Chip Kelly versus Jason Garrett

[Idgit]

Jerry does not understand the importance of the HC as an authority figure, or he wouldn't be in the lockeroom and on tv speaking for the team every week. He is a delegator and hopefully will continue to delegate more and more as he ages.

This is true, and I'm hoping you're right that he becomes a less influential figure head and is more of a public mascot as he gets a bit older.

 

[Idgit]

“We’ve put a lot of effort in training as a franchise into Jason Garrett, and I want to take advantage of that,” Jones said. “If we don’t have him, we don’t get payback for all the miscues and losses and criticism of sideline management. We don’t get a chance to benefit from the one way you learn, and that is the mistakes you make. So I want to have him around to learn.

What else has to be said?

Probably the part of the quote you cut off. The part that made it clear that the development quotes were in regards to developing a Super Bowl winning coach and not just one capable of holding the job:

"...So I want to have him around to learn. I’ve seen another smart coach, a very smart coach, learn from a lot of mistakes early and go on and win Super Bowls. Most of them do.”

http://www.nbcdfw.com/blogs/blue-star/Jerry-Jones-Sticking-With-Jason-Garrett-238003701.html

Last time I checked, neither Kelly nor Garrett had won the big one, yet.

As I said earlier, I like Kelly a lot. And I like Jim Harbaugh a lot, as well. Both of those guys have advance their teams farther than Garrett has, and they both did it quicker. But I don't buy the argument that all teams are equal or that an NFL franchise can be readily turned around in a season or two. It can take more than that. You have to look at the job the guys do under the circumstance they're in, and you have to understand that those situations differ so much that you can't measure the job on short term wins and losses. I've said it several times before, but John Wooden has said that his best job coaching he did for a team with a losing record.

All in all, I think I'd have to say that what Kelly's done I find more impressive than what Jason's done. Mostly because I think he's done it with a snack-pack of below-average QBs and on the strength of his system. But then he's also had a lot of time to work out some of those kinks at the collegiate level, so that's probably too be expected. I like where Dallas is right now, long term, better than where the Eagles are. I think the Eagles are doing a lot with smoke and mirrors and have some way to go yet in terms of personnel. And managing and developing personnel at the NFL level is the hardest part of building a successful organization long-term.

 

[ScipioCowboy]

I have finally made an appearance in this thread, and that's all I have to do to demonstrate complete ownage and mastery of it. Bow at my feet.

 

[Doomsday101]

Jerry does not understand the importance of the HC as an authority figure, or he wouldn't be in the lockeroom and on tv speaking for the team every week. He is a delegator and hopefully will continue to delegate more and more as he ages.

And that is your opinion again those who have worked for him disagree. I trust inside voiced more so than message board posters, call me crazy

 

[rcaldw]

That would require the other side to know something about football...sadly that is not the case.

This is spot on. I really am amazed at the blindness and stubbornness from some around here. This discussion makes sense at 3-7, but 7-3? This discussion makes sense with back to back losing seasons, but wait, the team has been rebuilt WITHOUT a losing season.

There is a word for such debates..... stupid.

 

[atlantacowboy]

And that is your opinion again those who have worked for him disagree. I trust inside voiced more so than message board posters, call me crazy

Some listen to what Jerry says, others watch what he actually does. I guess we know where you stand.

 

[Doomsday101]

Some listen to what Jerry says, others watch what he actually does. I guess we know where you stand.

Yes I stand with Parcells who worked for him and whose comments about perception people have are wrong. I would think he would know a lot more than media spin and fan perceptions. Are there things Jerry has said that I disagree with sure? Has Dallas made trades I have disagreed with? Yep. Ultimately success of failure has much to do with the people you hire and information they are providing. This can be said for 31 other teams because despite what many will say GM do not scout they have a scouting department who does this and the information they have goes back to the GM so that he can make decisions. Who you hire makes a hugh difference be in the NFL or any other business. Ultimately win or lose Jerry is responsible

 

[atlantacowboy]

Yes I stand with Parcells who worked for him and whose comments about perception people have are wrong. I would think he would know a lot more than media spin and fan perceptions. Are there things Jerry has said that I disagree with sure? Has Dallas made trades I have disagreed with? Yep. Ultimately success of failure has much to do with the people you hire and information they are providing. This can be said for 31 other teams because despite what many will say GM do not scout they have a scouting department who does this and the information they have goes back to the GM so that he can make decisions. Who you hire makes a hugh difference be in the NFL or any other business. Ultimately win or lose Jerry is responsible

Jerry wasn't in the locker room or on TV when Parcels was coaching. Who doesn't know that??

Jerry does not like coaches like parcels and johnson and he has said so. Thats why he hires guys like Switzer, Gailey, Campo, Wade, and garret. He likes coaches he can walk over and who don't mind him in the locker room and being the team spokesman . This is not something new. I am incredulous that you don't know this when its pretty much common knowledge.

The GM difference in Dallas is that GM also owns the team and hires everyone. There really hasn't been a parallel since Al Davis died.

 

[Doomsday101]

Jerry wasn't in the locker room or on TV when Parcels was coaching. Who doesn't know that??

Jerry does not like coaches like parcels and johnson and he has said so. Thats why he hires guys like Switzer, Gailey, Campo, Wade, and garret. He likes coaches he can walk over and who don't mind him in the locker room and being the team spokesman . This is not something new. I am incredulous that you don't know this when its pretty much common knowledge.

The GM difference in Dallas is that GM also owns the team and hires everyone. There really hasn't been a parallel since Al Davis died.

BS Jerry was still active when BP wanted Spears ahead of Ware it was Ireland who sold Jerry on taking Ware, later in rd 1 we got Spears. Jerry has always gone to the locker room since he bought the team and he went down to the sidelines from the get go. Hell he goes to the sideline less often now days than he did in the beginning and yet now days I see many Owners and GM go to the sidelines. As for Garrett being a puppet it was Garrett who took playcalling away from Callahan and it was Garrett who brought in Linehan whom he had worked with before and trusted to run the offense.

 

[erod]

He inherited a top 10 QB?

He inherited a 1-7 squad with a long list of starters in steep decline.

 

[rcaldw]

Probably the part of the quote you cut off. The part that made it clear that the development quotes were in regards to developing a Super Bowl winning coach and not just one capable of holding the job:



Last time I checked, neither Kelly nor Garrett had won the big one, yet.

As I said earlier, I like Kelly a lot. And I like Jim Harbaugh a lot, as well. Both of those guys have advance their teams farther than Garrett has, and they both did it quicker. But I don't buy the argument that all teams are equal or that an NFL franchise can be readily turned around in a season or two. It can take more than that. You have to look at the job the guys do under the circumstance they're in, and you have to understand that those situations differ so much that you can't measure the job on short term wins and losses. I've said it several times before, but John Wooden has said that his best job coaching he did for a team with a losing record.

All in all, I think I'd have to say that what Kelly's done I find more impressive than what Jason's done. Mostly because I think he's done it with a snack-pack of below-average QBs and on the strength of his system. But then he's also had a lot of time to work out some of those kinks at the collegiate level, so that's probably too be expected. I like where Dallas is right now, long term, better than where the Eagles are. I think the Eagles are doing a lot with smoke and mirrors and have some way to go yet in terms of personnel. And managing and developing personnel at the NFL level is the hardest part of building a successful organization long-term.

I don't think what he (Kelly) has done is more impressive at all. The old run-n-shoot proved something years ago. Short term turnarounds are easier with novel systems. Long term success has to be more substantive. What Jason has done is with an eye to long term, sustainable, success. Over time I am confident that it will become clearer and clearer that Cowboys fans have been blessed by Jerry Jones choice of Jason Garrett.

 

[Doomsday101]

I don't think what he (Kelly) has done is more impressive at all. The old run-n-shoot proved something years ago. Short term turnarounds are easier with novel systems. Long term success has to be more substantive. What Jason has done is with an eye to long term, sustainable, success. Over time I am confident that it will become clearer and clearer that Cowboys fans have been blessed by Jerry Jones choice of Jason Garrett.

one thing for sure Philly under chip Kelly sucks when it comes to goal line offense. You would think with the RB they have they would be much better inside the 5 but they are not

 

[cowboys1981]

This thread probably has more posts than the total yards we allowed in Philly

 

[rcaldw]

Some listen to what Jerry says, others watch what he actually does. I guess we know where you stand.

And yet when we are 7-3 the only evidence that people keep TRYING to produce to discredit Garrett are quotes, taken out of context, from Jerry. Its a weird world.

 

[Dave_in-NC]

BS Jerry was still active when BP wanted Spears ahead of Ware it was Ireland who sold Jerry on taking Ware, later in rd 1 we got Spears. Jerry has always gone to the locker room since he bought the team and he went down to the sidelines from the get go. Hell he goes to the sideline less often now days than he did in the beginning and yet now days I see many Owners and GM go to the sidelines. As for Garrett being a puppet it was Garrett who took playcalling away from Callahan and it was Garrett who brought in Linehan whom he had worked with before and trusted to run the offense.

Jerry said it himself he was walking on egg shells when Parcells was here. Now with Jerry's 40yo brain he might have been dreaming it.

 

[erod]

I can't wait for the day Garrett is extended. Half the Cowboy fanbase will jump from the tallest building. What a great day that will be.

Somehow, Jerry has to get Garrett, Marinelli, and Linehan inked at the same time. I'm pretty sure Callahan wants out unfortunately. Marinelli may jump, too, so Jerry needs to promise him all his attention in free agency and the draft.

 

[Doomsday101]

Jerry said it himself he was walking on egg shells when Parcells was here. Now with Jerry's 40yo brain he might have been dreaming it.

Yet him and Parcells are still close and Jerry still talks with him and gets his views on issues

 

[bkeavs]

I don't think what he (Kelly) has done is more impressive at all. The old run-n-shoot proved something years ago. Short term turnarounds are easier with novel systems. Long term success has to be more substantive. What Jason has done is with an eye to long term, sustainable, success. Over time I am confident that it will become clearer and clearer that Cowboys fans have been blessed by Jerry Jones choice of Jason Garrett.

The only issue I have with this reasoning is that it has taken so long for this to happen that we will be looking for a top level QB in the near future. We essentially wasted the prime of Romo's career

 

[BigStar]

He inherited a 1-7 squad with a long list of starters in steep decline.

A team that also made the playoffs and won a game the year before under Wade. That 1-7 start had a lot to do with JG (remember the flare pass before the half against WAS?) just to name one of the gaffes that came to mind immediately. But that was what it was. I was excited about JG at the time. The following season JG had a franchise QB (top 10 @ least) and the best pass rusher in the NFL, to go along with an all pro TE. I'm not saying the talent was plentiful, but it was more than the rebuild jobs displayed in SF and SEA. No one rebuilds with a franchise QB and the top pass rusher in football; so the shtick about "rebuilding" while maintaining 8-8 becomes too far fetched. PHI/SEA/SF didn't have franchise QBs, and those coaches took their teams to the playoffs (SB). We are continuously told that JG just needs more time; but this standard has been outdone by Harbaugh, Carrol, Kelly, Arians ,etc.

The D was terrible last season, injuries before that, before that the OL, etc. Now in year 4 of the regime, a new OC has been brought in and is running the offense completely different than JG had during his tenure as HC/OC and has greatly contributed to the 7-3 start by mainly shortening the game with Murray. We are supposed to have faith that JG had a plan for this direction; though he never displayed any of these behaviors before? He didn't orchestrate this OL (though grateful) because if he was serious about rebuilding the OL, he wouldn't have attempted it over a four year span using only first round picks. The narrative is being written after the fact and the "aren't you glad we stuck with him" mantra being pushed is usually what this relates to. All that being said, I have acknowledged that if JG wins a playoff game he is due an extension. I still feel JG is painfully bland in his vision/scheme, and his influence wouldn't be lost on this team.

 

[Idgit]

I don't think what he (Kelly) has done is more impressive at all. The old run-n-shoot proved something years ago. Short term turnarounds are easier with novel systems. Long term success has to be more substantive. What Jason has done is with an eye to long term, sustainable, success. Over time I am confident that it will become clearer and clearer that Cowboys fans have been blessed by Jerry Jones choice of Jason Garrett.

I'm obviously a big fan of Garretts, so we're in perfect agreement there.

I was watching to see if the Eagles back-slid this year, because I agree that it looked like a distinct possibility. I especially thought it was possible that Foles would return to earth, which he obviously did. But they keep winning. It's been 26 games now, and I'm not sure you can call it a fad. Chip Kelly does a lot of novel and innovative things to gain small advantages wherever he can. And he's also new to the league and still sorting out where those advantages can be found. He also doesn't really have his QB in place yet. We'll see what happens over time, but I think it's looking more likely that he'll get better as he figures the league out and not worse as we figure him out. As I said, though, I do like where Dallas is relative to the rest of the NFCE. A lot. Assuming, of course, we're able to sort out a long term solution at the QB position.