Big Contracts in 2019 - The real reason Dez was released

[GhostOfPelluer]

We need to stop with the idea that Dak isn't worth $17-20 million/year. That is what an average starting QB in the league is worth right now. There is no objective measure that says Dak is a below average QB. You can find many ways to say he isn't elite, but he's also not below average.

If Dak has a monster year - his rookie year was pretty dang close - then he's making $30 million+/year on his next deal. And it will probably come after the 2018 season. That is what a stud QB will be paid in the NFL moving forward. We need to wrap our minds around that number because that's what's coming unless Dak regresses.

 

[xwalker]

@Jumbo075 with this trend our FO is taking(Witten wasnt by design), what do you think the odds of Crawford being cut this offseason are?

Doesn't provide much CAP relief initially but over the life of the contract is a larger amount.

The cap savings to cut vs keep Crawford for 2018 is 6M.

For Crawford that is 1.8M this year and 4.2M next year but that does not matter. They could push 4.2M from some other player's contract into 2019, get the full 6M this year and pay for the 4.2M in 2019 with the 4.2M saved on Crawford such that the net result is 6M saved in 2018 and zero change to the 2019 cap space.

They could also do a post June 1st cut which would be even easier.

 

[Diehardblues]

You are contradicting yourself, in one post arguing the Cowboys didn't want him at any price, and in the next arguing the Cowboys were upset he wouldn't negotiate with them. You can't reasonably waffle back and forth as needed to fit a narrative.

A trade may not have been a likely scenario, but there was no reason to not at least make the effort to see if a team wanted him enough to take the contract for one year. Between that and the team weighing it's options, those are a much better explanations for a 2-3 week delay than simply that the team was being spiteful.

Why do you think Anderson, Worley, Marshall, Fleener and Tyrell Williams were all released even later than Dez? Were the Broncos, Eagles, Giants, Saints and Chargers all acting out of spite too?

I’m not familiar with those other players situations and can’t offer a comparison.

 

[buybuydandavis]

1. Zack Martin - the Cowboys are trying to sign Martin to a long-term deal this year. If they are unsuccessful, he'll be the franchise tag player a year from now.
2. DeMarcus Lawrence - if he repeats his performance from last year, will command a long-term contract worth slightly less than Prescott's deal
3. David Irving - this physical freak of nature hasn't yet put together a complete, unsuspended, uninjured year.

1. Ezekiel Elliott - The Cowboys will be in talks with him in 2020, just as they are talking to Zack Martin now.
2. La'el Collins - Collins current contract will expire after the 2019 season, and he'll be a free agent. If Collins develops into one of the better Right Tackles in the NFL, the Cowboys will want to lock him up on a long-term contract.

A lot of these contracts are optional.

We probably sign Martin. I can see not wanting to spend on a G, but they aren't that expensive, and they're already sizing him for his gold jacket.
But I don't think we franchise Martin. Strangely, the NFL treats all olinemen as part of the same pool to determine franchise values, meaning T prices, not G prices.

Williams makes Collins expendable. LG to RT pipeline keeps coming. Williams is probably a better RT than LG.

They didn't seem too intent on protecting Irving this year. Given his personal issues, I can see them letting him walk. Not the best guy to invest in long term. If they were really interested in that, the time to do it would have been this offseason. A good comp pick coming our way.

Zeke - they moved on from Murray. Resigning seems unlikely. 5th year. Franchise after. 6 years of mileage on him. Do we want him for the second half dozen? I wouldn't think so.
Plenty of time to groom a replacement. Or two. We'll see if they take a mid round RB next year. They should for the next few years.

 

[OmerV]

I’m not familiar with those other players situations and can’t offer a comparison.

I get that you can't be specific, but the point is that waiting that long is not the kind of unusual and baffling event you make it out to be, and there actually can be reasons a team might wait besides an act of spite. Yet you are dismissing this and preferring to go with the soap opera explanation.

 

[DanA]

Murray wasn’t Zeke. He was a good player but Zeke is special.

 

[buybuydandavis]

The cap savings to cut vs keep Crawford for 2018 is 6M.

For Crawford that is 1.8M this year and 4.2M next year but that does not matter. They could push 4.2M from some other player's contract into 2019, get the full 6M this year and pay for the 4.2M in 2019 with the 4.2M saved on Crawford such that the net result is 6M saved in 2018 and zero change to the 2019 cap space.

They could also do a post June 1st cut which would be even easier.

I agree on the bold. When you're in good cap shape, *when* cap hits fall is largely an accounting choice. There is some inflation with the cap expanding every year, but that's a secondary effect.

Dead cap is dead. What you save is salary you don't pay. Crawford is slated for 6mil this year. That's what we would save by letting him go.

 

[big dog cowboy]

Zeke - they moved on from Murray. Resigning seems unlikely. 5th year. Franchise after. 6 years of mileage on him. Do we want him for the second half dozen? I wouldn't think so.

Those are 2 completely different situations.

Murray wanted to be paid like an elite RB and Zeke actually is.

 

[Diehardblues]

I get that you can't be specific, but the point is that waiting that long is not the kind of unusual and baffling event you make it out to be, and there actually can be reasons a team might wait besides an act of spite. Yet you are dismissing this and preferring to go with the soap opera explanation.

Im not totally dismissing it. I’m just leaning towards we didn’t treat Dez like we had with Murray and Ware. And that has brought some bad blood with Dez. I didn’t create that soap opera. Just offering my view based on the info provided thus far.

 

[Jumbo075]

Yes, his contract made the decision easier but I don't think it was as big of an issue as it might seem.

I think Stephen used contract vs performance as a reason to justify the Dez cut to Jerry; however, I convinced they just wanted him gone regardless. Linehan and the WR coach don't care about the contract.

If Dez was getting paid 2M per I think they would have traded him. The catch is that if he was getting paid 2M per he would not have had developed into as big of a Diva. He was a borderline character type player before but once he got the huge contract with huge guaranteed money it made it impossible to coach him.

I obviously dislike Dez but if my employer treated me the way the Cowboys treated Dez, I would have become a Diva also.

On a personal note, I worked at a company for several years where I was paid more than all other employees except the guy at the very top. I was not even a manager, just an expert in my field. Looking back I realize I developed into a bit of a Diva. It was difficult to listen to managers that I knew were getting paid about 50% of what I was making. It was easy to feel that the rules didn't apply to me. Despite the sense of entitlement that I developed, I still worked more hours than everyone else just because I'm obsessive in that regard. I guess my entitlement was similar to Witten expecting to play 100% of the snaps or Romo ignoring the coaches to call his own play.

I'm not actually interested in talking about Dez. I added it to the headline to get more views...as bait.

 

[buybuydandavis]

Those are 2 completely different situations.

Murray wanted to be paid like an elite RB and Zeke actually is.

Murray's production was plenty elite.

No two situations are existentially identical. But they're similar.

One difference plays *against* signing Elliot. We have the 5th year option on him, but didn't for Murray. That's one more year of running him down, making it *less* likely we want to sign a new contract on him.

 

[Jumbo075]

A lot of these contracts are optional.

We probably sign Martin. I can see not wanting to spend on a G, but they aren't that expensive, and they're already sizing him for his gold jacket.
But I don't think we franchise Martin. Strangely, the NFL treats all olinemen as part of the same pool to determine franchise values, meaning T prices, not G prices.

Williams makes Collins expendable. LG to RT pipeline keeps coming. Williams is probably a better RT than LG.

They didn't seem too intent on protecting Irving this year. Given his personal issues, I can see them letting him walk. Not the best guy to invest in long term. If they were really interested in that, the time to do it would have been this offseason. A good comp pick coming our way.

Zeke - they moved on from Murray. Resigning seems unlikely. 5th year. Franchise after. 6 years of mileage on him. Do we want him for the second half dozen? I wouldn't think so.
Plenty of time to groom a replacement. Or two. We'll see if they take a mid round RB next year. They should for the next few years.

Of course the contracts are optional - all of them. But the Cowboys have to make plans as if a lot of these guys are going to be studs. If they don't turn out to be studs, then obviously, they don't get the big contracts. But the Cowboys have to make plans for continuity if all the pieces come together for them to make a multi-year run at championships.

 

[kevm3]

It's hilarious the notion being floated around here that Dak is some mediocre or below average qb. We have a coaching staff that couldn't win more than 1 game with 4 different qbs in their arsenal once Romo went out and we have a rookie who went 13 and 3 and 9 and 7, and yet 'fans' are trying to paint him as some inaccurate system qb but have the audacity to cheer on wentz when dak was more accurate than wentz in his first year and the eagles didn't miss a beat with wentz out. The real nightmare would be we let dak go and retain garrett and dak goes to another coaching staff and starts hoisting up super bowl trophies while we are in qb wasteland hoping that we can get out of the second round with our abc 123 offensive schemes.

 

[xwalker]

I'm not actually interested in talking about Dez. I added it to the headline to get more views...as bait.

Dez was central to the theme of the thread title:

Big Contracts in 2019 - The real reason Dez was released

 

[Hawkeye0202]

Back in 1989, Jimmy Johnson's Cowboys didn't have many good established players. The one great player they had was Herschel Walker. So they traded him to the Vikings for 7 draft picks, and 5 players. We all know what came next.

Flash forward to 2018, and the Cowboys already have a bunch of good young players, but they need Salary CAP space in 2019 & 2020 - a lot of salary CAP space - to resign that good young talent base. So, a choice was made to part with Dez Bryant this season, and eat his entire Salary CAP hit. That reduces the Cowboys salary CAP hits by about $25M over two seasons. Witten's retirement frees up another $26M over the next 4 years. The Cowboys parted ways with Romo last year, freeing up $54M in CAP space planned for 2017-2019.

Similar to the Herschel Walker decision, these choices allow the team to commit to younger talented players, and they hope is that a similar result will happen to when the Cowboys made a similar commitment to youth 29 years ago.

The Cowboys have a number of players that will likely take a large chunk of the salary CAP in 2019 with much higher salaries than they currently are being paid.

1. Dak Prescott - will command a contract worth $18-$22M per season, perhaps more.
2. Zack Martin - the Cowboys are trying to sign Martin to a long-term deal this year. If they are unsuccessful, he'll be the franchise tag player a year from now. If they do sign him this year, his salary CAP hit next year will be substantial
3. DeMarcus Lawrence - if he repeats his performance from last year, will command a long-term contract worth slightly less than Prescott's deal
4. David Irving - this physical freak of nature hasn't yet put together a complete, unsuspended, uninjured year. If he does, the Cowboys will want to keep him around, and he might want a contract similar to the one the Cowboys anticipate giving Lawrence.

In 2020, these players will have their contracts coming up for extensions or renewals.

1. Byron Jones - the Cowboys picked up his 5th year option, and new DB coach Kris Richard calls him the "prototypical" cornerback for his system. That means the Cowboys will be paying Jones a lot more in 2019. If he breaks out over the next two seasons under Richard, he'll command top dollars in 2020.
   
2. Ezekiel Elliott - while the Cowboys will almost certainly exercise the 5th year option on Elliott, his contract will be subject to renewal in 2020. Since entering the league, he's led the NFL in per game rushing yards each of his first two seasons. The Cowboys will be in talks with him in 2020, just as they are talking to Zack Martin now.
3. La'el Collins - Collins current contract will expire after the 2019 season, and he'll be a free agent. If Collins develops into one of the better Right Tackles in the NFL, the Cowboys will want to lock him up on a long-term contract.
4. Jaylon Smith - Smith will be a restricted free agent in 2020, and the Cowboys can keep him by giving him a 1st round tender offer. If he's fully healed, and back to performing like the top 5 pick many thought he'd be, then the Cowboys may choose to give him a long term extension earlier to potentially save money over time.
5. Randy Gregory - Like Jaylon Smith, Gregory will also be a Restricted Free Agent in 2020. Like Jaylon, he was considered a top 5 talent in the draft that fell to the Cowboys in the 2nd round, and like Smith, he missed some seasons because of those reasons. But if he also comes back and performs at his talent level, the Cowboys will be talking about how to keep him with the Cowboys on a long-term deal.

So, the Cowboys potentially have at least 9 big new contracts over the next two seasons to keep their young talent base intact. Managing the Salary CAP now also includes planning for 2019 and 2020. Those focused only on this year's Salary CAP are missing the bigger picture.

Not sure if I'm the only notice, but over the last 7-8 years, it seems only PRO BOWL Cowboy players are paid 2nd contracts, others walk. From the list above, unless they're selected All-Pro, Collins, Jone, and Irving will be next to walk.
In fact, DLaw will need to at least improve his 2017 production to finally get his long-term deal IMO. Anything less, they make let him walk.

 

[Redball Express]

Back in 1989, Jimmy Johnson's Cowboys didn't have many good established players. The one great player they had was Herschel Walker. So they traded him to the Vikings for 7 draft picks, and 5 players. We all know what came next.

Flash forward to 2018, and the Cowboys already have a bunch of good young players, but they need Salary CAP space in 2019 & 2020 - a lot of salary CAP space - to resign that good young talent base. So, a choice was made to part with Dez Bryant this season, and eat his entire Salary CAP hit. That reduces the Cowboys salary CAP hits by about $25M over two seasons. Witten's retirement frees up another $26M over the next 4 years. The Cowboys parted ways with Romo last year, freeing up $54M in CAP space planned for 2017-2019.

Similar to the Herschel Walker decision, these choices allow the team to commit to younger talented players, and they hope is that a similar result will happen to when the Cowboys made a similar commitment to youth 29 years ago.

The Cowboys have a number of players that will likely take a large chunk of the salary CAP in 2019 with much higher salaries than they currently are being paid.

1. Dak Prescott - will command a contract worth $18-$22M per season, perhaps more.
2. Zack Martin - the Cowboys are trying to sign Martin to a long-term deal this year. If they are unsuccessful, he'll be the franchise tag player a year from now. If they do sign him this year, his salary CAP hit next year will be substantial
3. DeMarcus Lawrence - if he repeats his performance from last year, will command a long-term contract worth slightly less than Prescott's deal
4. David Irving - this physical freak of nature hasn't yet put together a complete, unsuspended, uninjured year. If he does, the Cowboys will want to keep him around, and he might want a contract similar to the one the Cowboys anticipate giving Lawrence.

In 2020, these players will have their contracts coming up for extensions or renewals.

1. Byron Jones - the Cowboys picked up his 5th year option, and new DB coach Kris Richard calls him the "prototypical" cornerback for his system. That means the Cowboys will be paying Jones a lot more in 2019. If he breaks out over the next two seasons under Richard, he'll command top dollars in 2020.
   
2. Ezekiel Elliott - while the Cowboys will almost certainly exercise the 5th year option on Elliott, his contract will be subject to renewal in 2020. Since entering the league, he's led the NFL in per game rushing yards each of his first two seasons. The Cowboys will be in talks with him in 2020, just as they are talking to Zack Martin now.
3. La'el Collins - Collins current contract will expire after the 2019 season, and he'll be a free agent. If Collins develops into one of the better Right Tackles in the NFL, the Cowboys will want to lock him up on a long-term contract.
4. Jaylon Smith - Smith will be a restricted free agent in 2020, and the Cowboys can keep him by giving him a 1st round tender offer. If he's fully healed, and back to performing like the top 5 pick many thought he'd be, then the Cowboys may choose to give him a long term extension earlier to potentially save money over time.
5. Randy Gregory - Like Jaylon Smith, Gregory will also be a Restricted Free Agent in 2020. Like Jaylon, he was considered a top 5 talent in the draft that fell to the Cowboys in the 2nd round, and like Smith, he missed some seasons because of those reasons. But if he also comes back and performs at his talent level, the Cowboys will be talking about how to keep him with the Cowboys on a long-term deal.

So, the Cowboys potentially have at least 9 big new contracts over the next two seasons to keep their young talent base intact. Managing the Salary CAP now also includes planning for 2019 and 2020. Those focused only on this year's Salary CAP are missing the bigger picture.

We watch the Patriots for years manage their cap..

release players

sign FAs..

and draft well.

it can be done.

It will take a lot of effort.

 

[Established1971]

Back in 1989, Jimmy Johnson's Cowboys didn't have many good established players. The one great player they had was Herschel Walker. So they traded him to the Vikings for 7 draft picks, and 5 players. We all know what came next.

Flash forward to 2018, and the Cowboys already have a bunch of good young players, but they need Salary CAP space in 2019 & 2020 - a lot of salary CAP space - to resign that good young talent base. So, a choice was made to part with Dez Bryant this season, and eat his entire Salary CAP hit. That reduces the Cowboys salary CAP hits by about $25M over two seasons. Witten's retirement frees up another $26M over the next 4 years. The Cowboys parted ways with Romo last year, freeing up $54M in CAP space planned for 2017-2019.

Similar to the Herschel Walker decision, these choices allow the team to commit to younger talented players, and they hope is that a similar result will happen to when the Cowboys made a similar commitment to youth 29 years ago.

The Cowboys have a number of players that will likely take a large chunk of the salary CAP in 2019 with much higher salaries than they currently are being paid.

1. Dak Prescott - will command a contract worth $18-$22M per season, perhaps more.
2. Zack Martin - the Cowboys are trying to sign Martin to a long-term deal this year. If they are unsuccessful, he'll be the franchise tag player a year from now. If they do sign him this year, his salary CAP hit next year will be substantial
3. DeMarcus Lawrence - if he repeats his performance from last year, will command a long-term contract worth slightly less than Prescott's deal
4. David Irving - this physical freak of nature hasn't yet put together a complete, unsuspended, uninjured year. If he does, the Cowboys will want to keep him around, and he might want a contract similar to the one the Cowboys anticipate giving Lawrence.

In 2020, these players will have their contracts coming up for extensions or renewals.

1. Byron Jones - the Cowboys picked up his 5th year option, and new DB coach Kris Richard calls him the "prototypical" cornerback for his system. That means the Cowboys will be paying Jones a lot more in 2019. If he breaks out over the next two seasons under Richard, he'll command top dollars in 2020.
   
2. Ezekiel Elliott - while the Cowboys will almost certainly exercise the 5th year option on Elliott, his contract will be subject to renewal in 2020. Since entering the league, he's led the NFL in per game rushing yards each of his first two seasons. The Cowboys will be in talks with him in 2020, just as they are talking to Zack Martin now.
3. La'el Collins - Collins current contract will expire after the 2019 season, and he'll be a free agent. If Collins develops into one of the better Right Tackles in the NFL, the Cowboys will want to lock him up on a long-term contract.
4. Jaylon Smith - Smith will be a restricted free agent in 2020, and the Cowboys can keep him by giving him a 1st round tender offer. If he's fully healed, and back to performing like the top 5 pick many thought he'd be, then the Cowboys may choose to give him a long term extension earlier to potentially save money over time.
5. Randy Gregory - Like Jaylon Smith, Gregory will also be a Restricted Free Agent in 2020. Like Jaylon, he was considered a top 5 talent in the draft that fell to the Cowboys in the 2nd round, and like Smith, he missed some seasons because of those reasons. But if he also comes back and performs at his talent level, the Cowboys will be talking about how to keep him with the Cowboys on a long-term deal.

So, the Cowboys potentially have at least 9 big new contracts over the next two seasons to keep their young talent base intact. Managing the Salary CAP now also includes planning for 2019 and 2020. Those focused only on this year's Salary CAP are missing the bigger picture.

That Walker trade was so overrated

 

[xwalker]

I agree on the bold. When you're in good cap shape, *when* cap hits fall is largely an accounting choice. There is some inflation with the cap expanding every year, but that's a secondary effect.

Dead cap is dead. What you save is salary you don't pay. Crawford is slated for 6mil this year. That's what we would save by letting him go.

Thanks for being somebody that understands this concept.

I've been repeating the explanation for years but many people still try to use the logic of "It only saves X against the cap this year" as a reason a player should stay.

It is much easier to understand the real cost in keeping/cutting a player if just the total savings over all years is considered which is normally the base salary.

As you mentioned, dead-money is irrelevant unless the team has no remaining contracts to restructure.

Dead-money is money that would hit the cap with or without the player on the roster. It's called prorated when the player is on the roster but the amount is the same either way.

 

[blueblood70]

We need to stop with the idea that Dak isn't worth $17-20 million/year. That is what an average starting QB in the league is worth right now. There is no objective measure that says Dak is a below average QB. You can find many ways to say he isn't elite, but he's also not below average.

If Dak has a monster year - his rookie year was pretty dang close - then he's making $30 million+/year on his next deal. And it will probably come after the 2018 season. That is what a stud QB will be paid in the NFL moving forward. We need to wrap our minds around that number because that's what's coming unless Dak regresses.

for sure hell be worth 17-20mil thats pretty much a given BUT hes not at this moment worth 25-30mil after next year and thats scary thinking he could get that with the way hes currently playing..i hope he lays lights out the next two years, I simply dont want the FO handing him that huge contract after next season just because hes the starter.. I want him to earn that payday and if it takes getting to his final year or a FT, so be it

 

[buybuydandavis]

Of course the contracts are optional - all of them. But the Cowboys have to make plans as if a lot of these guys are going to be studs. If they don't turn out to be studs, then obviously, they don't get the big contracts. But the Cowboys have to make plans for continuity if all the pieces come together for them to make a multi-year run at championships.

We're not required to sign all our studs. If we have other guys to backfill, we can take that money and spend it on other positions where we aren't nearly as strong.

Collins may end up being a stud at RT. He's close enough now. But if we can swing Williams out to take the spot instead, we can save big cap.