Colombo, 'boys far apart in contract talks

[cowboyed]

Historically, you are correct.

But he has maintained often since the season ended how much the overspending with no payoff last year left its mark.

Respectfully, your point is? Jones will be passive aggressive in this first wave of free agent signings and who can blame him.

 

[visionary]

good points have been made on both sides of this argument. it is hard to argue against the fact that players like davis and dockery are average. the added concern with davis is that he is lazy. on the other hand i have to agree with alexander that OL has to be the priority, we cant go into the draft with both RT and RG as question marks, that would be a recipe for disaster.

my take is that:

-we will sign columbo, he will get a fair deal (which some might consider overpaying)
-sign a lower level RG (some names have been suggested earlier in this thread)
-use a day 1 pick on OG

if the rookie or proctor beat out the vet in TC, they start at RG

 

[Crown Royal]

good points have been made on both sides of this argument. it is hard to argue against the fact that players like davis and dockery are average. the added concern with davis is that he is lazy. on the other hand i have to agree with alexander that OL has to be the priority, we cant go into the draft with both RT and RG as question marks, that would be a recipe for disaster.

my take is that:

-we will sign columbo, he will get a fair deal (which some might consider overpaying)
-sign a lower level RG (some names have been suggested earlier in this thread)
-use a day 1 pick on OG

if the rookie or proctor beat out the vet in TC, they start at RG

My favorite post in this thread. I won't begin to panic until we lose Colombo. To say we screwed the pooch because we didn't sign him is ridiculous - we don't know what he was asking for. I'm completely fine with him testing the market.

 

[Alexander]

McQ and Proctor wouldnt "cost" and would be reasonable...draft picks used on the OL wouldnt be huger investments either and be "reasonable"

Having an entire right side of an offensive line with less than a year's experience is not "reasonable".

Unless you are completely deranged.

 

[Alexander]

Respectfully, your point is? Jones will be passive aggressive in this first wave of free agent signings and who can blame him.

He can be passive-aggressive all he wants. And the blame will come if that behaviour ends up costing us a reasonable chance to field an offensive line that is at least as capable as last season.

I realize the draft is the next big hope, but suppose we target players and miss out? That happens every year.

And if everyone knows we need an offensive guard and especially tackle, there is a very strong chance that we will be a day late and a dollar short.

 

[Alexander]

-we will sign columbo, he will get a fair deal (which some might consider overpaying)
-sign a lower level RG (some names have been suggested earlier in this thread)
-use a day 1 pick on OG

This would get applause from me.

 

[visionary]

My favorite post in this thread. I won't begin to panic until we lose Colombo. To say we screwed the pooch because we didn't sign him is ridiculous - we don't know what he was asking for. I'm completely fine with him testing the market.

thanx CR
my take is columbo is going through what we ask ourselves when a player from a different team comes to us:

"why is his own team- who by the way does not have any back-up options at RT- letting him talk to other teams? is he still not fully recovered? are there still injury concerns?"

teams are hesitant to lock up such players for big dollars to a long-term deal. we are the team with the best info on him and have the cap room and as a result we are the most likely to pay him the most (if in fact we are comfortable with his injury issues). this is partly why I think we will sign him eventually. I also think he will turn out to be good value for us long-term.

 

[visionary]

This would get applause from me.

and me.
i think he represents good value for us if signed to the right deal, is young, familiar with our system, should continue to get better, and seems to have the 'nasty streak' peole refer to in good OL.

 

[Seven]

The Broncos are also looking at Dominick Rhodes, Patrick Kearney, backup QB and Joey Porter. They can't have them all. Relax. Everyone's interviewing everywhere.

 

[arglebargle]

It is only overspending if you have a poor eye for talent.

Players like Boiman, Hannam and Fabini were simply bad talent investments who did not have much to offer in comparison to their cost.

Vanderjagt was a ticking time bomb.

Smarter decisions would have kept him from overspending.

Right now, signing a quality starting offensive lineman is a lot more rational than spending millions on a special teams linebacker, backup tight end/special teams player, aged right tackle insurance and a mentally unbalanced placekicker.

Jones is overreacting to the decision, not the items that made it a bad decision.

That looks like hindsight talking. At the beginning of last year our right tackle was....ah... Fabini was insurance that the team would have someone at least half assed. It would have just been a prediction that Colombo would step up. Hell right now Fabini is probably our starting right tackle.... And should something change with that, he will probably net the Cowboys a draft pick as some other team gets nervous about their line situation. Looking at the Oline signings, Fabini is a cheap fallback.

Hannam was a nod to the 'two tight end offense' that the team hoped would protect Bledsoe. Which really does require that you have 4 reasonably capable tight ends. Only if Hannam was signed with an injury that the Cowboys didn't catch, would this be an error.

Boiman was brought in as an all around back up and ace special teamer. Note that he does have a super bowl ring now. Given the climate of the time, with the unsure status of Greg Ellis it was hedging the bet.

Players came through that could not have been predicted. Some of these signings did not pan out, but but more due to injury and others stepping up to the plate.

Now Vandershank and Rivera were much more suspect in my opinion. Large contracts to older players are always risky and that one showed exactly why. Vandershank ditto.

 

[pgreptom]

We do this every offseason. Every single offseason; all of us go in with big hopes, and dreams - only to be disappointed.

LG has been null since Allen. FS has been null since.. Woodson. QB has been null longer, but we fixed that through the draft(well, an UDFA.)

It really pisses me off.

RT, G, and FS are the two biggest priorities IMO this year. What do we do?

We're toying around with the RT who was signed - but he had a stellar year.

We're not getting the ball rolling on Davis. I don't believe the reports; we all know how good Jerry is.

We're not even looking at FS.

I'll wait until draft. I would feel solid if we JUST signed Davis, and re-signed Columbo. I would be content not going crazy in the FA. WE HAVE THE MONEY, SPEND IT. GO GET DAVIS, AND RE-SIGN COLUMBO.

Sorry.

</end rant>

 

[VACowboy]

I think saying Jerry has dropped the ball is way premature. Even if we lose Colombo I can certainly see a scenario where McQ starts at RT, Proctor starts at RG, we draft a day 1 guard/tackle and the OL is much better than last year. I definitely don't want to give $23 mil to a lazy, underachieving player or overpay for a player with average ability who has had one decent year coming off a major injury. Do I want to see Colombo back? You bet, but not for $15 mil up front. Davis? I'd love to see him playing RG, but not if it means shelling out a 23 million dollar signing bonus. The truth of the matter is that free agents are as big a gamble as draft picks. A rookie starting on the OL isn't the end of the world. Look at NE.

 

[Alexander]

That looks like hindsight talking. At the beginning of last year our right tackle was....ah... Fabini was insurance that the team would have someone at least half assed. It would have just been a prediction that Colombo would step up. Hell right now Fabini is probably our starting right tackle.... And should something change with that, he will probably net the Cowboys a draft pick as some other team gets nervous about their line situation. Looking at the Oline signings, Fabini is a cheap fallback.

Last year at this time, on this very board, Rob Petitti was supposed to be doing so well and on his way to being our starter.

How did that work out?

Colombo actually had results, and now he could leave.

Are we supposed to assume that since we signed Fabini last year, that it should have a carry over affect and be okay now, especially since we allowed the player who beat him out convincingly to leave?

Hannam was a nod to the 'two tight end offense' that the team hoped would protect Bledsoe. Which really does require that you have 4 reasonably capable tight ends. Only if Hannam was signed with an injury that the Cowboys didn't catch, would this be an error.

Boiman was brought in as an all around back up and ace special teamer. Note that he does have a super bowl ring now. Given the climate of the time, with the unsure status of Greg Ellis it was hedging the bet.

Players came through that could not have been predicted. Some of these signings did not pan out, but but more due to injury and others stepping up to the plate.

Now Vandershank and Rivera were much more suspect in my opinion. Large contracts to older players are always risky and that one showed exactly why. Vandershank ditto.

Of course it is hindsight talking.

And it is that failure that appears to be directing Mister Jones' thoughts now.

He and Stephen have both said they overdid it with these types of signings. And nobody can argue that.

But it is obvious to me that right now, this moment, we are reeling.

 

[rickster14]

I think saying Jerry has dropped the ball is way premature. Even if we lose Colombo I can certainly see a scenario where McQ starts at RT, Proctor starts at RG, we draft a day 1 guard/tackle and the OL is much better than last year. I definitely don't want to give $23 mil to a lazy, underachieving player or overpay for a player with average ability who has had one decent year coming off a major injury. Do I want to see Colombo back? You bet, but not for $15 mil up front. Davis? I'd love to see him playing RG, but not if it means shelling out a 23 million dollar signing bonus. The truth of the matter is that free agents are as big a gamble as draft picks. A rookie starting on the OL isn't the end of the world. Look at NE.

Great opinion. While we all want to sign a great OL to get us far into the playoffs, we don't need to just throw money at the problem. We've been burned w/ R. Young and Rivera in the lat few years (Fabini was cheap). Stephen and JJ have been improving as far as keeping us out of cap hell. Giving Colombo or Davis an irresponsible amount of $$ will bite us in the *** in a couple of years.

 

[burmafrd]

I would have no trouble overspending SOME on getting Columbo. we can draft a guard or sign a lower level FA there; and we have Proctor. So there is a fair amount of room to maneuver at guard. BUT at tackle there is no one out there that is as good as Columbo; Jordan Black was not as good last year and is older. There is no one out there in FA. And drafting tackles is a gamble as WE have found out. So if we lose Columbo I think we pencil in McQ there. And we still need to get us a young tackle to groom.

 

[arglebargle]

Last year at this time, on this very board, Rob Petitti was supposed to be doing so well and on his way to being our starter.

How did that work out?

Colombo actually had results, and now he could leave.

Are we supposed to assume that since we signed Fabini last year, that it should have a carry over affect and be okay now, especially since we allowed the player who beat him out convincingly to leave?



Of course it is hindsight talking.

And it is that failure that appears to be directing Mister Jones' thoughts now.

He and Stephen have both said they overdid it with these types of signings. And nobody can argue that.

But it is obvious to me that right now, this moment, we are reeling.

Fabini is the kinda guy that you can count on for 2-3 games should a starter go down, but not someone you want going all 16 games. Cowboys had their offensive line start together through the entire season. Not something you should count on. Something must be going on with the Colombo situation (health, contract demands, etc) that we are not party to. From what I have seen I would love to have Colombo back.

Sometimes Jerry seems to take the lesson a bit awry: It's not that you spent money on a kicker, its that you spent money on the wrong kicker. Though McBriar's contract shows that Jerry can still step up. With the huge contracts going out now, I am not sure if matching them is the best thing for the team. Especially with the talent level of the FA pool where it is. But you are always going to strike out some of the time, regardless of which way you jump.

I do agree that if Davis and Colombo go elsewhere, the Cowboys Oline is going to look kind of bare. Sparano will really have to earn his money.

 

[big dog cowboy]

I do agree that if Davis and Colombo go elsewhere, the Cowboys Oline is going to look kind of bare. Sparano will really have to earn his money.

Only if he can still play. If we ever did that is.

 

[Alexander]

Sometimes Jerry seems to take the lesson a bit awry

Say this again.

It is very important and significant.

He learns. Except the issue that he doesn't always take things out of the lesson that you would expect.

He isn't as bad as some of his staunchest opponents say he is.

Nor is he nearly as competent as his defenders suggest.

To me, he is a very tragic figure.

A man who is fights his own sense of hubris yearly.

Sparano will really have to earn his money.

That he will.

 

[Alexander]

I would have no trouble overspending SOME on getting Columbo.

At this stage, I would pay him what he wants.

He has the upper hand in relation to the Cowboys.

He won.

 

[fanfromvirginia]

At this stage, I would pay him what he wants.

He has the upper hand in relation to the Cowboys.

He won.

Unfortunatley, you're right. It took us several years and several (at least) tries to find someone who was good at RT and we let him walk out because we didn't want to overpay but now we're going to have to overpay that much more for him or for someone else with more question marks.

Biggest mistake of the offseason.

Qualification: we don't know too much about it yet -- it could turn out that Jerry and other are onto something.