An attempt to stop the help me understand threads

[blindzebra]

A lost cause I am sure but here it goes.

For the trade down and passing on Floyd. He was not a playmaker and Marinelli did not want him.

Okay now for middle rounds.

Nobody we could get on OL or DT after the big run offer us more than Leary, Arkin, Kowalski, Price, Lissemore, Crawford, Bass, etc...we'd be basically churning.

Now is it better to churn depth or add valuable contributors at other positions?

If one can not see the difference both short and long term that Escobar, Williams, Randle, Wilcox, Webb and Holloman offer over project lineman to replace project lineman already in our system than you will never understand anything football related.

 

[jobberone]

Not going to argue with this.

 

[jterrell]

pretty much what the scouts would say imho.

there is a reason the ol went from picked every 3rd pick in round 1 to 40 picks between selections.

guys on the dl like bennie logan and jordan hill were rated a couple rounds below where they were drafted. the ol was just bereft of picks for long stretches. the OT Armstead and Watson weren't considered even possible early starters.

this was a draft of reaching for bigs. think most teams did it at least once.

dallas needed to add bodies that can play because they can go sign bigs if they have cap space. when you consistently miss in the draft you have no money to sign anyone.

trust the friggin scouts or hire new ones.

 

[FiveRings]

I think if we found a way to get our hands on Barrett Jones, pehaps with the second fourth rounder we should have had, i would let the questionable picks go. But one O Line pick in seven picks has to make you a little mad

 

[Zimmy Lives]

A lost cause I am sure but here it goes.

For the trade down and passing on Floyd. He was not a playmaker and Marinelli did not want him.

Okay now for middle rounds.

Nobody we could get on OL or DT after the big run offer us more than Leary, Arkin, Kowalski, Price, Lissemore, Crawford, Bass, etc...we'd be basically churning.

Now is it better to churn depth or add valuable contributors at other positions?

If one can not see the difference both short and long term that Escobar, Williams, Randle, Wilcox, Webb and Holloman offer over project lineman to replace project lineman already in our system than you will never understand anything football related.

Preach on my monochrome, visually-impaired equine friend!

I like this draft much more than last year's and think quite a few guys can contribute.

 

[jzcowboy]

Problem is too many of our fans watch too much ESPN.

 

[BrAinPaiNt]

A lost cause I am sure but here it goes.

For the trade down and passing on Floyd. He was not a playmaker and Marinelli did not want him.

Okay now for middle rounds.

Nobody we could get on OL or DT after the big run offer us more than Leary, Arkin, Kowalski, Price, Lissemore, Crawford, Bass, etc...we'd be basically churning.

Now is it better to churn depth or add valuable contributors at other positions?

If one can not see the difference both short and long term that Escobar, Williams, Randle, Wilcox, Webb and Holloman offer over project lineman to replace project lineman already in our system than you will never understand anything football related.

I guess that is your OPINION.

 

[superpunk]

For the trade down and passing on Floyd. He was not a playmaker and Marinelli did not want him.

lmao I guess that settles it.

I don't disagree with the trade down pretty happy with what we got but this is just revisionist history nonsense. He was enough of a playmaker to be #7 on our board - and by all reports was the guy our HC wanted until Jerry went rogue and did his thing.

Time will tell if that works out for us or not. No need to make crap up like "He was not a playmaker" to justify the move. Hopefully Frederick and our extra third justify the move on their own.

 

[visionary]

Okay now for middle rounds.

Nobody we could get on OL or DT after the big run offer us more than Leary, Arkin, Kowalski, Price, Lissemore, Crawford, Bass, etc...we'd be basically churning.

.

Dont agree with this thinking at all

players picked after round 1

OL: that would be starting this year

Larry Warford
Brian Winters
Brian Schwenke
Barrett Jones
Brennan Williams (hurt but healthy by TC)


DL: that would be in the rotation this year and starting next year

Cornelius Carradine
Kawan Short
Bennie Logan
Damontre Moore
Jordan Hill
Akeem Spence

By the same token, i could make the argument that Escobar, Williams, Wilcox, and Webb are all not expected to be the starters this year

 

[JohnnyHopkins]

A lost cause I am sure but here it goes.

For the trade down and passing on Floyd. He was not a playmaker and Marinelli did not want him.

Okay now for middle rounds.

Nobody we could get on OL or DT after the big run offer us more than Leary, Arkin, Kowalski, Price, Lissemore, Crawford, Bass, etc...we'd be basically churning.

Now is it better to churn depth or add valuable contributors at other positions?

If one can not see the difference both short and long term that Escobar, Williams, Randle, Wilcox, Webb and Holloman offer over project lineman to replace project lineman already in our system than you will never understand anything football related.

It is a lost cause, but it is because the items in bold are only your opinion. Some reasonable conclusions, but still just an opinion that can be disputed by another poster's opinion.

 

[jterrell]

lmao I guess that settles it.

I don't disagree with the trade down pretty happy with what we got but this is just revisionist history nonsense. He was enough of a playmaker to be #7 on our board - and by all reports was the guy our HC wanted until Jerry went rogue and did his thing.

Time will tell if that works out for us or not. No need to make crap up like "He was not a playmaker" to justify the move. Hopefully Frederick and our extra third justify the move on their own.

in fairness he using actual words from the press conference here.

jerry said coaches felt he was a 1 tech right now but he could develop into or play 3T. and that the team wanted a true 1T or interior OL with that first pick because the guy needed to slot in day 1.

dallas had him as 7th overall so he would have been a value at 18 to be sure. plus 11 points. instead they got pick 74 who was our 26th overall player(a plus 48 points) and Frederick 22nd overall at 31 (plus 9 points)

So on our board we won with 57 overall points of value.

I HATED the trade at the time and do not like EVER taking less than draft chart value but in this regard when all was said and done it is REALLY hard to hard argue with the results. You can however argue with the scouting.

But what Jerry did worked according to the scouts own board. Probably why they were slightly miffed Thursday night then really satisfied later on when Tom C spoke.

 

[InmanRoshi]

Help me understand why it's a waste to draft a TE who's going to be a starter in your base package, or a WR who is going to play 40% of your total snaps in nickel, but it's not a waste to draft a defensive lineman who at best is going to be the 4th best DT on the roster and a cog in a heavy rotation.

Help me understand why what Shariff Floyd did against Vanderbuilt Commodores is so much more credible than what Brian Price did against the Atlanta Falcons.

 

[tm1119]

Well now you said it it must be 100% fact. How dare anybody have an opinion other than yours. Madness!

 

[RS12]

This team had too many holes to fix in one draft particularly with the scheme change on D. I do feel most of the guys they drafted have a good shot to be long term contributors. I think they will be more entertaining though somewhere around 500. Too me the pick with the highest bust potential is Wilcox, I would have gone Schwenke there. In the OP the list of guys he lists that they are going to get more out of that what could have been drafted there, that is his opininion, I think alot of those guys dont make the roster. Probably pushed off by June 1 or after cuts.

 

[superpunk]

in fairness he using actual words from the press conference here.

jerry said coaches felt he was a 1 tech right now but he could develop into or play 3T. and that the team wanted a true 1T or interior OL with that first pick because the guy needed to slot in day 1.

dallas had him as 7th overall so he would have been a value at 18 to be sure. plus 11 points. instead they got pick 74 who was our 26th overall player(a plus 48 points) and Frederick 22nd overall at 31 (plus 9 points)

So on our board we won with 57 overall points of value.

I HATED the trade at the time and do not like EVER taking less than draft chart value but in this regard when all was said and done it is REALLY hard to hard argue with the results. You can however argue with the scouting.

But what Jerry did worked according to the scouts own board. Probably why they were slightly miffed Thursday night then really satisfied later on when Tom C spoke.

It's all just spin doctor nonsense.

I don't dispute we shouldn't have picked him and it all worked out for the best. If he's not an option don't rank him 7th. If you feel he's not a playmaker, which was OP's argument, don't rank him 7th.

Ultimately it doesn't matter - I think we did the best possible thing. Just responding to the tortured logic and premise presented in this thread - that Floyd is some non-playmaker that we ranked 7th overall for who knows why. No, we thought he was the 7th best player in the draft. He fell to us, our HC wanted him, and Jerry overruled him. Tell it like it is no need to rewrite history.

 

[DFWJC]

Again I ask
Show me a link with quotes from Marinelli saying he did not want Floyd and I'll believe it.

I you cannot show that than please quit saying it.

I think Floyd was in our top 10 and certainly in our top 18. Do not know 100% for sure, but several people regualry inside Valley Ranch siad this is the case. One said as high as 7th.

I think Dallas just thought they could get and lineman and add another valuable pick by trading down.

Also, you have no clue whether or not some of the post 1st round oline and dline prosects will turn out better than what we have in rotation.

So you stop spouting that too, and claiming it gives you superior football knowledge.

Good grief

We'll see if any of them turn out. Until then, none of us knows for usre.

 

[jterrell]

It's all just spin doctor nonsense.

I don't dispute we shouldn't have picked him and it all worked out for the best. If he's not an option don't rank him 7th. If you feel he's not a playmaker, which was OP's argument, don't rank him 7th.

Ultimately it doesn't matter - I think we did the best possible thing. Just responding to the tortured logic and premise presented in this thread - that Floyd is some non-playmaker that we ranked 7th overall for who knows why. No, we thought he was the 7th best player in the draft. He fell to us, our HC wanted him, and Jerry overruled him. Tell it like it is no need to rewrite history.

I would have taken Floyd at 18 and ran up to the dias smiling like... well Jerry Jones fresh off a facelift.

BUT... common sense tells me Jerry doesn't write scouting reports or make them up. He reads them. I don't think he is spinning with Floyd. There were reports before the draft that Floyd was a "media creation". I think we probably rated him ahead of scouts (as proven by the fact he actually went 23rd in a draft where you could move up fairly easily).

I understand being frustrated by people's arguments but I think the meat is here for a solid one.

Ratliff threatened to beat Jerry senseless. If Jerry didn't want to draft his replacement I'd say he had reasons for it. Namely that Jerry never lets his money get mad.

 

[Cowboys22]

I think if we found a way to get our hands on Barrett Jones, pehaps with the second fourth rounder we should have had, i would let the questionable picks go. But one O Line pick in seven picks has to make you a little mad

It has been reported since the draft ended that they didn't think very highly of Jones. He was not rated higher than the players picked while he was still available. Everyone wants BPA and thats what they did for the most part.

 

[FuzzyLumpkins]

Help me understand why it's a waste to draft a TE who's going to be a starter in your base package, or a WR who is going to play 40% of your total snaps in nickel, but it's not a waste to draft a defensive lineman who at best is going to be the 4th best DT on the roster and a cog in a heavy rotation.

Help me understand why what Shariff Floyd did against Vanderbuilt Commodores is so much more credible than what Brian Price did against the Atlanta Falcons.

I would just like to see a dominant performance at some level. Even with Ansah you can watch him pop some tackles and get push and beat them with quickness.

The 4 or so games I watched of Floyd, I saw good effort but mostly I saw a guy that got blocked a lot. I have no idea what people are projecting from with Floyd.

 

[Idgit]

...I don't dispute we shouldn't have picked him and it all worked out for the best. If he's not an option don't rank him 7th. If you feel he's not a playmaker, which was OP's argument, don't rank him 7th....

This is my take, exactly. What's the point of setting up a board, otherwise.

Basically, we went off our board to get the last of the interior OLs we thought could start for us when it became apparent none of them might not be there for us in the second. Ie, we filled a position of need in the first instead of drafting from our board. I can live with that, but I don't see the point in pretending we did anything other than reach to fill a need.

At least we added Williams in the process, who was great value for us where we took him.