Dak-Deniers/Fact Haters, What Will Dak Have to Do for You to Eat Crow?

[QuincyCarterEra]

 

[Diehardblues]

I don't think Alfred Morris is of similiar ability to Zeke. So no, we would not need a replacement with similiar ability at all.

And you felt that offense without Elliot was playoff caliber?

 

[QuincyCarterEra]

And you felt that offense without Elliot was playoff caliber?

In games with Tyron and without Zeke we average more points per game, yards per game, yards per pass attempt, and yards per carry than games with Zeke over the last two years.

Scoring 38, 36, 30, and 20 points in those games.
In the 25 games Zeke did play over the last two years we've only hit 30 points 6 times. Without him in 7 games? 3 times. In the four games with Tyron and without Zeke? 3 times.

Better question is do you not think that's a playoff caliber offense?

 

[Fastpitch Dad]

Well, i usually dont answer Dak threads like this anymore. Just once in a while. And this time i decided to do so.

Most Dak Threads are lead by emotions and trying to simplify things by taking on extreme positions. They often offend others, title them as haters or lovers. Just like this one. I just can't understand how people think they will get a fundamentally sound answer by starting a thread like the one here. But anyways, as i said, i will post my kind of view to this one.

You talk a lot about "facts" but you don't give any source for them. You act like everybody has to "know" that Dak is a great player, but to prove your point you rely only on your own feelings. That isn't bad at all, everybody is free to like or dislike persons. But to talk about facts and then don't prove your point is weak.

You say Dak is a winner. That's a thesis (which by the way you again don't prove) which i tend to deny. Of course Dak seem to act like one. He seems to be a leader, and his body language is the one of someone who is always able to forget about his bad play and focuses on the next one. It seems he is well accepted by his teammates also. But none (including me) can say that for sure. We are not involved in the locker room, nor in the one-on-one talks between him and his coaches. All we have is the media and watching the games. That's not much to really get a picture of him. Else nobody in the NFL would have meetings with players they tend to draft or sign, if watching tape was enough.

But you use the word "winner" not because of those attributes. You use those attributes to talk him into a winner on the field. And that, to me, he certainly is not. American football is a sport (if not THE sport) that relies heavily on playing together as a functional unit. To me on offense it's even more important than on defense. You don't have success if players around you don't do "their job". So to say Dak is a winner just because he has a winning record, does only prove that he has a lot of players around him who know and are able to do their part. It does not prove that he is able to elevate players around him. IMO he is not. If you are not convinced then just look at what happened 2018 before Armani Cooper arrived here and/or Colombo took over the OL duties. And if you don't believe me that a player has to be in the right system and be surrounded by the right people to be successful then watch Chris Carter and what he does say about his success in the NFL.



On a side-note: I totally agree with everything those people say about Warren Moon. Heck, this guy threw one of the most beautiful balls i ever watched. I saw this guy play over his whole career. And i can tell you: he is a beauty to watch. To compare Dak to him is just unfair. I understand that prepping up your player is the way to go (especially in the offseason). But Kitna didn't do him good with that one.

I for myself have no feelings regarding Prescott. How should i ? I never met this guy. I have no relationship with him. All i want is my franchise to be successful. And here comes the problem.

Right now to me Dak Prescott is a mediocre QB. He has a lot of negatives on him. That isn't a problem at first. But in the last 3 years, he didn't show me anything that makes me believe he can get better in those. Because he didn't get better in that timespan. To give him a long-term contract and bind the faith of your franchise to him to me seems like a too risky move right now

Here are some of the deficiencies i recognice by watching him play:

• He is only a one read QB.
• His vision is not good. He doesn't see the whole field.
• He focuses too much and too long on one WR (which goes with my first bullet point).
  
• He isn't good at managing the pocket at all. He takes way too many sacks he should not.
• His accuracy is not good. He for sure has a strong arm, but he can't put the ball where it belongs (one reasons of Dez' decline playing with him).
• He can't read the DE well enough to be a real weapon as an option QB.
• He has a lot of troubles with his footwork.

Well, to prove some of my points, here is a (IMO good) article that shows some of his deficiencies. Don't get bothered by the sensational caption - the article's worth reading.

https://ftw.usatoday.com/2019/06/da...fDUdlpEI7SbnbLR_TRDnUFGsjAhh2UqMiZ2-oORS3J7w4

It shows very nicely what someone could sense by watching him play. Besides all the wins and his attributes (which i mentioned above) he leaves a feeling that doesn't convinces you. The stats (in your words "facts") tell a good story and matches with what you experience when you watch him play.

Those yellows and especially the red mark disturbs me. I even don't consider the green into the short flat to the right because most of it comes from screen passes to Zeke. He has to get better in the passing game. If he can get 50% of those yellows erased into greens and turns the red one into a green too, then we can talk about a contract again.

I myself consider Dak Prescott - compared to all starting NFL QBs - in the middles twenties right now. But i can live with the 18th spot PFF placed him also.

Here is another good video about Daks flaws:



Some more "facts":



https://fansided.com/2018/11/14/dak-prescott-cowboys-film-review-eagles/


On a new contract i would consider us not in a hurry. I for my own would like to watch him play for the half or in the third of the next season and then decide what you want to do with him. If he shows that he can get better then i am absolutely convinced to sign him to a long-term contract. But remember, if he doesn't pan out we still have the FT for 2020 and than maybe trading him. Which brings me to my last point.

There is a lot more to say, but to close my post, i don't want to say trading Prescott under all costs is a valuable option. But if someone - like this article suggests - is really willing to give me that kind of return i would strongly consider it. Just imagine what you could do with another rookie QB and the salary he will get: You could keep Cooper, LVE, Jalon Smith, Randall Cobb, etc etc.... We would be in great shape and considered a contender for years to come (of course, if the new QB pans out).

#21.

Wow, that post was a thing of beauty.

Well done.

 

[Diehardblues]

In games with Tyron and without Zeke we average more points per game, yards per game, yards per pass attempt, and yards per carry than games with Zeke over the last two years.

Scoring 38, 36, 30, and 20 points in those games.

Better question is do you not think that's a playoff caliber offense?

No, I didn’t . But I didn’t think it was last year without Cooper and with Elliott. Prescott needs more than just a top RB and OL. He needs a WR1 caliber as well.

 

[QuincyCarterEra]

No, I didn’t . But I didn’t think it was last year without Cooper and with Elliott. Prescott needs more than just a top RB and OL. He needs a WR1 caliber as well.

He doesn't need a top RB, unless you think Rod Smith and Alfred Morris are top RBs. Like I just laid out.

Also Dak was perfectly fine last year without a WR1 with Tyron last year, but your starting WRs can't be Terrence William's, Cole Beasley and a rookie along with Swaim as your starting TE.

In short, saying Dak needs a top WR, OL, and RB to be successful is just silly hog wash that no one will take seriously.

 

[Diehardblues]

He doesn't need a top RB, unless you think Rod Smith and Alfred Morris are top RBs. Like I just laid out.

Also Dak was perfectly fine last year without a WR1 with Tyron, but your starting WRs can't be Terrence William's, Cole Beasley and a rookie along with Swaim as your starting TE.

In short, saying Dak needs a top WR, OL, and RB to be successful is just silly hog wash that no one will take seriously.

We know what we’ve seen thus far. And without those Elite pieces last two seasons results haven’t been as favorable. The rest is subjective arguments.

IMO it’s makes it harder to win without those Elite pieces supporting cast. Obviously with a 3-3 and 3-4 records he can still have some success .

I’m not even sure it’s a playoff caliber offense with them. 22nd ranked is definitely not championship caliber.

 

[cern]

His endorsements have been provided from his popularity as well. Unless you think his 2nd best selling jersey in NFL is also more of a reflection of his performance .

“over compensating “ was in response to your comment about whether we compensate him for under paying initially.

and he is popular because...……………………………………..? how about because of his performance. he's earned his status because all he does is go out and win.

 

[Them]

Dak-Deniers/Fact Haters, What Will Dak Have to Do for You to Eat Crow?

First of all .I like Dak and I won't eat crow...I liked Romo too...I supported him for a decade...side by side, Dak now and Romo at the end of his career...I say Romo was a more accurate passer (Kitna and Dak or working on that.)..Romo could read defense better.( Dak is improving every year.) Romo was fragile, Dak is built like a tank. As far as winning...Dak has got us to the Divisional rounds of the playoffs...Romo also accomplished that. So if Dak can get the team past the Divisional round, then he is probably the best Dallas QB since...Danny White?...lol...

 

[Diehardblues]

and he is popular because...……………………………………..? how about because of his performance. he's earned his status because all he does is go out and win.

It’s limited success for the most polarized and popular sports franchise in the world. When you consider Brady was the #1 jersey sold it certainly doesn’t add up that Prescott would be #2. Popularity and performance are not always parallel.

 

[cern]

It’s limited success for the most polarized and popular sports franchise in the world. When you consider Brady was the #1 jersey sold it certainly doesn’t add up that Prescott would be #2. Popularity and performance are not always parallel.

not all universes are parallel. nfce champs 2 of 3 years. multiple come from behind victories. you choose to be dismissive of his achievements. I do not. you enjoy argumentum ad hominem. I find it boring.

 

[CowboyRoy]

Yeah, there are other QBs that are better and that would be chosen over Prescott, but it's a moot point. I'd take a 100,000 more in salary - same logic. What fans fail or refuse to do is accept Prescott isn't the Queen Mary Mother of all QBs and just enjoy watching the kid play. I guess this makes me a homer....whatever.

It tells you how promising the kid is when the trolls are complaining about the fact he isn't Mahones. Its gotten that bad for them.

 

[CowboyRoy]

Yep a Dak hater who said he has no problem paying Dak a big contract if he goes out this year and plays well.

Yep, hater alright.

What do you call playing well? And are you saying he hasn't played well the first 3 years?

 

[CowboyRoy]

Follow the conversation. Whirlwin said a page back he thinks Dak is as good as Mahomes.

He and I are discussing this premise.

Well, Im on your side then. Anyone that thinks Dak is as good as Mahones is a complete homer. HE simply isn't in that league as a passer.

 

[Diehardblues]

not all universes are parallel. nfce champs 2 of 3 years. multiple come from behind victories. you choose to be dismissive of his achievements. I do not. you enjoy argumentum ad hominem. I find it boring.

I haven’t dismissed his achievements. I simply don’t find them to the level of the accolades some provide.

And I argue my opinions relentlessly when I strongly believe in them.

 

[CouchCoach]

not all universes are parallel. nfce champs 2 of 3 years. multiple come from behind victories. you choose to be dismissive of his achievements. I do not. you enjoy argumentum ad hominem. I find it boring.

I find adding homini to anything doesn't make it more interesting. Just pregnant corn kernels.

 

[pansophy]

For me it depends on his salary, but if he is top 5 paid when he signs then I’ll say we are getting our moneys worth if we are in the top 10 in 3rd and long success and red zone success (especially 3rd and long).

 

[12+88=7]

Well still the teams that score 30 + in games generally pass more, and or get turnovers for pick 6 or easy td's.
They get lucky too and hit on some long td's like that guy did for tampa early last year.
Tony did it when he passed for 38-50 times a game, and hit on some long passes, it wasnt a regular thing.
Also tony and others lose even though they score more than 30 + like the denver game Tony lost 55-49

The best thing is simply to have a defense that doesnt allow + 30 games those are the teams that win in playoffs.

That Denver game is my exact point.

Going in I knew the game was going to be high scoring, but I had a confidence with Romo at QB that Dallas could keep up with Denver.

Now when Dallas faces a high scoring offense my confidence in getting a win diminishes with Prescott at QB. I don't believe Prescott has the ability in the passing game to air it out.

Dallas has to hope the defense can hold, because if they don't Dallas will lose.

 

[cern]

I find adding homini to anything doesn't make it more interesting. Just pregnant corn kernels.

without hominy, there would be no pozole. but use dried nixtamal, not canned hominy.

 

[wssaustin]

This is a team sport, any achieve takes a team effort. Agreed?

Our team went to divisional round twice, an important reason is the team is young and Dak is cheap, we got enough salary room to have big amount of top-tier talents. Thing will be very different after his salary occupies more than 20% of the CAP. Our defense and running game and OL had to carry Dak in a lot of games.

Dak-Deniers/Fact Haters, What Will Dak Have to Do for You to Eat Crow?

First of all .I like Dak and I won't eat crow...I liked Romo too...I supported him for a decade...side by side, Dak now and Romo at the end of his career...I say Romo was a more accurate passer (Kitna and Dak or working on that.)..Romo could read defense better.( Dak is improving every year.) Romo was fragile, Dak is built like a tank. As far as winning...Dak has got us to the Divisional rounds of the playoffs...Romo also accomplished that. So if Dak can get the team past the Divisional round, then he is probably the best Dallas QB since...Danny White?...lol...