Bijan: If he's there you HAVE to take him

Sydla

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True, I dont really approve of using a round 1 pick on a RB, but dallas has a late rd 1 pick , which is almost a 2nd rd pick.
Not the same as a high rd 1 pick.
My concern is how much would this guy help phil which is a run team ?? They lost sanders, so could use a tob rb.

I looked at hl, and bijan looks like he has good speed, some good moves, good vision, and can catch.
Will all that translate to nfl level? I dont know.

I doubt dallas will draft him, just curious if phil will.
Yeah I don't get the logic that well, gee it's almost like a 2nd round pick.

It's not. It's a first round pick. It's just rationalizing away a peculiar use of a pick. When we took Charlton, people justified it the same way saying where we took him, it was almost like a 2nd round pick anyway so if he was a 2nd round talent on the Cowboys board, since it was "almost" a 2nd round pick, it was OK.
 

Sydla

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Pretty much can apply this to almost any position other than QB.
Is there any 1 player in a position that changes the trajectory of the franchise other than QB?

Does having 1 shutdown CB or LB, DE, T? Likely answer is NO. No single player on the team other than QB can change trajectory of a franchise. Football is about a building a team. Many ways to go about building a team.

Pick the best talent usually wins out in the long run.
The vast majority of teams that have built rosters that made super bowl runs did so by not investing a first round pick in a TB or spending a crap ton of money on the position.

Again, you can't just toss out positional value here. There are finite resources in the NFL - in terms of picks and cap space. Using prime picks and/or pouring money into the TB position just doesn't have the ROI other positions have. It's been shown over and over. It's an interesting analysis when you look over the last 5-7 years. There is a significant number of Top Ten rushers that where high picks in the draft. But when you start to stratify that in terms of making the playoffs, making the divisional round, making the conference champ game, making the SB, the reliance on having that first round TB starts to drop off.

So if Robinson is there at 26 but there is an OL with a first round grade or a DT, I know where I am going and it is not TB.
 

btcutter

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True, I dont really approve of using a round 1 pick on a RB, but dallas has a late rd 1 pick , which is almost a 2nd rd pick.
Not the same as a high rd 1 pick.
My concern is how much would this guy help phil which is a run team ?? They lost sanders, so could use a tob rb.

I looked at hl, and bijan looks like he has good speed, some good moves, good vision, and can catch.
Will all that translate to nfl level? I dont know.

I doubt dallas will draft him, just curious if phil will.
I don't like to generalize and wouldn't say never use a high pick for a RB.

Each draft is different we can all agree. What if there's an "Adrian Peterson" or an "Emmitt Smith"? You can't say you won't select them with top 10 pick just because they are RBs unless you have other players rated ahead of them.

Never say never. Evaluate each draft and player and select accordingly.
 

Flamma

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No, really, teams don't factor in trying to screw a divisional rival into their analysis of a player. The Eagles wanted a TE. Goedert also happened to be the highest rated player on their board at that time (this was reported in Philly). They also knew we were in the market for a TE, so they jumped a team they thought might take him. If it had been any team that had a need for a TE, they would have jumped them. It wasn't so much that it was a divisional rival, it was the fact the Eagles deemed teams would take a TE and if they wanted him, which they did, they had to make a move.
If Robinson makes it all the way to the Cowboys, whether the Cowboys draft him or not, the next time this site allows for name changes, I'll change mine to Mud.
 

CowboysLakerBamaFan

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Isn't the best option to draft bpa? There isn't a better player in this draft.
Bpa with positional importance.

Exyreme example: If a fullback or guard is "the best player in the draft", you don't take him #1

A fullback may be the best fullback that's ever played the game. Like, on a scale of 1 to 100, for a fullback, he's a 100.

But if you have a defensive end, who's 75 out of 100 on the defensive end scale, he's a more valuable player than the 100/100 fullback.

Now running back or guard isn't that extreme, but it's similar principle. An 80 out of 100 for a DT, DE, or OT is a better asset than a RB who is 95 out of 100 on RB scale.

Robinson is prob one of the 5 "best players" in the draft. But he's skill, as high as it is, isn't as valuable as other skill sets. It's why average doctors, get paid WAAAYYYY more money then GREAT janitors.

If we were 1 rb away from a SB, I wouldn't hate the idea of splurging and blowing a RD1 pick in the mid 20s on a 5 year rental player. I just don't think we are. I think we need to pump resources, youth, into the O and D lines.
 

CowboysLakerBamaFan

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Show data or shut up
Haha, there were several points made. Show data about what? What, that rbs are bad 1st rd investments? How about watch what happens in every draft, the decisions made by NFL GMs in regards to a RB who very well may be the best player in the draft.

Or that "hitting" on a franchise QB makes you a SB contender year in year out, in today's NFL that makes all their rules to favor teams with elite QBs? You need "data" to believe that? Are you stoopid, or just dumb? (Not a question)

Show me data. LOLOLOL !!! duuuuuhhhhhhhhhhhhhh. Dummy.
 

btcutter

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Bpa with positional importance.

Exyreme example: If a fullback or guard is "the best player in the draft", you don't take him #1

A fullback may be the best fullback that's ever played the game. Like, on a scale of 1 to 100, for a fullback, he's a 100.

But if you have a defensive end, who's 75 out of 100 on the defensive end scale, he's a more valuable player than the 100/100 fullback.

Now running back or guard isn't that extreme, but it's similar principle. An 80 out of 100 for a DT, DE, or OT is a better asset than a RB who is 95 out of 100 on RB scale.

Robinson is prob one of the 5 "best players" in the draft. But he's skill, as high as it is, isn't as valuable as other skill sets. It's why average doctors, get paid WAAAYYYY more money then GREAT janitors.

If we were 1 rb away from a SB, I wouldn't hate the idea of splurging and blowing a RD1 pick in the mid 20s on a 5 year rental player. I just don't think we are. I think we need to pump resources, youth, into the O and D lines.
Brian Brodus would say “Don’t window dress your board”.

If you truly don’t value Robinson then he shouldn’t be “top 5 best player” on your big board. He should be at X spot where you would be comfortable taking him if he’s the highest remaining player on the board. Stay true to the big board especially in the early rounds.

Using your example of a janitor. No matter how great the janitor is he should not be rated above the lowest doctor.

Everyone has an opinion on “value” of Robinson but we all agree we will be taking one fairly early.
 

btcutter

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Bijan Robinson is a guy that is going to holdout on his team after year 3....guaranteed....keep that in mind.
If he’s going to hold out at year 3 that means he’s really balling out. We’ll deal with that problem if that happens.
What’s preventing Micah from holding out after next year?
 

CowboysLakerBamaFan

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Brian Brodus would say “Don’t window dress your board”.

If you truly don’t value Robinson then he shouldn’t be “top 5 best player” on your big board. He should be at X spot where you would be comfortable taking him if he’s the highest remaining player on the board. Stay true to the big board especially in the early rounds.

Using your example of a janitor. No matter how great the janitor is he should not be rated above the lowest doctor.

Everyone has an opinion on “value” of Robinson but we all agree we will be taking one fairly early.
IDK....I've seen some REALLY bad doctors.

Really bad janitors do a lot less damage than really bad doctors.

That said, this has nothing to do with football, or anything frankly. What were we talking about again?
 

Typhus

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I think you're going by positional value
There are going to be 3 QBs going in the the top 4 picks.
Carolina will be drafting Bryce Young with the 1st pick.
Stroud is going 2nd to the Texans.
Arizona at 3 might trade out of this pick if they are staying put with Murray.
If nobody moves up to the Cards pick Indy will gladly take Richardson with a smile.
 

Typhus

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Maybe, again he needs to be far and away the best player you can get, again the DE they have slotted to us would be be a 10 year player if he works out...an RB is still a 3 to 5 year player IF he works out. Then you get into whats the diference between production with that RB compared to the other 10 drafted after?
Mazi Smith Michigan DT seems to be hovering around 26 in a lot of Mocks and current speculation.
 

Gaede

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I'd take him at 26, gladly.

We've got a small window right now. I don't really care if he last 7 years.
 
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