Dak: Don't plan on being 3-5. However, that's up to the front office. You know what I mean

[Chasing6]

I see what you're getting at, but I still disagree. Respect the thought and effort put into the post though. There was some leftover talent from the dynasty moving into the late 90s, but the draft takes from 94-00 were awful. As players aged and left for greener pastures, the talent replacing them collectively was poor at best.

1994: Larry Allen
1995: *crickets*
1996: Randall Godfrey
1997: Dexter Coakley
1998: Greg Ellis, Flozell Adams, Darren Hambrick...probably his best effort of that era
1999: Dat Nguyen
2000: 6th rounder Mario Edwards was the best of one of the worst drafts we've seen from the Dallas Cowboys

Over that 7 year period, we saw 6 drafts that brought in 1 or fewer strong contributors. So you lose your hall of fame coach, you lose his personnel expertise, you lose talent, and don't replace it adequately, you lose Jerral's bank account to the salary cap....that's alot to account for in a short period of time, especially when you have a novice surrounded by yes men running the show. The franchise went from legendary to awful in a 3 year time frame. It didn't rebound until Tuna showed up, after which we saw a more steady influx of talent and a better operated franchise.

We can't say Troy can't win with less than excellent talent around him because we don't have the data set to accurately come to that conclusion. We can say that Dak is unable to win with exceptional talent relative to the time period because his stats dictate as much. Last year's team was easily top 5 in the league in terms of talent. It wasn't as talented as the 92-95 Cowboys, but no team has been since the salary cap was implemented. The argument that nobody has had the talent that Troy had is null and void, because the salary cap prevents such a team from being built. We have to project what we think Troy could do on a modern top 5 team, and given the circumstances, I fully believe he had the skill set and intangibles to take the teams I listed much farther in the playoffs than Dak. Does the team become a dynasty like in the 90s? I'm not going to say no, but I really doubt it....but I do think we're more successful in the postseason.

No surprise that is when the salary cap started and exposed GM Jethro.

You might not be able to say that about Troy, but I can. Also, Troy absolutely hated playing for subpar coaching. Troy admitted recently admitted he did not retire early because of concussions. He could not handle playing for bad coaches and undisciplined teams.

 

[Whiskey Cowboy]

No surprise that is when the salary cap started and exposed GM Jethro.

You might not be able to say that about Troy, but I can. Also, Troy absolutely hated playing for subpar coaching. Troy admitted recently admitted he did not retire early because of concussions. He could not handle playing for bad coaches and undisciplined teams.

I hadn't factored that into the equation, and based on this back and forth between he and McCarthy, you're probably right. Aikman was/is a perfectionist and that's what made him great. That's why I think his leadership could've helped previous versions of this teams chances for success. McCarthy is sloppy. He's a "players coach", and doesn't focus on the finer details of the game. Would he publicly argue with Aikman's critique if Troy were QB today? Would it even be an issue if Troy were on the practice field correcting it himself? Hard to say.

 

[CowboyFrog]

I see what you're getting at, but I still disagree. Respect the thought and effort put into the post though. There was some leftover talent from the dynasty moving into the late 90s, but the draft takes from 94-00 were awful. As players aged and left for greener pastures, the talent replacing them collectively was poor at best.

1994: Larry Allen
1995: *crickets*
1996: Randall Godfrey
1997: Dexter Coakley
1998: Greg Ellis, Flozell Adams, Darren Hambrick...probably his best effort of that era
1999: Dat Nguyen
2000: 6th rounder Mario Edwards was the best of one of the worst drafts we've seen from the Dallas Cowboys

Over that 7 year period, we saw 6 drafts that brought in 1 or fewer strong contributors. So you lose your hall of fame coach, you lose his personnel expertise, you lose talent, and don't replace it adequately, you lose Jerral's bank account to the salary cap....that's alot to account for in a short period of time, especially when you have a novice surrounded by yes men running the show. The franchise went from legendary to awful in a 3 year time frame. It didn't rebound until Tuna showed up, after which we saw a more steady influx of talent and a better operated franchise.

We can't say Troy can't win with less than excellent talent around him because we don't have the data set to accurately come to that conclusion. We can say that Dak is unable to win with exceptional talent relative to the time period because his stats dictate as much. Last year's team was easily top 5 in the league in terms of talent. It wasn't as talented as the 92-95 Cowboys, but no team has been since the salary cap was implemented. The argument that nobody has had the talent that Troy had is null and void, because the salary cap prevents such a team from being built. We have to project what we think Troy could do on a modern top 5 team, and given the circumstances, I fully believe he had the skill set and intangibles to take the teams I listed much farther in the playoffs than Dak. Does the team become a dynasty like in the 90s? I'm not going to say no, but I really doubt it....but I do think we're more successful in the postseason.

Im not saying Troy cant win with less talent I'm saying teams that win dont have the holes Jerry built teams have...do i know what Romo/Dak are with Jerry built teams..yes...do i know what they could do with a FO that actually builds a team that doesnt have glaring holes..no..Troy had both and he did alot better before Jerry was building the team..thats all im saying. Troy was great im not taking anything away from him..Jerry is not good at all at his GM job.

 

[CowboyFrog]

I hadn't factored that into the equation, and based on this back and forth between he and McCarthy, you're probably right. Aikman was/is a perfectionist and that's what made him great. That's why I think his leadership could've helped previous versions of this teams chances for success. McCarthy is sloppy. He's a "players coach", and doesn't focus on the finer details of the game. Would he publicly argue with Aikman's critique if Troy were QB today? Would it even be an issue if Troy were on the practice field correcting it himself? Hard to say.

yes he can not make our DT's good no matter how mad he gets at practice...thats what im saying.

 

[Whiskey Cowboy]

yes he can not make our DT's good no matter how mad he gets at practice...thats what im saying.

The defense under Quinn was built to sustain leads. I agree that it was poorly designed, but do you think Troy craps the bed and doesn't show up until the 4th quarter of the last couple of playoff games? The man was maybe the best game manager ever outside of Tom Brady. If he's able to hit some passes early, chances are pretty good that we can get the running game going to control the clock and keep our defense fresh. Go up 2 scores, and that same defense is able to pin their ears back and attack as designed, rather than have the ball shoved down their throats the entire game. I doubt we see Troy and Lamb having a lovers quarrel in the first quarter and I doubt we see that negativity snowball into the big deficit we faced later in that game.

Troy brought elite leadership and consistency. He's the opposite of Dak, who you really don't know what you're going to get until kickoff. That consistency is what this team has been missing. I'm not saying Jerral is doing a great job. He isn't. What I'm saying is there have been a few years where if we had the right guy under center, we would've had a better chance at success. We all thought last year felt different until the end, before it all fell apart on the big stage. Does that happen with a stronger leader of men? Personally, I don't think so.

 

[blueblood70]

Agree to disagree. Maybe Troy doesnt win a Lombardi, but im sure he wins more than 2 playoff games with the talent that's been assembled over the last decade. Troy was an exceptional leader and wouldn't have tolerated the constant post season meltdowns that we've seen from Tony and Dak. The man knew how to elevate his teammates. He knew how to win when it mattered. To compare him to Dak or Tony is laughable at best. He had a great supporting cast, but a great supporting cast won't win you three championships in 4 years. Jim Kelly went to 4 straight, but couldn't bring home the prize. He was one of the greatest to ever play the position. Put him on some of the more talented teams of this generation and the Cowboys aren't the laughing stock of the last decade.

Oh no there's no agree to disagree we have no time machine to end this but you just said it yourself you just backtrack maybe he wouldn't win a Super Bowl with that's it that's the ultimate goal I don't wanna hear anything else Troy was not any better leader than Prescott he was not a better player than Prescott they are basically in the same tier it just makes you feel better because he's got all the rings to say he's better but that's not true because I'm hearing Trent dilfer and Nick Foles calling out the fact that you're blind to what really went on it was a massively awesome run game a massively awesome put together offensive line the run game scheme the defense the coaching staff it all came together he had all kinds of weapons you remember the all in thing that we talked about quarterbacks get to experience and others don't that's what Troy experienced and yet his sad little touchdown to interception ratio proves even with all that talent around him he made mistakes and he made them a lot and he made them in the playoffs I watched him throw interceptions in the Super bowl much like Matthew Stafford that's a good example he's no better than Matthew Stafford..

Matthew Stafford goes from a team that he couldn't win with but we knew he had the talent to a team that was ready to win a Super Bowl and yet what does he do he leads the league in interceptions he throws 2 interceptions in the Super bowl and yet they still win despite his mistakes..

that's what we're missing here that's what Romo and Prescott has never had is a team that didn't expect the quarterback to play perfect and for the fans to act like it's the quarterback's fault when they don't when you got to look around.... The facts are all there I watch games in the playoffs where our defense was so horrible I don't care what our offense was gonna do and I've watched our defense play OK but then we have no running game ever in the big games literally under 3 yards per carry so really sad running back stats in these big games and we also have leaky inconsistent offensive lines we even have Troy himself saying he doesn't know what the receivers are supposed to be running but something don't look right they're not getting open the separation rates aren't there and then when Prescott aroma finally does hit these guys in the hands you got guys dropping passes or letting them bounce off them and fall into the hands of the enemy I watched all these playoff games the biggest problem has been defense and mistakes by the team the whole team you didn't see this very often with the 90s Cowboys or the 70s Cowboys they had great teams top to bottom including some of the best coaching ever there is no debate there is no agree to disagree because we we have no time machine but I'm telling you right now even with Troy and Rogers great teams they made a ton of mistakes they literally did throw interceptions in big moments and you know what happened the defense made stops they got the ball back they got turnovers then they had a running game to help the quarterback get back on track when he was not having a good start to a game..