Are we a better team with Dak or Rush?

[xwalker]

Surely all of this rubbish we heard earlier in the season has subsided?

Our offense has been in top 5 since Prescott’s return. We were close to bottom 5 while with Rush.

The winning percentage is similar but I can’t imagine anyone still thinking this team has more potential heading into the playoffs with Rush over Prescott.

Read this article, especially the part about Rush vs Dak.

https://www.stampedeblue.com/2022/12/3/23491053/dak-prescott-is-the-real-deal-epa-success-rate

 

[CowboysFaninHouston]

You just don’t want to see it. I understand.

Turnovers from Dak help the defense apparently. I just don’t get why the stats don’t back it up.

sorry, I think you need to take your blinders off as you have tried to spin out of something you blindly said and now can't get out of.

so first you talk about defense tiring out...because of being on the field so much? I assume, but TOP showed, its exactly the opposite. you point to the turnovers as the cause of them being tired although TOP proves you wrong, but the difference is 0.8 Interceptions per game vs. 1.2...whole 0.5 interception per game difference and to simplify it for you, its 1 interception every other game. so this defense is exhausted and tiring out because of one interception every other game....

it couldn't be that the other team has to play more aggressively because cowboys offense scores more points and they have to keep up. nah, it couldn't be that. its because of 1 interception every other game. almost every offensive statistical category has improved.

and the stats back up exactly what I said. you have nothing to back up what you said, except your eye test and your agenda....you failed yet again and spinning yet again....your reputation precedes you. we expect nothing less than a spin.

 

[CowboysFaninHouston]

I’m talking

Dude I had two links in my post showing his hit this year and next year. I clearly said that it was next year where he becomes a cap albatross.

I am on the overthecap calculator quite often, so I get how things work. I just think Dak sucks. He is too inconsistent to trust for anything. He has two years left in his deal at 49m and 52m. Heck he will cost us 22m in 2025 even if he’s playing somewhere else.

JJ will likely move some of that 31m (2023 p5) to signing bonus which will lower his 23 cap hit…but that will just defer it to 24/25… we are still paying him that money.

ok, next year....so you are already dismissing next year? you don't think the contract gets redone perhaps? or we get cap room and yet all you cap pundits, never mentioned any names we should have signed and didn't because of cap space this past two years....including this year...why do you think that is? you cried two years ago that we won't have any talent on this team because of the contract. two years and none of it came true. and all you do is cry yet again....for something that you have no idea what will happen....

and show me the elites...and then show me the rest of the QBs that are not elites and tell me how they are all consistent..... you want Dak to be elite. he is not elite. and that's all you are hanging on to. you want an elite QB, and you can't name one QB we could have had or any QB that we can go get to replace Dak that's better and more consistent. I will kick Dak to the curb in a new york minute, if there is a QB that's better than him we can bring on to make us better.....somebody even went as far as arguing we should have drafted Lynch because he could have been better in dallas.....seriously

 

[CowboysFaninHouston]

Lol, because it is an absurd question that would require someone to build an actual career in general management of a football team. You don’t need a full account of every detail of the opinion for it to be valid. The bulk of us can see that many other squads have moved on from QB’s even when lots of money and personnel/planning have been used to build around that QB (even when the QB is still on the books for lots of money).

Plenty of teams move on from cores of teams when postseason success does not happen, even though regular season success is dependable with that core.

Here’s a handful of ideas (assuming no NFCCG game appearance or dreadful performances from Dak in the postseason). You keep Dak next season obviously because of cap implications, but eat the cap hit without extending the contract. Trade Tyron Smith, but if not possible-cut him and save $9.6 million next year. Cut Ezekiel Elliott and save a little less than $5 million. Cut Jourdan Lewis and save $5 million. All indications are that the 2023 cap will be well over $220 million. These moves and possibly extending Lawrence for another couple seasons with some more guaranteed money would put the Cowboys under the cap by at least $28M and possibly $35M or more.

Go after Da’Ron Payne with a good sized contract for a nose tackle with a bit of pass rush (maybe Tomlinson if that falls through). Maybe 3 years of guaranteed backloaded 5 year contract with $30-40M guaranteed. Look to re-sign Tony Pollard, but no more than Payne and probably only $30M guaranteed. Look to re-sign Fowler, Donovan Wilson, Jonathan Hankins, Jason Peters, Noah Brown, Conner McGovern to small or sub mid-tier short contracts. Not sure that Cooper Rush would stay as a backup and not sure his market value (may be too expensive to re-sign, nothing more than $4M per season).

The biggest move I would attempt is trading for Laremy Tunsil. Offer this year’s first and next year’s 3rd (but I would be willing to go with a 2nd rounder) and maybe a 5th rounder this year too and maybe a 4th rounder next year. Sign him to a major contract extension (5 years and backloaded).

Target cornerback, linebacker, center, interior defensive line and edge rushers in the draft.

There you go. A semi-plausible scenario. If Dak plays terrible in the postseason-you move on regardless (look to move up in the draft with future picks and maybe a player-not in 2023 though). If he looks very good AND the Cowboys make it to the NFCCG, you can look into an extension.

who are those teams? and who are those QBs that they moved on from? lets list them...

 

[bewp7]

dak BUT!!!!!!!

i would rather have rush then dak next year when he is a $50,000,000 cap hit and like 20+% of the cap by himself

 

[BoysForLife]

it couldn't be that the other team has to play more aggressively because cowboys offense scores more points and they have to keep up.

So apparently the other offense tries hard to score only when we score?

They're perfectly content to score 10-15 points a game unless the Cowboys force their hand

Amazing the stuff I learn on this forum

 

[Blitzen]

who are those teams? and who are those QBs that they moved on from? lets list them...

Eagles moved on from Wentz, LA Rams moved on from Goff, Chiefs moved on from Alex Smith, etc

 

[Cowboys1966]

ok, next year....so you are already dismissing next year? you don't think the contract gets redone perhaps? or we get cap room and yet all you cap pundits, never mentioned any names we should have signed and didn't because of cap space this past two years....including this year...why do you think that is? you cried two years ago that we won't have any talent on this team because of the contract. two years and none of it came true. and all you do is cry yet again....for something that you have no idea what will happen....

and show me the elites...and then show me the rest of the QBs that are not elites and tell me how they are all consistent..... you want Dak to be elite. he is not elite. and that's all you are hanging on to. you want an elite QB, and you can't name one QB we could have had or any QB that we can go get to replace Dak that's better and more consistent. I will kick Dak to the curb in a new york minute, if there is a QB that's better than him we can bring on to make us better.....somebody even went as far as arguing we should have drafted Lynch because he could have been better in dallas.....seriously

Dude? I already clearly said that we might redo his deal and move some of his 2023 p5 to 24/25… we are still paying him that money though, …The bottom line we have him for two more years and we owe him 120 million in cap charges…That’s 60m per season, though some of it will be paid later on in his voided year.

Even if we sign him to another extension, that 120 million isn’t going away. I think that JJ is desperate for another ring before he dies… And that is making him make desperate moves.

 

[BoysForLife]

Eagles moved on from Wentz, LA Rams moved on from Goff, Chiefs moved on from Alex Smith, etc

Yes but only 3 of those 3 teams you listed won the Super Bowl afterwards....

 

[xwalker]

Dude? I already clearly said that we might redo his deal and move some of his 2023 p5 to 24/25… we are still paying him that money though, …The bottom line we have him for two more years and we owe him 120 million in cap charges…That’s 60m per season, though some of it will be paid later on in his voided year.

Even if we sign him to another extension, that 120 million isn’t going away. I think that JJ is desperate for another ring before he dies… And that is making him make desperate moves.

If a team has to take cap hits in current or future seasons above the players contract average (40M for Dak) it is because they used the extra space in previous seasons on other players.

Two QBs could have 40M avg contracts but a team owes 60M on one and another teams owes 20M of cap space on the other one. Both cost the exact same amount. The difference is based on other players not on the QBs themselves.

 

[Cowboys1966]

If a team has to take cap hits in current or future seasons above the players contract average (40M for Dak) it is because they used the extra space in previous seasons on other players.

Two QBs could have 40M avg contracts but a team owes 60M on one and another teams owes 20M of cap space on the other one. Both cost the exact same amount. The difference is based on other players not on the QBs themselves.

I understand that. It doesn’t change what the next two years will be though. It would be softened if Dak was actually a good quarterback… But he sucks. As does Zeke who is also overpaid.

 

[toto1939]

We'd be a better team if we let Rush play the last 3 minutes of the first half to avoid a f-up INT from Dak giving the other team 7 points

 

[cnuball21]

I don’t understand how we have 14 pages of this nonsense.

We literally score almost 2 TDs more a game with Dak are in the top 5 in about every offensive stat that matters since he’s returned.

Yea, we need to limit the turnovers but this isn’t a Dak vs Rush thing…just look at the numbers and out your emotions aside.

Facts over feelings.

 

[kskboys]

I don’t understand how we have 14 pages of this nonsense.

We literally score almost 2 TDs more a game with Dak are in the top 5 in about every offensive stat that matters since he’s returned.

Yea, we need to limit the turnovers but this isn’t a Dak vs Rush thing…just look at the numbers and out your emotions aside.

Facts over feelings.

Yup. Rush is strictly a backup, and not a very talented one.

 

[DogFace]

Lol, because it is an absurd question that would require someone to build an actual career in general management of a football team. You don’t need a full account of every detail of the opinion for it to be valid. The bulk of us can see that many other squads have moved on from QB’s even when lots of money and personnel/planning have been used to build around that QB (even when the QB is still on the books for lots of money).

Plenty of teams move on from cores of teams when postseason success does not happen, even though regular season success is dependable with that core.

Here’s a handful of ideas (assuming no NFCCG game appearance or dreadful performances from Dak in the postseason). You keep Dak next season obviously because of cap implications, but eat the cap hit without extending the contract. Trade Tyron Smith, but if not possible-cut him and save $9.6 million next year. Cut Ezekiel Elliott and save a little less than $5 million. Cut Jourdan Lewis and save $5 million. All indications are that the 2023 cap will be well over $220 million. These moves and possibly extending Lawrence for another couple seasons with some more guaranteed money would put the Cowboys under the cap by at least $28M and possibly $35M or more.

Go after Da’Ron Payne with a good sized contract for a nose tackle with a bit of pass rush (maybe Tomlinson if that falls through). Maybe 3 years of guaranteed backloaded 5 year contract with $30-40M guaranteed. Look to re-sign Tony Pollard, but no more than Payne and probably only $30M guaranteed. Look to re-sign Fowler, Donovan Wilson, Jonathan Hankins, Jason Peters, Noah Brown, Conner McGovern to small or sub mid-tier short contracts. Not sure that Cooper Rush would stay as a backup and not sure his market value (may be too expensive to re-sign, nothing more than $4M per season).

The biggest move I would attempt is trading for Laremy Tunsil. Offer this year’s first and next year’s 3rd (but I would be willing to go with a 2nd rounder) and maybe a 5th rounder this year too and maybe a 4th rounder next year. Sign him to a major contract extension (5 years and backloaded).

Target cornerback, linebacker, center, interior defensive line and edge rushers in the draft.

There you go. A semi-plausible scenario. If Dak plays terrible in the postseason-you move on regardless (look to move up in the draft with future picks and maybe a player-not in 2023 though). If he looks very good AND the Cowboys make it to the NFCCG, you can look into an extension.

You have some good ideas. Tell me some teams that have moved on from a qb with multiple pro bowls and was leading the league in passing just a year or so ago. I don’t think it’s a good idea. We see many teams struggle for years because they can’t even get a decent QB.

Maybe I’m still scared from the pre Romo years, but it seems to me that getting a quality QB isn’t easy. Though he hasn’t played great in the playoffs overall, it seems the D has been more to blame for the losses.

At least you have some ideas, most just say move on with no plan. I still feel replacing him won’t be easy, but maybe I’m wrong.

 

[Section446]

Is neither an option?

 

[LovinItAll]

Surely all of this rubbish we heard earlier in the season has subsided?

Our offense has been in top 5 since Prescott’s return. We were close to bottom 5 while with Rush.

The winning percentage is similar but I can’t imagine anyone still thinking this team has more potential heading into the playoffs with Rush over Prescott.

I think we'd be better with The Hulk at RB, Thor at QB, and The Flash at WR. The entire cast of The Boys on defense and we'd most likely win a playoff game, but someone here would still lobby for Rush at QB.

 

[DuncanIso]

I would have no problems with Rush starting.

 

[CowboysFaninHouston]

So apparently the other offense tries hard to score only when we score?

They're perfectly content to score 10-15 points a game unless the Cowboys force their hand

Amazing the stuff I learn on this forum

no, that's not what was said.....

now, all of these arguments is over 3 points per game....totally meaningless about defense having become worse since rush...
lets not forget almost all offensive stats have increased including scoring.

but when you know you are going to get scored on more, then you have no choice but to be more aggressive, take more chances and a lot of times score late. Giants scored a meaningless TD at the end of the game. Bears were blown away and scored meaningless TD being down 42-21 in the 4th. those two scores account for 2 points per game during the 7 game span... oh well, color me "i don't care"....

so all of these debates is over 3 points per game as I said. totally meanngless argument.

 

[kskboys]

no, that's not what was said.....

now, all of these arguments is over 3 points per game....totally meaningless about defense having become worse since rush...
lets not forget almost all offensive stats have increased including scoring.

but when you know you are going to get scored on more, then you have no choice but to be more aggressive, take more chances and a lot of times score late. Giants scored a meaningless TD at the end of the game. Bears were blown away and scored meaningless TD being down 42-21 in the 4th. those two scores account for 2 points per game during the 7 game span... oh well, color me "i don't care"....

so all of these debates is over 3 points per game as I said. totally meanngless argument.

I want to know if people are really that dense, or do they purposely view stuff in an obtuse manner?