Dak on Hurts contract

CowboyoWales

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You can’t further spread proration, once it’s set it’s set. So any new contract will just build cap hits on top of the previous proration.

The 61m$ is not all proration, ~30m$ of it is salary and 30 is previous proration . So if you prorate that new salary, it’d get reduced to 36m$, the floor of what his 2024 cap hit will be. And then the extension will have a signing bonus that will add on top of that. I would guess his 2024 cap hit is around 45m$ after the new or deal for 2024.
Cheers, I thought we couldn't spread the bonus.
I got to $61M as I was adding on the $36m of Void year bonus to the $25m bonus for 2024.
If we look to extend before 2024 there's also the existing $34m (salary and roster bonus)owed Dak for 2024....I'm sure if Dak/French are concerned about being paid he'll want that taken into account.
 

MyFairLady

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the two have nothing to do with each other. its a fan made up fallacy that because I ask for money, I don't care about success. are there a few that are that way? yes. but to generalize that every player who asks for money doesn't care about winning is just not true
IMHO this is completely untrue. The primary goal of the modern athlete is to maximize earnings. The money is so high a player would be foolish to prioritize anything else. The problems start after they achieve their primary goal. How much do you really care about the secondary goal of team success? As it turns out many do not care much at all. The examples are endless. There are just as many examples of players who care about winning and legacy. The key is to identify who is going to still care about football after they get paid. The likelihood that a player will still care about football after getting paid is indirectly proportional to the amount they get paid. At this point I believe that it is indisputable.
 

Aerolithe_Lion

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Cheers, I thought we couldn't spread the bonus.
I got to $61M as I was adding on the $36m of Void year bonus to the $25m bonus for 2024.
If we look to extend before 2024 there's also the existing $34m (salary and roster bonus)owed Dak for 2024....I'm sure if Dak/French are concerned about being paid he'll want that taken into account.
The void Year money will stay in place 2025, 2026 etc as long as he gets an extension. It only gets added in 2024 if he’s cut or traded
 

atlantacowboy

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If you think players are overpaid tell the millions of people to stop watching the league... simple right?
The argument is that QBs are overpaid relative to the cap and other players on the team. Football truly is a team sport and good arguments could be made that nobody should be paid more than anyone else. None of them can do their jobs without a lot of help from their teammates.
 

Cowboysheelsreds058

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In before this goes down hill like intended. :laugh:

So what, who cares. It is one of those topics that will vary as we all know.

All are way overpaid, and rather if one feels it hurts the team or not in the end they are all overpaid.

LLLOOOLLL, on the first part, it was the Horsemen that started this and the rest will be here soon to end it. LOL
 

CowboyoWales

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The void Year money will stay in place 2025, 2026 etc as long as he gets an extension. It only gets added in 2024 if he’s cut or traded
Cheers again. So the problem is still going to be that the 'cheaper' early years are going to be eaten up by paying the Prorated Bonus (2024) and Void Bonus (especially in 2025).
Just trying to clarify and highlighting that any deal with Dak isnt going to comparative in any way to Hurts'.
@LatinMind highlighted the potential (and viable) option about cutting Dak as a mid-June cut (with a $36m or so saving)....if his stats in 2023 indicate a declining trend .. Dak's potentially in a situation where he's not going to worry about what Hurts/Jackson's getting paid
 

Dakota

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You know
Basically Dak his whole career. I agree, it’s just that Hurts mechanics, escapability and touch are way better than Dak..
Hurts still has tremendous up side potential, he has shown improvement year after year. He is also only 24. In addition, regardless of who he plays for, he is hard not to like. Dak, ummmm., not so much. He doesn't show improvement and he is not getting any younger. The only thing Dak has in common with Hurts is his competitiveness. And when it comes to placing importance on winning and not personal financial wealth, Hurts wins in that category as well.
 

Aerolithe_Lion

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Cheers again. So the problem is still going to be that the 'cheaper' early years are going to be eaten up by paying the Prorated Bonus (2024) and Void Bonus (especially in 2025).
Just trying to clarify and highlighting that any deal with Dak isnt going to comparative in any way to Hurts'.
@LatinMind highlighted the potential (and viable) option about cutting Dak as a mid-June cut (with a $36m or so saving)....if his stats in 2023 indicate a declining trend .. Dak's potentially in a situation where he's not going to worry about what Hurts/Jackson's getting paid
Yeah exactly. So you went bargain cheap first few years on first deal, spreading the “saved” money over a 5 year proration period. Then you’ll do the same thing with the next deal, but the bargain cheap first few years will be sitting on top of that prorated money from the previous contract. It can’t be like 2021-2023 anymore, but you’ll still try and keep it lower than the contract average annual value.
 

Flamma

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I’ve seen plenty of QBs worse than Dak win a Super Bowl.

What I haven’t seen is a QB that requires a team to carry him win a Super Bowl while making money like he’s elite.

Dak’s cap hit needs to be about 10% of our total cap if that.
He's 11.5% this year.
 

Flamma

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Assuming a 15% increase for next year he will be at 23.3%. Guess we better win now.
If he doesn't completely crap the bed, I'm guessing he gets an extension after this season. His cap hit will depend on how they structure it.

I'm noticing that more and more teams are pushing money forward as to not have big cap hits for their QBs. That's one way to compete against teams with good QBs on rookie contracts.
 

DandyDon52

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and you say that because? as if they are the first players ever to demand money...don't forget Emmitt held out to get a contract he wanted and he still played, and went on to win superbowls... there is plenty of other examples. one has to separate the business side from the football side.
true but smith had won the rushing title 2 years in a row, and helped his team get to and win a SB.
His 4 year deal in total was for 13.6 million, not per year lol but in total. Jerry paid him 7 mil that year as to avoid it counting on the cap
which started the next year.
Smith helped the team to win 2 more SB's in next 3 years.

Dak didnt just want top pay for getting to playoffs, not SB, he wanted to maximise the amount by getting a 4 year deal and then get another contract
for more $ again, and demanded a no trade clause. All that after getting the F. tag money.
 

OmerV

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Im not sure if this was already posted, but don’t expect anything, other than Dak trying to get the highest QB contract when he tried to negotiate his next contract. This was basically his words on Lamar Jackson.



This is basically the same exact thing when Zeke got his contract and Dak said he isn’t taking a “home” discount. Of course his logic was sound in regards to the NFL getting more revenue with gambling, meaning teams don’t really lose money, but this guy actually thinks he’s that good..

https://www.si.com/nfl/cowboys/news...-lamar-jackson-adam-schefter-next-quarterback
Apparently the Cowboys think, or at least thought, he's that good, which is what matters in a contract negotiation. No player is going to say he thinks he's only good enough to get 60% of what the market will bear, so why would we expect Dak to?
 

atlantacowboy

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After Hurts leading the Eagles to the Super Bowl and playing outstanding in the game, Roseman had little choice but to reward Hurts and avoid turning it into another Lamar Jackson type debacle. Hurts improvement has shocked the world and he is the new standard in the NFC.
 

CowboysFaninHouston

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true but smith had won the rushing title 2 years in a row, and helped his team get to and win a SB.
His 4 year deal in total was for 13.6 million, not per year lol but in total. Jerry paid him 7 mil that year as to avoid it counting on the cap
which started the next year.
Smith helped the team to win 2 more SB's in next 3 years.

Dak didnt just want top pay for getting to playoffs, not SB, he wanted to maximise the amount by getting a 4 year deal and then get another contract
for more $ again, and demanded a no trade clause. All that after getting the F. tag money.
like I said, Smith was just an example. there are 100s of others. and yes, 13.6M back in 1990s. are you comparing money then to money now? seriously? how much did aikman make? that was dumb.

and then you switch to after the fact. he held out. he got the contract....superbowl wasn't guaranteed, but I think you reached for your crystal ball there to make that argument.

contracts are business side of things. you are saying Dak wants money but has no interest in winning a superbowl. which is absurd. that statement is absurd for 99.5% of players who have ever been in the league.

btw, Jerry Jones can walk away. he is not obligated to give anyone a contract. in fact he walked away from Cooper after giving up a 1st round pick and 20M/season contract.

you are very very confused. you have no idea how NFL works.
 

CowboysFaninHouston

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IMHO this is completely untrue. The primary goal of the modern athlete is to maximize earnings. The money is so high a player would be foolish to prioritize anything else. The problems start after they achieve their primary goal. How much do you really care about the secondary goal of team success? As it turns out many do not care much at all. The examples are endless. There are just as many examples of players who care about winning and legacy. The key is to identify who is going to still care about football after they get paid. The likelihood that a player will still care about football after getting paid is indirectly proportional to the amount they get paid. At this point I believe that it is indisputable.
this is complete untrue. the primary goal of most modern athlete's is to win championships. Mahomes got a 450M contract. did he not want to win a championship? Rodgers got the biggest contract at the time he signed and was highest paid until hurts, does rodgers not want to win a championship? Michael Jordan got paid. he was relentless about winning rings. and I can list literally 100s of athletes......

you are mixing up the business side of things into football side of things and they two aren't the same. once contract is signed, its the same old grind for all of them. until they don't want to do it any more.

sorry, what you said was meaningless and very disputable. the whole premise is wrong from bottom up.
 

CowboysFaninHouston

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As has been explained to you before, a more accurate accessment is about the QB's CAP%.
Dak's CAP hit from his last contract hasn't really hit yet....maybe you can answer my question in post #92?
The reason I ask it is that unlike most contracts which involve cheap initial years as due to the Prorated Signing Bonus, we'll be stuck with Dak's $61m.
Now yes we can spread Dak's money, but he's going into the 30 year season, so we aren't looking at the same sort of Hurts deal.
Dak's cap hit the past two years was 17M and 19M. less than 10% of the cap...you jumped two years into the future to make a case for past and present..... at the time Eli signed people claimed Giants are doomed, yet they won two championships. cap goes up. you are struggling with cap management concepts.

its a losing argument that has been debunked 100 times over. now, next you are going to bring up averages against the cap total value for a season.

btw, is it Dak's fault for the way the contract was structured? or is it Jerry Jones? Jerry could have walked away. he chose not to. so blaming Dak in all of this is meaningless.
 

Adreme

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I've always seen it as the 1st contract being team friendly, the 2nd being player friendly, and 3rd being up to how team friendly the player wants to be.

Would have hoped Dak would see Tom Brady as a role model for contracts in his later years. Not banking on that though.
With QBs, especially on shorter deals, I always figure its 2 and 3 that are player friendly and the 4th where they take a discount because they want to win before the end.
 

CowboyoWales

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Dak's cap hit the past two years was 17M and 19M. less than 10% of the cap...you jumped two years into the future to make a case for past and present..... at the time Eli signed people claimed Giants are doomed, yet they won two championships. cap goes up. you are struggling with cap management concepts.

its a losing argument that has been debunked 100 times over. now, next you are going to bring up averages against the cap total value for a season.

btw, is it Dak's fault for the way the contract was structured? or is it Jerry Jones? Jerry could have walked away. he chose not to. so blaming Dak in all of this is meaningless.
:huh:......jumped two years into the future??? Well you cant just ignore the future CAP, especially when your argument is "well he was cheap for the last two years".

I dont even understand what those words are supposed to mean in the second paragraph?

....and not to hurt your repeated sensitivities towards Dak, i'm not blaming him, just pointing out that the forthcoming contract extension is going to involve a big CAP hit from the start.
 

Kingofholland

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With QBs, especially on shorter deals, I always figure its 2 and 3 that are player friendly and the 4th where they take a discount because they want to win before the end.
Yep guess it all depends on the length. Normally the end of the 2nd contract takes the player to their early 30s so market may not necessairly be what they want anyway.
 
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