Best Cowboy WR Since Irvin Was Drafted

[5Stars]

OH MY GOD! Maybe that's a common expression, but it's the first time I've come across it.

No, it's not a common expression at all! Find more posts by Iceberg and you will find some of the funniest/craziest things coming from him...I have no friggen clue where he comes up with stuff like that!

:laugh2:

(i think it's shrooms...has to be)


"Hammered moose turds..."?

 

[BrAinPaiNt]

Could you Fedex me one of those dispensers? Every time I check the poll and see the leader's name, I feel the need for drugs. Valium would be very nice right about now.

It is in the mail...

A valium you need

:

 

[iceberg]

One more in a long line of well-thought out responses.

Wow. Your comprehension is astounding. Why would I quit talking to you? Have I said in this thread that I don't care about your opinion? I do care, which is why I'm on an internet forum, and I'm not going to hide behind some "I don't care" skirt just because I cannot address the points the people on the other side bring up. I'll either acknowledge them as salient, or counter.

Not this weak-minded "I don't care" bull. If I didn't care, I wouldn't respond. Same goes for you and anyone else who trots out that tired excuse.

More on-topic, TO's presence has correlation to our enormous offensive improvement, whereas Glenn's does not, or is less so. If anyone cares to address the extent of that, I'd love to get into it. But I'll stop with the pissing match.

you're confusing my comprehension with my apathy in this instance.

and good - it was old before it started.

 

[adamknite]

More on-topic, TO's presence has correlation to our enormous offensive improvement, whereas Glenn's does not, or is less so. If anyone cares to address the extent of that, I'd love to get into it. But I'll stop with the pissing match.

There's no doubt that TO improved our offence the day he was signed, but I think putting Romo in as the starting QB had more effect then Owens. Where Owens was helping our offence and gave it a new dynamic the addition of Romo improved it even more. I do think Owens has more of an effect on our offensive production then Glenn does, but if we're talking about what player, and not just WR's, improved our offence the most, i say it was Romo. Since he was more moble and was more willing to spread the ball around to different recievers and not focus on Glenn.

 

[Crown Royal]

Before you read the rest of them, please read that one again - and notice that it refers to the correlation between TO's arrival in Dallas and our increase in OFFENSIVE production. Not WR production. I thought that was clear in the post (reading it again, it was) but there has been confusion.

I did read the rest of the pages. It seems funny to me that while everyone else seems to have found some confusion in the post, you continue to feel it was completely clear. It must suck to be smarter than all of us.

But since you have clarified, I will answer it a bit more:

As I have stated in other threads this offseason, while our offense was better last year than it has been, I still feel we have a tendency to overrate it. I don't care for the system, and I feel that we are in for a possible let down next year.

No doubt TO opened up the offense. He is an excellent WR, and is much mroe dangerous than Keyshawn Johnson. I personally feel that he was productive even if he wasn't used the best he could have been, and I think very highly of his talent.

That doesn't change my vote, though. I never said that TO wasn't the best WR on this team since Irvin. In fact, I think he likely is. But that isn't how I interpreted the question. Glenn has done more to serve the Cowboys than TO, at this point.

And if you really want to get into how much a WR helps the offense, I suppose we can discuss the offensive improvement between 2002 and 2003 as well.

 

[iceberg]

No, it's not a common expression at all! Find more posts by Iceberg and you will find some of the funniest/craziest things coming from him...I have no friggen clue where he comes up with stuff like that!

:laugh2:

(i think it's shrooms...has to be)


"Hammered moose turds..."?

i would have to do shrooms to have them have that effect. : )

maybe i should try 'em. you seem to recommend 'em a lot...

 

[cowboyeric8]

I chose the Raghib Ramadian Ismail or "Rocket" because of his years of service to the team. Also the way he played the game, he got injured trying to block down field. Team player who played with heart. And he is part of the reason I am crazy about the Cowboys.

And all you TO people, I counted in years of service and playing with heart. Blah blah blah, I don't care about that. And yes I know some of the people on the poll have had more years and more stats.

But mainly I just like the guy and the way he played. And I think he was wronged when everybody started photoshopping his photos to put "Owens" on the back. During the whole Owens thing, ha.

 

[superpunk]

There's no doubt that TO improved our offence the day he was signed, but I think putting Romo in as the starting QB had more effect then Owens. Where Owens was helping our offence and gave it a new dynamic the addition of Romo improved it even more. I do think Owens has more of an effect on our offensive production then Glenn does, but if we're talking about what player, and not just WR's, improved our offence the most, i say it was Romo. Since he was more moble and was more willing to spread the ball around to different recievers and not focus on Glenn.

Our offense did at least appear more dynamic with Romo in there - but we scored 29 ppg with Bledsoe, and 25 with Romo - it's not like there's a huge amount of correlation between Romo's insertion and the offensive explosion.

Romo kept us from falling apart, I think - because that's where we were headed with Julius sucking it up - but there is no evidence to suggest that it was strongly his presence that made this offense great. It was already performing great. (like I said, without Romo it would have fallen off completely, so don't think I'm downplaying his contribution)

I would put our offensive explosion (for a large part) on TO and what he makes possible. He arrived this year, and our offense exploded. There were other reasons, largely (IMO) replacing the NFL's two worst tackles, but TO was a HUGE reason.

 

[superpunk]

I did read the rest of the pages. It seems funny to me that while everyone else seems to have found some confusion in the post, you continue to feel it was completely clear. It must suck to be smarter than all of us.

What can I say? I'm blessed.

If you can read that post, and come away thinking it was about WR production, then you just singled one statement about Glenn out - It is CLEAR, in the first sentence, that I am talking about the offensive explosion from 05 to 06.

That doesn't change my vote, though. I never said that TO wasn't the best WR on this team since Irvin. In fact, I think he likely is. But that isn't how I interpreted the question. Glenn has done more to serve the Cowboys than TO, at this point.

I don't see the question that way - but Glenn has definitely done more. Of course, that's a completely unfair evaluation, considering it sets a standard TO can't possibly live up to (due to tenure) - so why even include him?

And if you really want to get into how much a WR helps the offense, I suppose we can discuss the offensive improvement between 2002 and 2003 as well.

We did improve from 13 ppg to 18 ppg. So that is a definite point. Glenn didn't have the season TO had in 2003, and we kind of stagnated after that, but there is definite correlation there.

 

[Facin'Fools]

Think its funny how all of the "new" cowboys fan dont realize how your greats did it, so many short term minds.....Alvin Harper was a menace....T.O. had a good season....

 

[adamknite]

Our offense did at least appear more dynamic with Romo in there - but we scored 29 ppg with Bledsoe, and 25 with Romo - it's not like there's a huge amount of correlation between Romo's insertion and the offensive explosion.

Romo kept us from falling apart, I think - because that's where we were headed with Julius sucking it up - but there is no evidence to suggest that it was strongly his presence that made this offense great. It was already performing great. (like I said, without Romo it would have fallen off completely, so don't think I'm downplaying his contribution)

I would put our offensive explosion (for a large part) on TO and what he makes possible. He arrived this year, and our offense exploded. There were other reasons, largely (IMO) replacing the NFL's two worst tackles, but TO was a HUGE reason.

Good points. I agree that TO had a very large part to due with our offensive success. Look at Romo's completion percentage on third downs, that's keeping drives going and chewing the clock. That's a good boost to an offense right there. When Bledsoe was in an obvious passing situation he'd get sacked a lot, killing our drives, but Romo in those same situations kept them going. Owens = very good upgrade over Keyshawn. Romo = major upgrade over Bledsoe. I try to look at it like this, would our offence suffer more if we took Romo out or if we took Owens out and I think it'd probably take more of a hit if Romo wasn't there. Just my opinion though.

 

[Vintage]

Superpunk's point isn't hard to understand Crown Royal.

It just requires basic reading comprehension.

You either lack it or misread what superpunk said (the latter happens all the time; no big deal).

 

[theogt]

Think its funny how all of the "new" cowboys fan dont realize how your greats did it, so many short term minds.....Alvin Harper was a menace....T.O. had a good season....

Don't be silly, Alvin Harper was nowhere near as good as TO.

 

[superpunk]

Good points. I agree that TO had a very large part to due with our offensive success. Look at Romo's completion percentage on third downs, that's keeping drives going and chewing the clock. That's a good boost to an offense right there. When Bledsoe was in an obvious passing situation he'd get sacked a lot, killing our drives, but Romo in those same situations kept them going. Owens = very good upgrade over Keyshawn. Romo = major upgrade over Bledsoe. I try to look at it like this, would our offence suffer more if we took Romo out or if we took Owens out and I think it'd probably take more of a hit if Romo wasn't there. Just my opinion though.

Like I said, Romo kept us afloat. Everything else fell to crap, and he rose up - so I agree that he is more valuable. That still kind of gets off track.

Our offensive production with and without Romo was similar.

Our offensive production with and without TO is night and day. While Romo saved us (since our running game fell off completely), TO at least appears to have been a major catalyst in our offensive explosion. I think you agreed with that.

Thanks for actually addressing the idea.

 

[superpunk]

misread what superpunk said (the latter happens all the time; no big deal).

quoted for truth - i am srsly.

 

[DallasEast]

It is in the mail...

A valium you need

:

May the Force be with you, good sir!

 

[iceberg]

Superpunk's point isn't hard to understand Crown Royal.

It just requires basic reading comprehension.

You either lack it or misread what superpunk said (the latter happens all the time; no big deal).

or you interpret the question differently.

funny how some can realize the question itself isn't "bulletproof" in what is being asked and some can't.

 

[DallasEast]

Don't be silly, Alvin Harper was nowhere near as good as TO.

:signmast: (as much as I may dislike it)

 

[adamknite]

Like I said, Romo kept us afloat. Everything else fell to crap, and he rose up - so I agree that he is more valuable. That still kind of gets off track.

Our offensive production with and without Romo was similar.

Our offensive production with and without TO is night and day. While Romo saved us (since our running game fell off completely), TO at least appears to have been a major catalyst in our offensive explosion. I think you agreed with that.

Thanks for actually addressing the idea.

I see what you mean. Looking at just the numbers, you are right. TO definetly improved our offence more. But from watching the games and seeing Romo in there compared to Bledsoe, there was just this different aspect. Sometimes numbers don't tell the whole story, Romo even in his worst performances was so much better than Bledsoe for whatever reasons.

No problem, when there is about 12 pages of argument sometimes you've gotta stop and have a real discussion, lolZ .

 

[superpunk]

I see what you mean. Looking at just the numbers, you are right. TO definetly improved our offence more. But from watching the games and seeing Romo in there compared to Bledsoe, there was just this different aspect. Sometimes numbers don't tell the whole story, Romo even in his worst performances was so much better than Bledsoe for whatever reasons.

If Romo had the run support from his #1 back that Bledsoe got - we'd have annihilated the league. And Tony's QB rating would have been well over 100. I am absolutely confident in that. People forget Julius was averaging over 100 ypg before we ditched Bledsoe. Then he fell apart, and Romo had to do it all.

Certainly encouraging for next year, if JJ steps it up and we get a more dynamic run game.