Atlanta Braves thread!!!

[DIAF]

Unknowledgable fan base indeed.. some silly Atlanta fan thinking he knows more about the Phillies than their own personel group.

That's funny, because you've done nothing but do this exact same thing all thread long.

I think you should be worried a little more about your own team first and why they keep losing to teams under .500 recently.

Maybe you should take your own advice to heart and stop crapping up this thread with your juvenile playground taunting.

dope. lol

Mature.

 

[RoyTheHammer]

That's funny, because you've done nothing but do this exact same thing all thread long..

By saying Uggla isn't a great hitter and not worth the huge contract? No, im pretty sure that's a given.

 

[Risen Star]

To me, Brown isn't ready yet. Ibanez is the guy I'd trust down the stretch and into the postseason. He's a tremendously streaky hitter, but when he's on he's really good. Better than Brown has shown in the brief time he's been in the big leagues.

I think going back to Lehigh Valley should be good for him.

Tough to criticize anything the Phillies do these days. They got the perfect player for them at the deadline. Like they seem to do every year.

In case you didn't notice, Ryan Howard seems to be thriving with Pence protecting him.

I thought Bourn was also a really good move. Fits what the Braves needed.

These two teams are headed for a 7 game showdown for the right to play in the world series. If the Giants don't pull another miracle run.

 

[RoyTheHammer]

I don't mean to say OBP is the be all end all in baseball.

There are other reasons to play Brown over Ibanez too. They refused to trade Brown at the deadline, so they obviously view him as part of the future. He doesn't need to learn how to hit AAA pitching. He's done that already. He has major league adjustments to make, and can't make them at AAA or playing twice a week in September.

Also, the only real advantage Ibanez has over Brown at this point is his SLG and that is slightly elevated by his high HR/FB rate. Brown also SLG'd much higher in the minors than he is right now. Again, he has major league adjustments to make.

The Phillies aren't that athletic as a team either, and Ibanez makes them worse on the basepaths too.

Not sure what they see in Ibanez anymore, outside of his current hot streak and his oversized contract.

He gives them a professional at bats, gets clutch hits, is on a tear recently, and makes the sure outs.. which again, is more than Brown can do. If you can't make the routine plays, you arn't going to play. That was Charlie's biggest problem with Dom.

He's basically going down for a month, to learn how to play leftfield. You can't play in the majors if you can't make the routine plays, and that's the main reason he's down. Their lineup is as good as any in baseball and they arn't having any problems scoring runs or winning games lately.

If you want to know what they see in Ibanez.. look no further than Dan Uggla. They see power in the middle of the lineup and a guy who can drive in runs. You can say driving in runs isn't a skill, but i'll take the guy who's hitting 100 points higher with runners in scoring position, and the guy who can make the routine plays.

I don't know that we've lost a game since Dom went down either, so clearly its not a big concern. He'll learn to play leftfield, come up in September, and be the starting LF next year.

 

[RoyTheHammer]

To me, Brown isn't ready yet. Ibanez is the guy I'd trust down the stretch and into the postseason. He's a tremendously streaky hitter, but when he's on he's really good. Better than Brown has shown in the brief time he's been in the big leagues.

I think going back to Lehigh Valley should be good for him.

Tough to criticize anything the Phillies do these days. They got the perfect player for them at the deadline. Like they seem to do every year.

In case you didn't notice, Ryan Howard seems to be thriving with Pence protecting him.

I thought Bourn was also a really good move. Fits what the Braves needed.

These two teams are headed for a 7 game showdown for the right to play in the world series. If the Giants don't pull another miracle run.

Braves need to step it up if they want to even make the playoffs. Arizona is coming on strong lately, only 2.5 games back in the WC race.

 

[casmith07]

Braves need to step it up if they want to even make the playoffs. Arizona is coming on strong lately, only 2.5 games back in the WC race.

It'll be a different story when McCann and Chipper are back in the lineup with Bourn on the roster now.

We need to dump Derek Lowe and dump him fast, though. He's going to cost us the playoffs.

 

[RoyTheHammer]

It'll be a different story when McCann and Chipper are back in the lineup with Bourn on the roster now.

We need to dump Derek Lowe and dump him fast, though. He's going to cost us the playoffs.

Yea, what's he lost like 3 or 4 starts in a row now?

His ERA is approaching 5 too i believe. Don't know what's going on with him.

 

[SA_Gunslinger]

It must really suck to be over 60 wins and still be 8 games back in the division.

:laugh2:

This is continued payback for the 90's and I am enjoying every minute of it.

 

[tko112204]

He gives them a professional at bats, gets clutch hits, is on a tear recently, and makes the sure outs.. which again, is more than Brown can do. If you can't make the routine plays, you arn't going to play. That was Charlie's biggest problem with Dom.

He's basically going down for a month, to learn how to play leftfield. You can't play in the majors if you can't make the routine plays, and that's the main reason he's down. Their lineup is as good as any in baseball and they arn't having any problems scoring runs or winning games lately.

If you want to know what they see in Ibanez.. look no further than Dan Uggla. They see power in the middle of the lineup and a guy who can drive in runs. You can say driving in runs isn't a skill, but i'll take the guy who's hitting 100 points higher with runners in scoring position, and the guy who can make the routine plays.

I don't know that we've lost a game since Dom went down either, so clearly its not a big concern. He'll learn to play leftfield, come up in September, and be the starting LF next year.

1. Yet still makes more outs.
2. How clutch would his hits be if no one was on base? One hit isn't better than another. Stop using RBIs. You can't "hit better" with RISP or else you would hit that way all the time.
3. Yet costs his team more outs.

Yay.

 

[casmith07]

Yea, what's he lost like 3 or 4 starts in a row now?

His ERA is approaching 5 too i believe. Don't know what's going on with him.

Control issues. He's laying EVERYTHING right over the middle of the plate.

 

[RoyTheHammer]

1. Yet still makes more outs.
2. How clutch would his hits be if no one was on base? One hit isn't better than another. Stop using RBIs. You can't "hit better" with RISP or else you would hit that way all the time.
3. Yet costs his team more outs.

He doesn't cost his team more outs.. he makes the plays that he should make and has average range. Brown has good range, but can't make the play when he gets there anyway. Think about it..

Say what you want, but RBI's matter. That's why the guys who drive in the most runs get the big contracts. Its simple as well if you think about it. That's why there are guys on every team who are there to get on base, and guys in the middle of the lineup who excel at driving in runs and hitting for power. Its not a coincidence that every team has the same setup. If you wouldn't take the player who's hitting 100 points better with RISP you're either stupid, or just being silly. Either way, this debate is pointless. Ibanez is the guy everyone would trust down the stretch run and in the postseason.. so keep talking about how he sucks while he keeps hitting and we keep winning.

 

[RoyTheHammer]

Control issues. He's laying EVERYTHING right over the middle of the plate.

That's rough. You would think a guy who's been in the bigs as long as he has would be able to make adjustments. Maybe he's just getting old and losing it.

 

[Risen Star]

The scary thing about the Phils, Roy Oswalt is coming back to the rotation this week.

If he's anything like he was before his back flared up, wow.

 

[DIAF]

It'll be a different story when McCann and Chipper are back in the lineup with Bourn on the roster now.

We need to dump Derek Lowe and dump him fast, though. He's going to cost us the playoffs.

Mike Minor and Julio Teheren are 30 miles down I-85 in Gwinnett, pitching like they are bored.

It's time to say goodbye to Derek.

 

[DIAF]

Say what you want, but RBI's matter. That's why the guys who drive in the most runs get the big contracts. Its simple as well if you think about it. That's why there are guys on every team who are there to get on base, and guys in the middle of the lineup who excel at driving in runs and hitting for power. Its not a coincidence that every team has the same setup. If you wouldn't take the player who's hitting 100 points better with RISP you're either stupid, or just being silly. Either way, this debate is pointless. Ibanez is the guy everyone would trust down the stretch run and in the postseason.. so keep talking about how he sucks while he keeps hitting and we keep winning.

This is ridiculous. Of course the guys that collect RBIs get the big contracts, because they are usually better hitters than the dude hitting 7th or 8th in the lineup. These guys are better at getting on base, NOT MAKING OUTS, and hitting for power to move the guys further along the bases. Not because "they collect RBI". If you have a .250 hitter with decent power and 3 guys who excel at getting on base hitting in front of him, guess what, he's going to collect RBIs. But he's still the same hitter if you bat him 4th or 8th. The only thing separating the two situations is opportunity.

 

[tko112204]

He doesn't cost his team more outs.. he makes the plays that he should make and has average range. Brown has good range, but can't make the play when he gets there anyway. Think about it..

Say what you want, but RBI's matter. That's why the guys who drive in the most runs get the big contracts. Its simple as well if you think about it. That's why there are guys on every team who are there to get on base, and guys in the middle of the lineup who excel at driving in runs and hitting for power. Its not a coincidence that every team has the same setup. If you wouldn't take the player who's hitting 100 points better with RISP you're either stupid, or just being silly. Either way, this debate is pointless. Ibanez is the guy everyone would trust down the stretch run and in the postseason.. so keep talking about how he sucks while he keeps hitting and we keep winning.

I don't have to think about it. And I don't have to take some guy on the internet's word for it. Ibanez is worse at preventing runs on defense and worse at avoiding outs on offense. I spelled this all out in my previous post.

And I wouldn't take this argument to a knowledgeable baseball board and start talking about how I'm "stupid" because I don't think RBIs matter.

News flash, neither does anyone who is thinking, or writing about baseball in an analytical way. I don't care if you love Ryan Howard because he has a bunch of RBIs. If you put him on the Pirates or the Astros, would he have as many RBIs?? Of course not. Then what does that have to do with how good he is?

 

[Muhast]

Mike Minor and Julio Teheren are 30 miles down I-85 in Gwinnett, pitching like they are bored.

It's time to say goodbye to Derek.

Julio came into my store yesterday. Nice guy. Signed a few hats for me.

 

[DIAF]

I don't have to think about it. And I don't have to take some guy on the internet's word for it. Ibanez is worse at preventing runs on defense and worse at avoiding outs on offense. I spelled this all out in my previous post.

And I wouldn't take this argument to a knowledgeable baseball board and start talking about how I'm "stupid" because I don't think RBIs matter.

News flash, neither does anyone who is thinking, or writing about baseball in an analytical way. I don't care if you love Ryan Howard because he has a bunch of RBIs. If you put him on the Pirates or the Astros, would he have as many RBIs?? Of course not. Then what does that have to do with how good he is?

Maybe this would help better illustrate to Roy..

A. Is Ryan Howard awesome because he averages 140 RBI a year?

Or

B. is Ryan Howard awesome because he has a career per-162 game OPS of over .900 and hits 46 home runs a year?

The answer is simple. Of course it's B. He gets on base, hits for power. Not because he piles up RBIs. If he puts up those same numbers (OPS of .930 and hits 45 homers) on the Pirates or Astros, he wouldn't have near that many RBI.

 

[tko112204]

Maybe this would help better illustrate to Roy..

A. Is Ryan Howard awesome because he averages 140 RBI a year?

Or

B. is Ryan Howard awesome because he has a career per-162 game OPS of over .900 and hits 46 home runs a year?

The answer is simple. Of course it's B. He gets on base, hits for power. Not because he piles up RBIs. If he puts up those same numbers (OPS of .930 and hits 45 homers) on the Pirates or Astros, he wouldn't have near that many RBI.

While B is true, it does ignore the fact that both of those career averages don't show the clear decline he is in now. And that's before the contract extension has even kicked in...

2009: OPS: .931 ISO: .292 wOBA: .393 (Basically his peak avg from 06-09)

2010: OPS: .859 ISO: .229 wOBA: .367

2011: OPS: .848 ISO: .240 wOBA: .356

Ryan Howard was a great player, but 1B with big bodies age poorly. And despite his high RBI numbers this season, he isn't near the player he was even 2 years ago.

 

[RoyTheHammer]

This is ridiculous. Of course the guys that collect RBIs get the big contracts, because they are usually better hitters than the dude hitting 7th or 8th in the lineup. These guys are better at getting on base, NOT MAKING OUTS, and hitting for power to move the guys further along the bases. Not because "they collect RBI". If you have a .250 hitter with decent power and 3 guys who excel at getting on base hitting in front of him, guess what, he's going to collect RBIs. But he's still the same hitter if you bat him 4th or 8th. The only thing separating the two situations is opportunity.

Yet you don't see cleanup hitters and 8 hole hitters used interchangably in lineups throughout the league.. wonder why that is? Because alot of cleanup hitters are exactly that, pure power guys who don't hit for the greatest averages.

Who's more likely to drive the ball deep and drive in runs.. Raul Ibanez or Carlos Ruiz?