Collins working at Right Guard

[jterrell]

At this point, who does? Green is unavailable with no ETA, and Dill and Wetzel proving to be camp bodies. And, after some good early camp reports, Weems laid an egg at LT against San Diego.

Before yesterday, I hadn't seen nor heard any news about Gibson - good or bad.



If you're going so far as to PUP Green for the first 6 weeks, does it make any sense to take him off of that list after 6 weeks and hope he shows enough to be worth anything? Or does it make better sense to just IR him for next year?

I have heard Gibson getting abused in basically every training camp report I read.
My sense is he has neither the athleticism nor technique to play in the NFL at this point but I could certainly be wrong.
Some guys are awful in drills but can play in games.
Keeping Gibson buys you nothing really except a 6th round developmental RT at very best. I just don't see any value to that proposition.

Green being IR'd means no practicing with the team. Him being brought back but made inactive weekly allows that practice.
I suspect Dallas has 8 OL they REALLY like: 5 starters plus Collins, Bern, Weems.
Weems looked pretty bad week 1 but keep in mind he had been out for 2 full years.
We've seen him play before in actual games and look decent.

The Cowboys certainly could PUP Green and keep Gibson as a 9th OL, I just don't really see it.
He has no position flex or likelihood of helping anytime soon.
I think I would scour the waiver wire first and try to steal a guy that could actually help me.

 

[AbeBeta]

Im not sure but I think he'll be back sometime around the halfway point of the season.

That seems a bit extreme for a minor hip surgery

 

[AbeBeta]

I have heard Gibson getting abused in basically every training camp report I read.
My sense is he has neither the athleticism nor technique to play in the NFL at this point but I could certainly be wrong.
Some guys are awful in drills but can play in games.
Keeping Gibson buys you nothing really except a 6th round developmental RT at very best. I just don't see any value to that proposition.

Green being IR'd means no practicing with the team. Him being brought back but made inactive weekly allows that practice.
I suspect Dallas has 8 OL they REALLY like: 5 starters plus Collins, Bern, Weems.
Weems looked pretty bad week 1 but keep in mind he had been out for 2 full years.
We've seen him play before in actual games and look decent.

The Cowboys certainly could PUP Green and keep Gibson as a 9th OL, I just don't really see it.
He has no position flex or likelihood of helping anytime soon.
I think I would scour the waiver wire first and try to steal a guy that could actually help me.

Gibson looks like a practice squad guy. He hasn't impressed so he'll slide through.

 

[AbeBeta]

I noticed he was playing some right guard during practice yesterday when watching Training Camp live.

It could just be to get him some reps but maybe if Free goes down or if they just want to replace him then Zack Martin would go to right tackle.

But wouldn't they run Martin at RT instead of C if they had that in mind?

 

[CATCH17]

That seems a bit extreme for a minor hip surgery

Yes.. Im projecting the Pup though.. Out 6 weeks to start the year.

 

[Stash]

I have heard Gibson getting abused in basically every training camp report I read.
My sense is he has neither the athleticism nor technique to play in the NFL at this point but I could certainly be wrong.
Some guys are awful in drills but can play in games.
Keeping Gibson buys you nothing really except a 6th round developmental RT at very best. I just don't see any value to that proposition.

Everything I've heard and read regarding Gibson describes him as a physically talented project. And I think the team has to determine to what extent the talent relates to the development. If he's clueless and green as grass, it may not be worth trying to keep him on the 53. But if he flashes any sort of real potential, they might change their minds.

But I firmly believe that with the lack of offensive tackles throughout the league, if they try to get him to the practice squad, he will be claimed.

Green being IR'd means no practicing with the team. Him being brought back but made inactive weekly allows that practice.
I suspect Dallas has 8 OL they REALLY like: 5 starters plus Collins, Bern, Weems.

I agree with you here. But I think they might see some potential in a young guy or two.

Weems looked pretty bad week 1 but keep in mind he had been out for 2 full years.
We've seen him play before in actual games and look decent.

Actually, I don't think we have. I don't think Weems have played any meaningful snaps.

The Cowboys certainly could PUP Green and keep Gibson as a 9th OL, I just don't really see it.
He has no position flex or likelihood of helping anytime soon.
I think I would scour the waiver wire first and try to steal a guy that could actually help me.

I think you'll have a lot of competition there. The Broncos in particular were trying to sign Gibson as an UDFA when he found out the Cowboys had selected him. And that was before Denver lost All-Pro LT Ryan Clady. So you would have to think that Gibson would definitely be on their radar at the very least. And the Giants have need as well and would probably like nothing more than to ruin the Cowboys' plans.

 

[Stash]

Gibson looks like a practice squad guy. He hasn't impressed so he'll slide through.

I respectfully disagree.

 

[Stash]

But wouldn't they run Martin at RT instead of C if they had that in mind?

You would certainly think so. And if there was any chance of Collins at RT, the team has had a million opportunities to play him there. And they have intentionally chosen not to.

 

[jterrell]

Everything I've heard and read regarding Gibson describes him as a physically talented project. And I think the team has to determine to what extent the talent relates to the development. If he's clueless and green as grass, it may not be worth trying to keep him on the 53. But if he flashes any sort of real potential, they might change their minds.

But I firmly believe that with the lack of offensive tackles throughout the league, if they try to get him to the practice squad, he will be claimed.



I agree with you here. But I think they might see some potential in a young guy or two.





Actually, I don't think we have. I don't think Weems have played any meaningful snaps.



I think you'll have a lot of competition there. The Broncos in particular were trying to sign Gibson as an UDFA when he found out the Cowboys had selected him. And that was before Denver lost All-Pro LT Ryan Clady. So you would have to think that Gibson would definitely be on their radar at the very least. And the Giants have need as well and would probably like nothing more than to ruin the Cowboys' plans.

you seem to feel losing Gibson matters at all, ever.
i don't.
he has been losing battles in training camp to 3rd and 4th string guys on our DL.
guys like the English kid they brought over.

if the cowboys agree with you and feel he has some real ceiling they'll keep him.
if they feel like i do, they'll release him and offer a PS spot.

i don't believe dallas is trying to hide him, i just don't think he is very good at all.

it is a pretty big leap from attempting to sign a guy as an UDFA to giving him a roster spot.
Gibson is in this camp and knows this offense but he looks ta best like a 5th option at RT and not in the mix at all anywhere else.

 

[speedkilz88]

My only thing is, while Green is a pure tackle, his ceiling isn't as high as Smith, Collins, Frederick, and Martin's at their positions. But with them taking him in the third, it tells me the coaching staff believes his ceiling is a little higher than I do. If he becomes a Doug Free-like talent, that position will still do fine.

Green can also play OG, many scouts believe he could become a center as well.

The concern should be, can Green stay healthy.

 

[conner01]

If either guard is injured you want Collins to be the replacement in a long term situation

 

[NEODOG]

Imagine that Green as a RT over Collins

I'm shocked

 

[erod]

This is to prepare for a Doug Free injury. Martin would swing out there, I think.

Collins has never played on the right side. This is to get him acclimated in case. That's my take.

 

[AbeBeta]

I think you'll have a lot of competition there. The Broncos in particular were trying to sign Gibson as an UDFA when he found out the Cowboys had selected him. And that was before Denver lost All-Pro LT Ryan Clady. So you would have to think that Gibson would definitely be on their radar at the very least. And the Giants have need as well and would probably like nothing more than to ruin the Cowboys' plans.

I think there is a big difference between liking a player as a UDFA who can come in, learn how to play in your offense and be evaluated every single day by your staff vs. a guy who you liked being available post-camp. Holding a spot for a guy you had no chance to see at all would happen only if no one from camp did anything to make you want to keep them. Same deal with the Giants - are they really so thin that they will use a roster spot just to ruin our plans? Doubt it.

 

[CCBoy]

Dang...ha ha replaces lol, then he he.

 

[Stash]

you seem to feel losing Gibson matters at all, ever.
i don't.

Yeah, that's where the crux of our debate lies. I think he's a diamond in the rough with potential. We'll have to wait and see what Dallas eventually thinks?

he has been losing battles in training camp to 3rd and 4th string guys on our DL.
guys like the English kid they brought over.

if the cowboys agree with you and feel he has some real ceiling they'll keep him.
if they feel like i do, they'll release him and offer a PS spot.

Yep.

i don't believe dallas is trying to hide him, i just don't think he is very good at all.

it is a pretty big leap from attempting to sign a guy as an UDFA to giving him a roster spot.
Gibson is in this camp and knows this offense but he looks ta best like a 5th option at RT and not in the mix at all anywhere else.

We'll have to see how things play out and revisit things then.

 

[xwalker]

I think there is a big difference between liking a player as a UDFA who can come in, learn how to play in your offense and be evaluated every single day by your staff vs. a guy who you liked being available post-camp. Holding a spot for a guy you had no chance to see at all would happen only if no one from camp did anything to make you want to keep them. Same deal with the Giants - are they really so thin that they will use a roster spot just to ruin our plans? Doubt it.

The Cowboys carried the OL Hawkins as a developmental backup last year. He was always inactive and basically had no chance to play.

In 2013 and the end of 2012 they carried Weems as the inactive developmental OL that had not chance to actually play.

The Cowboys didn't use a draft pick on either Hawkins or Weems but did use on on Gibson. It seems that if Weems/Hawkins could hold down a developmental spot in those years, that Gibson could do it this year.

 

[CCBoy]

The Cowboys carried the OL Hawkins as a developmental backup last year. He was always inactive and basically had no chance to play.

In 2013 and the end of 2012 they carried Weems as the inactive developmental OL that had not chance to actually play.

The Cowboys didn't use a draft pick on either Hawkins or Weems but did use on on Gibson. It seems that if Weems/Hawkins could hold down a developmental spot in those years, that Gibson could do it this year.

Especially when Gibson was seen as purely developmental when brought onto the summer roster.

 

[jterrell]

The Cowboys carried the OL Hawkins as a developmental backup last year. He was always inactive and basically had no chance to play.

In 2013 and the end of 2012 they carried Weems as the inactive developmental OL that had not chance to actually play.

The Cowboys didn't use a draft pick on either Hawkins or Weems but did use on on Gibson. It seems that if Weems/Hawkins could hold down a developmental spot in those years, that Gibson could do it this year.

i think the obvious point is the 2012 and 2013 OLs were rather bad; this one isn't.

you have collins and green ahead of gibson as developmental guys this year.
gibson is your 3rd highest rated ROOKIE OT.
weems is ahead of him by having a couple years in the system already.

 

[NextGenBoys]

I wonder why Collins isn't seeing any work at RT. I was really hoping that would be his position of the future, not guard. I didn't like the Chaz Green pick, and was hoping Collins would be our RT of the future.