 years is ludicrous.

 

[Dodger12]

You are still trying to couch it in the Murray vs DMC paradigm I see. Arguing individual points afraid to lose even one.

Um, hey Fuzz, I didn't start the Murray vs. DMAC comparison. I just responded to it so I'm not couching the thread in any way.

Hey, I'm still looking for your insight on when we've been successful winning playoff games or a SB with a RBBC.

 

[xwalker]

This would be relevent if you didn't have 7 years worth of results. In this thread alone, you've blamed the line, the QB (or lackthereof) and now the scheme. Keep going; you're on a roll.....



When you bring the QB position into the equation as yet another excuse for a guy you're pimping, then I can go there as an example without going off point.



Really? Mcfadden was drafted higher than Peterson one year appart. The comparisons are far from meaningless especially when you bring up the passing game and 8 man fronts as another justification. But OK, let's go elswhere. Marshawn Lynch has had JP Loseman, Trent Edwards, Matt Hasselback, Chrlie Whitehurst, Tavaris Jackson and still was an All-Pro level RB. Arian Foster made the Pro-Bowl in 2014 with Ryan Fitzpatrick, Case Keenum and Ryan Mallet. Frank Gore had a young Alex Smith (74 QBR), Trent Dilfer, Shaun Hill, Chris Weinke, JT O'Sullivan, a rookie Colin Kaepernick and was still successful. Jamaal Chrles had Matt Cassel, Brodi Croyle and Brady Quinn and was still successful. Steven Jackson was still successful (Pro-Bowl level) with Jamie Martin, Kyle Boller, Keith Null and Sam Bradford with his 79 QBR.



These guys don't get drafted in any round without some talent, let alone the 1st round. Do you think teams draft these guys without an indication that they can't be good? But sometimes it doesn't pan out. Sometimes you just can't measure the intangilbles, the heart, the vision, the intelligence, etc.

Having said that, your review of the all-22 is not better than that of the Raiders staff and coaches who get paid to do it and have done it for years. The gave up on a guy the drafted in the top 10. Dallas signed him to the bare minimum hoping to strike lighting in a bottle. It's a no risk move. We all get that. But to talk yourself into believing that it was never DMAC's fault in 7 years is ludicrous.

Why would the Raiders want to keep a veteran RB when they're rebuilding? They did sign him to a 2nd contract after his rookie deal.

 

[xwalker]

Amen brother! Tell it like it is ! Some on here are living in a fantasy world.

You do realize that Run DMC lost his starting job to a nobody and they were better behind the same O-line

He was the backup for the final 3 games and had a 5.3 ypc. The new starter had a 4.0 ypc in those games.

 

[BigD_95]

He was the backup for the final 3 games and had a 5.3 ypc. The new starter had a 4.0 ypc in those games.

Like you said he was the back up. Means he lost the starting job because he was worse than the guy behind him. They also left him walk. Why do you think that is? Because he was good or great? It was because he was nothing but a complete disappointment the entire time in Raider land.

I hope more than anything he does great in Dallas. Trust me. But if we want a good running game we have more of a chance of Randle being that guy and RUN DMC coming off the bench. At least Randle is more of a unknown because what we know about McFadden isn't good.

 

[Jstopper]

Like you said he was the back up. Means he lost the starting job because he was worse than the guy behind him. They also left him walk. Why do you think that is? Because he was good or great? It was because he was nothing but a complete disappointment the entire time in Raider land.

I hope more than anything he does great in Dallas. Trust me. But if we want a good running game we have more of a chance of Randle being that guy and RUN DMC coming off the bench. At least Randle is more of a unknown because what we know about McFadden isn't good.

You completely flipped your logic. You call out McFadden as the starter because his backups had a better average than him, then when McFadden became the backup his average was better than the starters and yet you call him out for being the backup lmao.

 

[BigD_95]

You completely flipped your logic. You call out McFadden as the starter because his backups had a better average than him, then when McFadden became the backup his average was better than the starters and yet you call him out for being the backup lmao.

what are you talking about? I NEVER spoke of averages? I said he lost his job because the back up was better. Averages have ZERO to do with who is better. Might want to reread

 

[xwalker]

Like you said he was the back up. Means he lost the starting job because he was worse than the guy behind him. They also left him walk. Why do you think that is? Because he was good or great? It was because he was nothing but a complete disappointment the entire time in Raider land.

I hope more than anything he does great in Dallas. Trust me. But if we want a good running game we have more of a chance of Randle being that guy and RUN DMC coming off the bench. At least Randle is more of a unknown because what we know about McFadden isn't good.

Why wouldn't a rebuilding team that had lost most of their games start the younger player? I'm surprised they waited that long.

Why would a rebuilding team re-sign a veteran RB?

We really don't know much about McFadden good or bad.

There is really no way to definitively separate the fault in Oakland between him and the blocking or lack of passing threat.

About all that can be done is to look at the game footage to see how he looked. The game footage showed a player that appears to have some ability on the rare occasions he had enough space to do something. It is not proof that he will do well here, but there is also no proof that he can't.

They are not depending on him to be the Bell Cow RB. One of the other RBs need to step up regardless of what happens with McFadden.

 

[bodi]

I for one hope he breaks all of Murray's records

http://i80.***BLOCKED***/albums/j190/sjurg71/college_arkansas_90-2.jpg

 

[bodi]

this is not a bad player just a bad blocking team - or was his college O LINE better than the Raiders

http://www.nfl.com/combine/profiles/darren-mcfadden?id=284

this not a bad player just a bad team

Strengths
Positives: Has a solid, thick build with tapered thighs and calves, athletic physique with a tight waist and hips, low body fat and defined upper body...Has the quick feet and balance to pick his way through trash, doing a nice job of staying upright to power through the initial tackle...Has the pick-and-slide agility to make defenders miss, showing outstanding acceleration and flexibility when changing direction...He has that rare speed and explosive second gear to be very elusive getting through traffic, thanks to sharp lateral cuts...Plays with good toughness, lowering his head and driving hard with his legs after contact...Can bounce off tackles and gives good second effort when his initial move fails...Willing blocker who shows the ability to pick up blitzes and will chip defenders with good intent and purpose...Has the field vision and awareness to find the open crease and excels at anticipating cutback lanes...Looks natural with the ball in his hands, as he is a threat running, throwing or catching the ball, but did have ball-security issues as a junior...Understands blocking schemes but will out-run his protection at times...

freshman rushing records with 1,113 yards and 11 scores on 176 carries (6.3-yard average) in 2005.

sophomore, McFadden's rushing yardage total of 1,647 on 284 attempts (5.8-yard average) was more than that of 54 of the 119 Division I-A teams (45.4%), while his 14 rushing touchdowns were better than 43 teams nationally (36.1%).

junior He gained over 100 yards rushing 10 times, as he broke his own school record with 1,830 yards and 16 touchdowns on 325 rushes (5.6-yard average).

His career total of 4,590 yards ranks second all-time in career rushing yards in the SEC, behind only Herschel Walker

 

[LittleBoyBlue]

I dont think Emmitt Smith could have made more out of those runs

That line was horrible

And #4... Was that Favre? Lol

But seriously, I am a fan of DMF... I understand his issues but if we can get him some holes.... Get him in space..... He can some "good things"

 

[kramskoi]

Um, hey Fuzz, I didn't start the Murray vs. DMAC comparison. I just responded to it so I'm not couching the thread in any way.

Hey, I'm still looking for your insight on when we've been successful winning playoff games or a SB with a RBBC.

1971 Dallas Cowboys running committee:

33 Duane Thomas 24 RB 11 10 175 793 11 56 4.5 72.1 15.9 13 153 11.8 2 34 1.2 13.9 946 13 3
32 Walt Garrison 27 FB 13 11 127 429 1 34 3.4 33.0 9.8 40 396 9.9 1 36 3.1 30.5 825 2 6
35 Calvin Hill 24 rb 8 7 106 468 8 17 4.4 58.5 13.3 19 244 12.8 3 27 2.4 30.5 712 11 2
12 Roger Staubach* 29 QB 13 10 41 343

Total yardage = 2,033 [4.527 ypc] 449 att /SuperBowl win

1970:

35 Calvin Hill 23 RB 12 9 153 577 4 20 3.8 48.1 12.8 13 95 7.3 0 21 1.1 7.9 672 4 4
33 Duane Thomas 23 fb/KR/rb 14 8 151 803 5 47 5.3 57.4 10.8 10 73 7.3 0 17 0.7 5.2 876 5 6
32 Walt Garrison 26 FB 11 10 126 507 3

Total Yards = 1,887 [4.388 ypc] 430 att /SuperBowl loss