Comics and Movies

[Runwildboys]

http://www.soulinstereo.com/2022/11/ranking-the-best-mcu-marvel-netflix-and-disney-villians.html

@Roadtrip635 ...Based off your comment on the best villains in the MCU - (whether film or stream series)... Here's a ranking look at My top 10 Villains in the MCU:
Thoughts ? ....Who am I Missing ?

1.Thanos

2. Kingpin

3 Loki

4 Killmonger

5 Hela (Thor Ragnarok)

6 Wanda Maximoff - Scarlet Witch

7 Bucky Winter Soldier

8 Dr. Octopus (Spider Man 2)

9 Green Goblin (William DaFoe)

10 Kilgrave Jessica Jones Netflix

Ultron

 

[DallasEast]

Ultron

This is, what the article @quickccc posted, defined Ultron, at number... 27???????????????????????

27. Ultron (Avengers: Age of Ultron)

Listen, Ultron wasn’t a BAD villain, but much like his titular film, should have been so much more. While he was definitely a threat, his jokey persona (thanks to Tony Stark’s influence) is a bit off-putting at times. But I’ll give props for his final showdown with Vision. The What If series did a better job showcasing the character but MCU Ultron certainly made his mark.

The above is a perfect example why I just roll with other folks' opinions since Man of Steel, lol.

Ultron has always been one of the top sociopaths in comics, even back during the watered down 1970's but forget all about him in print. Here is the Mayo Clinic listing the symptoms of antisocial personality disorder (link):

• Ignoring right and wrong.
• Telling lies to take advantage of others.
• Not being sensitive to or respectful of others.
• Using charm or wit to manipulate others for personal gain or pleasure.
• Having a sense of superiority and being extremely opinionated.
• Having problems with the law, including criminal behavior.
• Being hostile, aggressive, violent or threatening to others.
• Feeling no guilt about harming others.
• Doing dangerous things with no regard for the safety of self or others.
• Being irresponsible and failing to fulfill work or financial responsibilities.

Let's cut director and writer Joss Whedon some slack for the last symptom (slightly) but the on-screen characterization checks every single other box perfectly. Yet, James Spader's voicework (which I hold in high regard) is on point for a sociopath in this movie but some find it (like the article's author) 'off-putting'..? I can literally use point-by-point spoilers from the movie for ALL of the above but jokey-jokey Ultron makes him LESS of a villain by comparison?

Okay. Mini-rant over.

 

[Roadtrip635]

http://www.soulinstereo.com/2022/11/ranking-the-best-mcu-marvel-netflix-and-disney-villians.html

@Roadtrip635 ...Based off your comment on the best villains in the MCU - (whether film or stream series)... Here's a ranking look at My top 10 Villains in the MCU:
Thoughts ? ....Who am I Missing ?

1.Thanos

2. Kingpin

3 Loki

4 Killmonger

5 Hela (Thor Ragnarok)

6 Wanda Maximoff - Scarlet Witch

7 Bucky Winter Soldier

8 Dr. Octopus (Spider Man 2)

9 Green Goblin (William DaFoe)

10 Kilgrave Jessica Jones Netflix

I don't know if I could rank them exactly or really decide on "best", kinda more on personal favorites. Looking at the list on that site, I would definitely include groups or organizations like The Hand or Hydra. Their influence is too great and span across multiple properties. I would also include the "Fox Verse" I personally wouldn't include Wanda, Bucky, Elektra or Loki....yeah technically they were all villains at some point, but I don't think of them as true villains,that's just me tho.

My top 3 ranked
1. Thanos
2. Kingpin
3. Magneto

After that I don't think I can rank them just have my favorites, in no particular order

Agatha
The Hand
Red Skull/Hydra
Bullseye
Killgrave
Killmonger
Bushmaster
Green Goblin
Bushmaster
Black Mariah
Juggernaut
Mystique

 

[Runwildboys]

This is, what the article @quickccc posted, defined Ultron, at number... 27???????????????????????


The above is a perfect example why I just roll with other folks' opinions since Man of Steel, lol.

Ultron has always been one of the top sociopaths in comics, even back during the watered down 1970's but forget all about him in print. Here is the Mayo Clinic listing the symptoms of antisocial personality disorder (link):

• Ignoring right and wrong.
• Telling lies to take advantage of others.
• Not being sensitive to or respectful of others.
• Using charm or wit to manipulate others for personal gain or pleasure.
• Having a sense of superiority and being extremely opinionated.
• Having problems with the law, including criminal behavior.
• Being hostile, aggressive, violent or threatening to others.
• Feeling no guilt about harming others.
• Doing dangerous things with no regard for the safety of self or others.
• Being irresponsible and failing to fulfill work or financial responsibilities.

Let's cut director and writer Joss Whedon some slack for the last symptom (slightly) but the on-screen characterization checks every single other box perfectly. Yet, James Spader's voicework (which I hold in high regard) is on point for a sociopath in this movie but some find it (like the article's author) 'off-putting'..? I can literally use point-by-point spoilers from the movie for ALL of the above but jokey-jokey Ultron makes him LESS of a villain by comparison?

Okay. Mini-rant over.

As I read that, I was thinking, "Maybe, just maybe he'd have a point regarding Ultron's humor, if it were anyone else but Spader doing the voice work."

 

[DallasEast]

As I read that, I was thinking, "Maybe, just maybe he'd have a point regarding Ultron's humor, if it were anyone else but Spader doing the voice work."

It is obvious Joss Whedon borrowed heavily from James Spader's physical mannerisms, in particularly The Blacklist's Raymond Reddington, in Ultron's CGI work. I truly believe Whedon would have used the same technique for another actor. And the MCU casting track record has been above average in both good and not so good movies and television series.

There is no way of knowing but I think any actor's voicework (and psycho humor) of Ultron would have been perceived by the article's author the exact same way. It would not surprise me if a Brad Pitt Ultron would have gotten the same grade, lol.

 

[Roadtrip635]

It is obvious Joss Whedon borrowed heavily from James Spader's physical mannerisms, in particularly The Blacklist's Raymond Reddington, in Ultron's CGI work. I truly believe Whedon would have used the same technique for another actor. And the MCU casting track record has been above average in both good and not so good movies and television series.

There is no way of knowing but I think any actor's voicework (and psycho humor) of Ultron would have been perceived by the article's author the exact same way. It would not surprise me if a Brad Pitt Ultron would have gotten the same grade, lol.

What about Christopher Walken as Ultron, a little too psychotic? Morgan Freeman as Ultron, he would lull you into that false sense of security with that soothing voice he would convince people that what he was doing OK.

 

[DallasEast]

What about Christopher Walken as Ultron, a little too psychotic? Morgan Freeman as Ultron, he would lull you into that false sense of security with that soothing voice he would convince people that what he was doing OK.

I am being perfectly serious. Both of your suggestions would have been perfect alternatives, unique in their own way. Walken? That would have been crazy good. I would think Freeman's CGI would have been less animated than Walken or Spader's but no less menacing than the other two.

 

[Runwildboys]

It is obvious Joss Whedon borrowed heavily from James Spader's physical mannerisms, in particularly The Blacklist's Raymond Reddington, in Ultron's CGI work. I truly believe Whedon would have used the same technique for another actor. And the MCU casting track record has been above average in both good and not so good movies and television series.

There is no way of knowing but I think any actor's voicework (and psycho humor) of Ultron would have been perceived by the article's author the exact same way. It would not surprise me if a Brad Pitt Ultron would have gotten the same grade, lol.

I think Spader's creepy mannerisms and slow inflections are the perfect mesh with the sardonic, chilling monologues Ultron delivers. I think you'd be hard pressed to find another actor who could evoke such a feeling of dread, while making the audience look forward to the next line.

 

[DallasEast]

I have been debating whether to take the @quickccc article list and posting my own ranking based on those listed, because it is pretty comprehensive. The article is from November of last year, so it would be necessary to add The High Evolution (Guardians of the Galaxy Vol 3) and Gravik from Secret Invasion. Gravik is debatable this early on but Episode One puts him solidly on my list.

Some things have made me put off doing so though. For example, some of the villains and their villainy is a consequence of being a pawn. Take Wensu from Shang-Chi and The Legend of the Ten Rings. His actions were manipulated. Some villains are either not that nefarious in their actions or are flat out jokes (so far). Contessa Valentina Allegra de Fontaine from Black Widow, etc., as one of the former and Hulkling from She-Hulk, Attorney At Law as one of the latter.

Then there are the second-tier villains in the movie or television series. I love Andy Serkis' Klaw but he was a distant second to Ultron in the second Avengers movie. Ditto in Black Panther to Killmonger.

Knowing me I will eventually do a list. When is the question.

 

[Roadtrip635]

I am being perfectly serious. Both of your suggestions would have been perfect alternatives, unique in their own way. Walken? That would have been crazy good. I would think Freeman's CGI would have been less animated than Walken or Spader's but no less menacing than the other two.

While I mentioned them tongue in cheek, I think either one would have been great as Ultron, for different reasons. Walken slightly unhinged, who wouldn't want to see that? Freeman with his calm cool delivery would just make his decisions more unsettling. I think Spader did a great job, just a bit of fun thinking what others may have brought to the role.

 

[Roadtrip635]

I have been debating whether to take the @quickccc article list and posting my own ranking based on those listed, because it is pretty comprehensive. The article is from November of last year, so it would be necessary to add The High Evolution (Guardians of the Galaxy Vol 3) and Gravik from Secret Invasion. Gravik is debatable this early on but Episode One puts him solidly on my list.

Some things have made me put off doing so though. For example, some of the villains and their villainy is a consequence of being a pawn. Take Wensu from Shang-Chi and The Legend of the Ten Rings. His actions were manipulated. Some villains are either not that nefarious in their actions or are flat out jokes (so far). Contessa Valentina Allegra de Fontaine from Black Widow, etc., as one of the former and Hulkling from She-Hulk, Attorney At Law as one of the latter.

Then there are the second-tier villains in the movie or television series. I love Andy Serkis' Klaw but he was a distant second to Ultron in the second Avengers movie. Ditto in Black Panther to Killmonger.

Knowing me I will eventually do a list. When is the question.

I figured you already had our spread sheets out.

 

[DallasEast]

I figured you already had our spread sheets out.

Honestly, I had the villains' names in a spreadsheet already before I posted about doing it. Then I started doing my rankings, came across what I mentioned earlier, and said 'Frak it!' in the new Battlestar Galactica style. It can wait.

 

[quickccc]

I don't know if I could rank them exactly or really decide on "best", kinda more on personal favorites. Looking at the list on that site, I would definitely include groups or organizations like The Hand or Hydra. Their influence is too great and span across multiple properties. I would also include the "Fox Verse" I personally wouldn't include Wanda, Bucky, Elektra or Loki....yeah technically they were all villains at some point, but I don't think of them as true villains,that's just me tho.

My top 3 ranked
1. Thanos
2. Kingpin
3. Magneto

After that I don't think I can rank them just have my favorites, in no particular order

Agatha
The Hand
Red Skull/Hydra
Bullseye
Killgrave
Killmonger
Bushmaster
Green Goblin
Bushmaster
Black Mariah
Juggernaut
Mystique

Yep ... somehow I just knew I'd missed and forget to list, (even one of my favorites) ...Magneto ..how could I overlooked him ??
Maybe when @DallasEast .decides to unleash his own, much anticipated Top ranked villains in the MCU, I'll be moved to do a re-do of this top ranked villains myself., just because I would dare leave out one of the most memorable and inspiring villains in the MCU. ( loved the hell outta Fassbender's Xmen 1st Class performance !!)

I also thought heavily and was very close about placing Elektra in that top 10 ranking- ahead of Kilgrave Purple man
but as much as I adore the comic character, and grateful for the outstanding live action fighting scenes in Netflix's Daredevil.
I was never on board with the casting of Élodie Yung - sorry but I just found Elodie too old and dry looking ..too bland for the role.
I didn't think she was attractive enuff for that role.

Mystique, while she has been an intriguing MCU character, she's been casted as too middle of both superhero humanitarian (Lawrence)
and villain ( Rebecca Romijyn) ... at least with both Fassbender and McKellen's Magneto's we've seen him as murderer.. but never that way with Lawrence's Mystique.
I think if I did a top ranking as far as 12 to 15, I would've put Mystique in that far a ranking.

 

[DallasEast]

Disney Took Out an Ad Thanking Warner Bros.​

By Lana Porter | Disney Dining
June 25, 2023

The Walt Disney Company and Warner Bros. are two of the fiercest competitors in the entertainment industry. One is always trying to one-up the other to win audience favor in movies, television, and theme park attractions. The constant battle between Marvel Studios and DC Films or Disney Princesses and Harry Potter makes the fact that Disney took out an ad thanking Warner Bros. all the more surprising.

Before these titans of industry became quite so titanic, they actually joined forces on a pretty iconic project. It may not be making headlines today, but you may remember a film called Who Framed Roger Rabbit The 1988 film is a live-action/animated comedy directed by Robert Zemeckis based on Gary K. Wolf’s 1981 novel Who Censored Roger Rabbit.

Read more

 

[DallasEast]

Robert Kirkman Teases a New Villain in Invincible Season 2​

By Jeremy Dick | Movie Web
June 25, 2023

The wait for the second season of Invincible at Prime Video has been rough, but as we draw closer to its arrival, creator Robert Kirkman is dropping some new hints about what to expect. Something our titular superhero will have to worry about amid his ongoing problems with his immensely-powerful father is the introduction of a new villain, as Kirkman reveals in a new interview with Inverse. Specifically, season 2 will introduce Angstrom Levy, a supervillain who will bring multiverse elements to Invincible, making the series fit right in with what Marvel and DC have been doing lately.

“Some large or small aspect of season 2 focuses on the Angstrom Levy character," Kirkman says. “He'll be a new villain that comes into the series. And if you've read the comics, you're aware of who he is and what his deal is. He's a villain that has access to multiple dimensions, and so it's another one of those dang multiverse things.”

Read more

 

[DallasEast]

Warner Bros. needs to stop copying Disney and let its superheroes fly solo​

By Mike Calia | CNBC
June 25, 2023

“The Flash” is a flop. “Black Adam” was a bust. And does anyone remember “Shazam: Fury of the Gods”?

DC Studios needs more than a hero, it needs a new strategy – something different than even its recently established reboot plan.

DC and its parent company, Warner Bros. Discovery, have Marvel Cinematic Universe envy. It’s easy to see why. The MCU’s movies, including ones that haven’t been released by Disney , have grossed about $30 billion worldwide since 2008. Warner Bros. Discovery CEO David Zaslav has directed DC Studios co-CEOs James Gunn and Peter Safran to create their own shared universe involving iconic characters like Batman and Superman.

Read more
___________________

I do not believe the problem is DC copying Disney. The issue is poorly copying and executing what Disney has mostly done. And 'poorly' may not be the best description.

There is nothing wrong with standalones. The Batman, although an Elseworlds plot, was well-received and raked in nearly $800 million worldwide.

It should not be necessary for Warner Bros Discovery to shift totally to standalones though. Like Marvel, DC characters do not exist totally within mini-vacuums separate from one another. They interact with one another both within and outside their solo comic book titles.

The DCEU was not a blueprint. It was a page out of a coloring book, being completed by individuals handed bad crayons. James Gunn and Peter Safran were brought in to trash that coloring book and start (as fresh as possible) with an actual long-term DCU blueprint. Hopefully, audiences will remain patient enough to wait-and-see whether an thought out philosophy can succeed or not.

 

[quickccc]

Warner Bros. needs to stop copying Disney and let its superheroes fly solo​

By Mike Calia | CNBC
June 25, 2023

“The Flash” is a flop. “Black Adam” was a bust. And does anyone remember “Shazam: Fury of the Gods”?

DC Studios needs more than a hero, it needs a new strategy – something different than even its recently established reboot plan.

DC and its parent company, Warner Bros. Discovery, have Marvel Cinematic Universe envy. It’s easy to see why. The MCU’s movies, including ones that haven’t been released by Disney , have grossed about $30 billion worldwide since 2008. Warner Bros. Discovery CEO David Zaslav has directed DC Studios co-CEOs James Gunn and Peter Safran to create their own shared universe involving iconic characters like Batman and Superman.

Read more
___________________

I do not believe the problem is DC copying Disney. The issue is poorly copying and executing what Disney has mostly done. And 'poorly' may not be the best description.

There is nothing wrong with standalones. The Batman, although an Elseworlds plot, was well-received and raked in nearly $800 million worldwide.

It should not be necessary for Warner Bros Discovery to shift totally to standalones though. Like Marvel, DC characters do not exist totally within mini-vacuums separate from one another. They interact with one another both within and outside their solo comic book titles.

The DCEU was not a blueprint. It was a page out of a coloring book, being completed by individuals handed bad crayons. James Gunn and Peter Safran were brought in to trash that coloring book and start (as fresh as possible) with an actual long-term DCU blueprint. Hopefully, audiences will remain patient enough to wait-and-see whether an thought out philosophy can succeed or not.

Ironically I think it is very much based on what I and @DallasEast were very recently discussing with the strategic direction which DC studios could ..and should consider taking.
With such characters as J'onn Martian Mahnunter ..or my recommendation Etrigan the Demon

But DC studios seem hell bent on other ideas such as the Blue Beetle ... same ole same ole Super Legacy ... Aquaman 2 ... Joker 2 ... The Batman 2 Esleworld
Super Girl World of Tomorrow .. Batman Brave and the Bold.....

but like Shazam series, I'd be leery about how Blue Beetle is being presented now... with no apparent build up ... no set up introduction, no post film credits ..etc.

If not enuff general viewers are knowledgeable or well introduced to be interested in a Blue Beetle .
it could be likely that it could meet the fate of a Black Adam as a flop at the box office

However I am also looking for something new from DC such as Creature Commandoes..

How DC studios decide to introduce and present Creature Commandoes into a hopeful success remains to be seen.

 

[quickccc]

https://www.superherohype.com/wp-co...2023/06/swamp-thing-dcu-tv.jpg?resize=384,256

James Mangold Describes DCU’s Swamp Thing as a Stand-Alone Gothic Horror Movie​

Swamp Thing writer-director James Mangold shared he envisions the upcoming superhero movie as a stand-alone entry in the DC Universe.

During a recent interview with Variety, Mangold admitted he’s approaching Swamp Thing from an entirely different angle than that of DC Studios.

 

[quickccc]

https://www.superherohype.com/news/...have-gotten-lazy-with-their-superhero-stories

James Gunn: ‘People Have Gotten Lazy With Their Superhero Stories’​

As he prepares to head up the future of the DC Universe, James Gunn has criticized laziness in modern superhero projects.

Some movies have gotten lazy and generic, according to Gunn:

On Michael Rosenbaum’s Inside Of You podcast, Gunn promised DC will “be careful” about the projects they put out. He noted people have gotten “lazy” with their superhero films.
_____________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________

https://www.superherohype.com/movie...oining-dc-there-had-been-spectacular-missteps

James Gunn on Joining DC: ‘There Had Been Spectacular Missteps’​

DC Studios Co-CEO James Gunn discussed the DCEU with Michael Rosenbaum and noted that he knew there’d be difficulties when he accepted the role of Co-CEO.

 

[Juggernaut]