Can we stop panicking now?

[Stash]

The funny part about that is when they cut Carroll, people acted like $2MM in dead money for next year is no big deal.

But bring up the fact that an extra $2MM a year could have kept Carr or Claiborne and both would have been better players than Carroll......... well, in that scenario $2MM is a real big chunk of change.

Or they try to tear down Carr and Claiborne. Either way.

And nobody is saying that either player was all-world here, just that they were both a better option than the absolutely nothing they got from the Nolan Carroll decision.

It's crazy the lengths some fans want to go to in an effort to gloss over or minimize every poor decision this team makes.

 

[TheMarathonContinues]

On this team? Yes.

Again, the point that consistently eludes you was the team didn't need to go out and spend $100MM on players to get better. That's not the point anyone is making. So no, they didn't need to go out and sign the best SS in football to take over for Heath. They could have signed some smart, mid-level free agents and still worked the draft for long term solutions.

There was a way to work FA and work the draft and improve the team in the near term as well as down the road. They didn't do that. That's pretty damn obvious to anyone who isn't sniffing glue and genuflecting at the altar of the front office.

And who fits this bill? I don't recall many guys that fit the description.

 

[TheMarathonContinues]

The funny part about that is when they cut Carroll, people acted like $2MM in dead money for next year is no big deal.

But bring up the fact that an extra $2MM a year could have kept Carr or Claiborne and both would have been better players than Carroll......... well, in that scenario $2MM is a real big chunk of change.

I could've sworn last season I remember you ripping both Mo and Carr.....now you are rueing them?

 

[TheMarathonContinues]

No, he isn't. He's been in this league and this defense for three years now. No more excuses for him. But I now see how far you're willing to try to stretch the description to fit your narrative.

Fail.

Is this not Byron's 2nd year as a free safety in this league?

But you're ignoring the true narrative here......

Is Jaylon, Collins, Irving, Wilson, Taco and Brown not young players?

 

[links18]

Yeah I think that's some of them too. Which is a terrible way to be a fan. Always expecting the worse.....

Then you can only be pleasantly surprised. Its a well known psychological defense mechanism to repeated trauma.

 

[Sydla]

I could've sworn last season I remember you ripping both Mo and Carr.....now you are rueing them?

I didn't think either was great by any stretch. But, I was pushing this offseason that they should bring one of those two back and then draft some CBs. My feeling was that if they were going to go young at DB, you can't just overhaul the entire secondary at once. They should have brought back on of those CBs instead of wasting cash on a worse CB in Carroll.

 

[Sydla]

Is this not Byron's 2nd year as a free safety in this league?

But you're ignoring the true narrative here......

Is Jaylon, Collins, Irving, Wilson, Taco and Brown not young players?

Wilson is a back up LB. Taco is like a 3rd string DE.

Bringing them up as reasons why the defense is struggling is a complete and utter reach and completely undermines your point. No, the defense isn't struggling because of a back up LB and a 2nd or 3rd string DE.

 

[Sydla]

And who fits this bill? I don't recall many guys that fit the description.

Bennie Logan signed a 1 year deal at $8MM. He'd have been a better option at the 1 tech and on a one year deal, doesn't kill your cap down the road. Frankly, since they seem completely disinterested in drafting a 1 tech, maybe they should have splurged a bit and sunk some money into someone like Hankins at the 1 tech. He was a bit pricey but he's also a guy that would have been a beast next to Collins.

Maybe splurge a little and signed Micah Hyde who is playing well for Buffalo. Have him at SS opposite Jones would have been a big help. Then Heath can play the dime DB which seems to be his best position.

And none of those moves would have prevented you from still drafting guys like Awuzie or Lewis or Woods.

 

[Stash]

Is this not Byron's 2nd year as a free safety in this league?

Yes. But his third in this league. Exactly how much time are these guys supposed to get in a four-year, salary cap league before they're required to be capable players?

You're lowering your limbo bar of expectations quite a bit here.

But you're ignoring the true narrative here......

Is Jaylon, Collins, Irving, Wilson, Taco and Brown not young players?

Disputing, not ignoring.

Again, you seem to want to make excuses for everyone under the age of 30. That's just misguided. By your standards, by the time any of these guys are required to "get it", they're either looking for their second contract here or gone elsewhere.

Brown played well last year - as a rookie, why should expectations be lowered?

Collins played great last year as well - as a rookie, why should expectations be lowered?

Irving happens to be both young and playing well. Who would have thought that was possible?

Taco is a disappointing rookie, no two ways about it. I'm working hard to lower my expectations for him, but if somebody wants to use the rookie excuse for his disappointing play, sure.

Jaylon's not a rookie, and neither is Wilson. Again, do we wait until they're up for big money before we can expect results? Not me.

No, there are plenty of guys who have been around who aren't playing well either. "Young guys" is a flimsy excuse that doesn't add up.

 

[TheMarathonContinues]

I didn't think either was great by any stretch. But, I was pushing this offseason that they should bring one of those two back and then draft some CBs. My feeling was that if they were going to go young at DB, you can't just overhaul the entire secondary at once. They should have brought back on of those CBs instead of wasting cash on a worse CB in Carroll.

I have no problem not bringing them back though I did want Mo back because I felt he was getting better. Not sure if he didn't want to come back or if we didn't want him back. The Carroll signing was terrible. No way around that. I would've rather wasted the money on one of these other guys we had last year.

 

[Sydla]

Frankly, I'd rather have bundled Carroll's cash and made a run at Hyde and put him at SS. He would have been a playmaker in the secondary for us.

 

[TheMarathonContinues]

Wilson is a back up LB. Taco is like a 3rd string DE.

Bringing them up as reasons why the defense is struggling is a complete and utter reach and completely undermines your point. No, the defense isn't struggling because of a back up LB and a 2nd or 3rd string DE.

Taco was not the 3rd string de when Irving was out. He was playing significant minutes. As was Jaylon Smith. Wilson as well...I'm not sure what you are talking about. I find it hard to believe you didn't notice Jaylon out there playing like a hurt rookie which is what he is.

 

[TheMarathonContinues]

Frankly, I'd rather have bundled Carroll's cash and made a run at Hyde and put him at SS. He would have been a playmaker in the secondary for us.

In hindsight....I would've made that move but this offseason I'll be honest I was more concerned with the pass rush.

 

[TheMarathonContinues]

Yes. But his third in this league. Exactly how much time are these guys supposed to get in a four-year, salary cap league before they're required to be capable players?

You're lowering your limbo bar of expectations quite a bit here.



Disputing, not ignoring.

Again, you seem to want to make excuses for everyone under the age of 30. That's just misguided. By your standards, by the time any of these guys are required to "get it", they're either looking for their second contract here or gone elsewhere.

Brown played well last year - as a rookie, why should expectations be lowered?

Collins played great last year as well - as a rookie, why should expectations be lowered?

Irving happens to be both young and playing well. Who would have thought that was possible?

Taco is a disappointing rookie, no two ways about it. I'm working hard to lower my expectations for him, but if somebody wants to use the rookie excuse for his disappointing play, sure.

Jaylon's not a rookie, and neither is Wilson. Again, do we wait until they're up for big money before we can expect results? Not me.

No, there are plenty of guys who have been around who aren't playing well either. "Young guys" is a flimsy excuse that doesn't add up.

Maybe you're not understanding what I'm saying. I'm not lowering the bar.

I'm telling you in this league in this NFL you don't come straight in and have success. So you can sit here and be upset and lose hair over the fact that your young players are.....well playing young but that's just reality in he NFL.

You want to say Byron is a aging vet? Fine. Whatever. Still doesn't erase the fact that this defense is young and by seasons end will be much better than they are now due to experience.

 

[Stash]

Maybe you're not understanding what I'm saying. I'm not lowering the bar.

I'm telling you in this league in this NFL you don't come straight in and have success. So you can sit here and be upset and lose hair over the fact that your young players are.....well playing young but that's just reality in he NFL.

Continue along with your false narrative all you want, it still won't make it true. Plenty of players have success as rookies, or second year players, or even third year players. But you want to twist the facts however you need to in an effort to support your failed argument.

You want to say Byron is a aging vet? Fine. Whatever.

Are you really going to stoop to a strawman now? Just raise the white flag already and be done with it.

Still doesn't erase the fact that this defense is young and by seasons end will be much better than they are now due to experience.

Why will they be "much better"? By your own reasoning, these players still won't be experienced enough to possibly expect anything of them.

After all, according to you, we can't expect anything from Byron Jones because he's still too "young". Despite being in the league for three years now.

 

[Sydla]

Taco was not the 3rd string de when Irving was out. He was playing significant minutes. As was Jaylon Smith. Wilson as well...I'm not sure what you are talking about. I find it hard to believe you didn't notice Jaylon out there playing like a hurt rookie which is what he is.

I missed where I mentioned Smith's name.

I am just pointing out you are exaggerating here to prove your point. Blaming "youth" for the defense's problems and then listing two guys, who frankly, haven't logged a ton of minutes, doesn't help your point. It just makes you look like you are exaggerating because you can't prove your point otherwise.

 

[TheMarathonContinues]

Continue along with your false narrative all you want, it still won't make it true. Plenty of players have success as rookies, or second year players, or even third year players. But you want to twist the facts however you need to in an effort to support your failed argument.



Are you really going to stoop to a strawman now? Just raise the white flag already and be done with it.



Why will they be "much better"? By your own reasoning, these players still won't be experienced enough to possibly expect anything of them.

After all, according to you, we can't expect anything from Byron Jones because he's still too "young". Despite being in the league for three years now.

How many dominant defense do you see out there with youth in it?

Why will they be "much better"? By your own reasoning, these players still won't be experienced enough to possibly expect anything of them.

Why are you making me spell out every little thing for you like you lack comprehension? Or do you? They will be better by seasons end because....they will have more games under their belt. Jesus.........

After all, according to you, we can't expect anything from Byron Jones because he's still too "young". Despite being in the league for three years now.

So are you going to keep hanging on to Byron Jones and ignore the other players on this defense? I'm guessing you will.....

 

[Sydla]

In hindsight....I would've made that move but this offseason I'll be honest I was more concerned with the pass rush.

And if your concern was the pass rush this offseason, note that they didn't do anything in the offseason to fix it either. They drafted a raw rookie in Charlton who is likely a SDE and not a RDE anyway.

Thankfully, Lawrence has come to play this year and helped the pass rush overall.

 

[tyke1doe]

Not a lot of people were very confident coming into today.

Having said that...pounding a winless team is exactly what this team should be expected to do. And why exactly are we taking that for granted...weren't we favored against the Rams and the Cardinals as well? *hint yes we were*

I'm not taking it for granted. I'm just saying we haven't beaten the teams we need to to get to our goal. We have the Seahawks, the Skins (twice), the Eagles (twice), the Chiefs, the Raiders, the Falcons, the Chargers left to play - all teams with winning records or headed in the right direction. I'm not in a panic, but I'm not exactly ready to anoint them playoff bound.
We beat a team that is winless. Yippy Ki Yeay! We're back. ...
To ... be ... continued.

 

[tyke1doe]

Not saying Dallas is a top-five team or anything, but we didn’t beat the Niners. We thrashed them by 30 points, more than twice the total point differential of their first five losses.

So this means what concerning our next opponents?