Bob McGinn's Scout's Comments on Zack Martin

[jterrell]

I feel much the same way you seem to, but it was still the right pick to make under the circumstances (assuming the trade down option was really not acceptable). That's all we can really ask for.

There are going to be DL/DE options for us in the next two rounds, and more below them. It's not ideal, but if we scout well and draft our board, the team will eventually get better.

If you haven't seen the article @honeyhock posted last night yet, it's worth a read. There's something to be said for diversifying to fill a need. The unit was so bad last year, that the good news is that improvement is relatively easy.

And then, you never know where you're going to need your depth. Unless we're talking about the Cowboys the last two years, where you could pretty much predict injuries based off of where we were thin to start out.

Yup. no disagreement at all.
As I stated in my first post in this thread, he was a safe pick and BPA so solid, I just hate we couldn't get a trade down where we could have targeted our needs.
The way last year worked made me greedy I guess.

 

[Idgit]

Yup. no disagreement at all.
As I stated in my first post in this thread, he was a safe pick and BPA so solid, I just hate we couldn't get a trade down where we could have targeted our needs.
The way last year worked made me greedy I guess.

It bummed me out, too, fwiw. But, yeah, it's hard not to like the player. I was more bummed last year at this time, though, and that turned out ok.

 

[TonyRomo17]

Donald on that Rams team will be insane. That is one super scary DL.
If they get any offense that team is as good as San Fran.

meh.. as long as you have an LT that can handle Quinn 1v1 you should be fine

 

[Zordon]

defense won't be fixed in one year but investing in the oline like this allows us focus on defensive drafting for multiple drafts.

 

[FuzzyLumpkins]

And I want to add to the Warmack commentary that if you have to use those traps and whams that bama liked to run for him where he is blindsiding DT with a running start then I am not going to be convinced.

 

[lane]

great pick!!

 

[jterrell]

There was an unofficial result. I need to find it but I remember it being putrid.

I saw McCullers put him on skates. He didn't dominate Logan, the Georgia kid or other guys he faced. He beat up on LB like the guy from ND. Alabama consistently used combo blocks with the center to get push and Warmack was decidedly mediocre when isoed.

Please show me the tape of Warmack dominating DT one on one.

http://www.newyorkjets.com/videos/v...ghlights/5aac7823-5a11-472f-a22b-fdc658e32da5

Warmack dominated McCullers. McCullers did well the first quarter but wore down and Bama rushed for over 300 yards.
Warmack led Bama with 39 pancake blocks on an all-star OL laden team.
If you don't see him dominate you really should take stock before you grade prospects again.
He was considered one of the very best OG prospects in NFL history.
The fact he could run a combo block, slide off and get to the 2nd level then wipe out a LB is insanely impressive not some simpleton excuse to knock him.

 

[jterrell]

meh.. as long as you have an LT that can handle Quinn 1v1 you should be fine

rofl....
The rams were 3rd in the NFL with 53 sacks last year and just upgraded the weak link on that DL with the top pass rush 3 in this class by far.

Aaron Donald is faster over 40 yards than Robert Quinn... think about that for a minute.

That DL is purely insane with Long, Quinn and Donald where Brockers is the 'soft' pass rusher with 9.5 over his first two years.

 

[FuzzyLumpkins]

http://www.newyorkjets.com/videos/v...ghlights/5aac7823-5a11-472f-a22b-fdc658e32da5

Warmack dominated McCullers. McCullers did well the first quarter but wore down and Bama rushed for over 300 yards.
Warmack led Bama with 39 pancake blocks on an all-star OL laden team.
If you don't see him dominate you really should take stock before you grade prospects again.
He was considered one of the very best OG prospects in NFL history.
The fact he could run a combo block, slide off and get to the 2nd level then wipe out a LB is insanely impressive not some simpleton excuse to knock him.

I am still waiting for the one on one matchups where he drove his guy down field. I will even be impressed with a drive and turn. I see a guy using finesse technique to pass a guy down the line on those ios he won there.

Sure he would kick out and flatten a LB like I said and combo like I said but I saw one pancake against a nobody DT that lost his feet trying to come across Warmack.

McCullers wore down because of constant double teams as bama gave Warmack help against him. When he got isoed on McCullers he went backwards. For a guy with supposed legendary strength he needed a lot of help.

 

[FuzzyLumpkins]

And if you call me stupid again I will start responding in kind.

I didn't say it was a knock. I said that was his limit. He was awful when asked to pull outside for as good as he was in short spaces.

 

[texbumthelife]

please stop with that.

Seattle is very deep and quite good but not great on the DL but has a mediocre OL that is well below Dallas.
They have an all-time great DB group which is why they just paid a fortune to two DBs in the week leading up to this draft.
They also have an outstanding RB.

SF has a very good overall team that is loaded with high draft picks everywhere from a decade of sucking.
They've got a 6th overall pick at TE, 10th overall at WR, 11th overall at MLB, 18th overall at FS.
They are the best LB corps in the league by far when Bowman is healthy and Aldon Smith takes his meds.

The Aldon Smith comment made me laugh.

 

[texbumthelife]

rofl....
The rams were 3rd in the NFL with 53 sacks last year and just upgraded the weak link on that DL with the top pass rush 3 in this class by far.

Aaron Donald is faster over 40 yards than Robert Quinn... think about that for a minute.

That DL is purely insane with Long, Quinn and Donald where Brockers is the 'soft' pass rusher with 9.5 over his first two years.

You're kind of going off the deep end with the insults, so I will bite.

What was the Rams record and why?

I will give you a little background first. Jeff Fisher is notorious for his defenses but in all his experience has never won a Super Bowl. Annnnnnnnnnnd go!

 

[IAmLegend]

Zack Martin ‏@thegob70 45m
The dream has become a reality!! I'm a Cowboy baby!

 

[texbumthelife]

Zack Martin ‏@thegob70 45m
The dream has become a reality!! I'm a Cowboy baby!

Man, that is music to my ears. Great post.

 

[Idgit]

Play nice everybody, please. Nobody here is stupid. You're all smart. The stupid people are all in the other threads for the time being.

 

[jterrell]

And if you call me stupid again I will start responding in kind.

I didn't say it was a knock. I said that was his limit. He was awful when asked to pull outside for as good as he was in short spaces.

I didn't call you stupid... I said it was a "simpleton excuse" to portray him negatively.

You are clearly going to see what you want which is fine, the guy was drafted by Tennessee run by a Hall of Fame OL Coach at the time.
Warmack was always going to go high and clearly dominated.
He wasn't often used to beat one man because that simply wasn't as effective as it was when he passed the DT to the OC then erased the LB.
Pretending you are smarter than Nick Saban about OL effectiveness is hardly a way to be praised for intellect and Saban gushed about Warmack as much as any player he's ever coached.
Again he had 37 pancakes as junior and 39 as a senior. His power has never been in question.

He was a DNP in the bench press. His weight room work at Bama however was considered legendary.
And Warmack's favorite NFL player is Larry Allen.


FWIW, as a factoid Frederick set weight lifting records at Wisconsin including in the squat. Which is the numbers I'd like to see for OL/DL.

 

[CyberB0b]

You're kind of going off the deep end with the insults, so I will bite.

What was the Rams record and why?

I will give you a little background first. Jeff Fisher is notorious for his defenses but in all his experience has never won a Super Bowl. Annnnnnnnnnnd go!

Jeff Fisher is possibly the most overrated football coach of all time.

 

[texbumthelife]

Jeff Fisher is possibly the most overrated football coach of all time.

He was only used for arguments sake because JTerrel kept salivating over the Rams in order to make his weak argument.

 

[texbumthelife]

I didn't call you stupid... I said it was a "simpleton excuse" to portray him negatively.

You are clearly going to see what you want which is fine, the guy was drafted by Tennessee run by a Hall of Fame OL Coach at the time.
Warmack was always going to go high and clearly dominated.
He wasn't often used to beat one man because that simply wasn't as effective as it was when he passed the DT to the OC then erased the LB.
Pretending you are smarter than Nick Saban about OL effectiveness is hardly a way to be praised for intellect and Saban gushed about Warmack as much as any player he's ever coached.
Again he had 37 pancakes as junior and 39 as a senior. His power has never been in question.

He was a DNP in the bench press. His weight room work at Bama however was considered legendary.
And Warmack's favorite NFL player is Larry Allen.


FWIW, as a factoid Frederick set weight lifting records at Wisconsin including in the squat. Which is the numbers I'd like to see for OL/DL.

This is not sarcasm, it's genuine interest--do you have any links to stories about his weight room work. I would really like to read up on that. I've recently made big changes in my life and knowing anything/everything I can about fitness and muscle building. I don't plan to be a power lifter or anything, but it's become a big time hobby of mine.

 

[FuzzyLumpkins]

I didn't call you stupid... I said it was a "simpleton excuse" to portray him negatively.

You are clearly going to see what you want which is fine, the guy was drafted by Tennessee run by a Hall of Fame OL Coach at the time.
Warmack was always going to go high and clearly dominated.
He wasn't often used to beat one man because that simply wasn't as effective as it was when he passed the DT to the OC then erased the LB.
Pretending you are smarter than Nick Saban about OL effectiveness is hardly a way to be praised for intellect and Saban gushed about Warmack as much as any player he's ever coached.
Again he had 37 pancakes as junior and 39 as a senior. His power has never been in question.

He was a DNP in the bench press. His weight room work at Bama however was considered legendary.
And Warmack's favorite NFL player is Larry Allen.


FWIW, as a factoid Frederick set weight lifting records at Wisconsin including in the squat. Which is the numbers I'd like to see for OL/DL.

So what kind of person uses a simpleton excuse? Don't be coy. If you are going to lay stuff like that out there at least have the courage to stand behind it.

All you do after that is try and appeal to authority which is a fallacy. Saban this HoF coach that. I don't pretend to be smarter than Saban so just stop. I am just saying that Warmack was not very impressive when isoed on DT.

We are still waiting for examples of him being isoed on DT and pancaking them. He pancaked LBers on the regular so you are not really positing much by showing totals. At this point it is safe to say that you will not show any. No one could last year either so don't worry about it.

So if Warmack is so great how do explain how bad he played last year?

Here are two blurbs from pff and if you would like I can link multiple threads from Titans boards complaining about him.

He struggled with the bullrush which made up 11 of his 37 pressures, or 29 percent of his total. That was clearly his biggest weakness as he did a decent job protecting his inside and outside shoulders. Still, the 11 bullrush pressures were by far the most among the rookie interior offensive linemen and the biggest area that Warmack needs to improve for next season.

Legendary power should be able to anchor against the bullrush one would think. They go on:

Warmack came into the league with the “mauler” label firmly behind him, but it didn’t always show out in his run blocking. He was asked to pull quite a bit in the Titans’ power scheme, but he was unable to consistently move defenders at the point of attack. He struggled inline as well as he often struggled to lock onto defensive linemen long enough to create holes for this running backs.

https://www.profootballfocus.com/blog/2014/04/18/rookies-in-focus-chance-warmack/

I think I have been vindicated extensively for my position on him to this point. Blocking isn't quite so easy when you aren't up by 3 scores game after game like Bama was in literally every game of 2013.