Dallas vs. Miami... Who wins the NBA Finals? (Heat wins series 4-2)

[Vintage]

So you picked out my "By the Way" comment, and that refutes my entire post?? Did you read anything about the free throws??

BY THE WAY... what percentage is 11-28?? I'll help you out... 39%

Well, if one game makes him a bad player...

What would we call Dirk for the series?

I chose that part of your "arguement" bec. I quickly wanted to disspell any notions that you had of him shooting below 50% as bad.

If you wanted to challenge his range of his shots; or challenge the fact that he isn't a great 3 point shooter, you should have. And I would give little arguement otherwise.

He drew contact, went to the line. Thats what you want your guards to do (besides hitting J's, playing defense, etc).

 

[peplaw06]

dude...all i have to say to you is....FIFTY.

FIFTY free throws in ONE GAME for the mavs vs the spurs.


but i'm pretty sure you were ok with that.

Go read my prior posts. I said everyone complains... at least I'm not playing like teams should NEVER have a beef with or blame the refs. Fans complain when the refs screw their team, then they call the other teams fans crybabies when the refs screw the opponent, and the fans complain about it.

 

[peplaw06]

Well, if one game makes him a bad player...

What would we call Dirk for the series?

I chose that part of your "arguement" bec. I quickly wanted to disspell any notions that you had of him shooting below 50% as bad.

If you wanted to challenge his range of his shots; or challenge the fact that he isn't a great 3 point shooter, you should have. And I would give little arguement otherwise.

He drew contact, went to the line. Thats what you want your guards to do (besides hitting J's, playing defense, etc).

I'm the first to admit Dirk has been pretty bad. That's not the point bud. You're trying to change the subject, cause you can't win. And did I ever say Wade was a "bad player??" There you go again, putting words in my mouth. I love arguing with you, making fabrications out of thin air. The point behind saying Wade shot 39% is to show that the Mavs did play pretty good defense, at least in Game 5, on Wade.

And there's no doubt, he did go to the line... 25 times. You're right, he did go to the line. As for the contact... on Dirk... show me.

 

[SA_Gunslinger]

Go read my prior posts. I said everyone complains... at least I'm not playing like teams should NEVER have a beef with or blame the refs. Fans complain when the refs screw their team, then they call the other teams fans crybabies when the refs screw the opponent, and the fans complain about it.

i'm not even complaining, and i wasn't then, either. that's the breaks.

i'm just pointing out that the mavs have had their share of favorable refereeing (sp?) in these playoffs, so to cry foul now is pretty humorous to me.

 

[Vintage]

Dirk:

Game 1: 4/14 28% (roughly)
Game 2: 8/16 50%
Game 3: 9/20 45%
Game 4: 2/14 14% (roughly)
Game 5: 8/19 42%

Series:
31/83 37%

 

[Vintage]

I'm the first to admit Dirk has been pretty bad. That's not the point bud. You're trying to change the subject, cause you can't win. And did I ever say Wade was a "bad player??" There you go again, putting words in my mouth. I love arguing with you, making fabrications out of thin air. The point behind saying Wade shot 39% is to show that the Mavs did play pretty good defense, at least in Game 5, on Wade.

And there's no doubt, he did go to the line... 25 times. You're right, he did go to the line. As for the contact... on Dirk... show me.

Because I can't win?

You are the one who is refuting me for saying the refs didn't lose the game and that the Mavs did....


And then we got sidetracked on stats and stuff.... As for the rest of it, not much really needs to be said. Wade shot poorly the other night, but was clutch down the stretch while the Mavs let it slip away into OT. Wade started the game out very poorly, shooting wise. But he kept driving and going to the line. That's what you want out of him. He does it very, very well.

As for the proof, the foul was called. Thats all that needs to be said. Wade put the refs in a position where the refs were forced to call a foul for the contact.

 

[Vintage]

Wade aint exactly lights out for the series either....

55/121

(assuming my math is correct)

45%

Which is probably about average for a guard.

 

[peplaw06]

Dirk:

Game 1: 4/14 28% (roughly)
Game 2: 8/16 50%
Game 3: 9/20 45%
Game 4: 2/14 14% (roughly)
Game 5: 8/19 42%

Series:
31/83 37%

Dude, do you have a point with this?? I ALREADY SAID DIRK HAS BEEN BAD!!

 

[peplaw06]

Because I can't win?

You are the one who is refuting me for saying the refs didn't lose the game and that the Mavs did....


And then we got sidetracked on stats and stuff....

You're right, I'm refuting this... And you haven't made a point here either... Do you even have one anymore?

 

[Vintage]

Dude, do you have a point with this?? I ALREADY SAID DIRK HAS BEEN BAD!!

Uh....yeah.

BECAUSE I WANTED TO SEE HIS STATS!!

And bec. I was using the reply button feature to keep track, I had it all done, so I just hit submit. I did it with Wade too.

I didn't realize I needed to ask for permission to post it.

I apologize.

 

[peplaw06]

As for the rest of it, not much really needs to be said. Wade shot poorly the other night, but was clutch down the stretch while the Mavs let it slip away into OT. Wade started the game out very poorly, shooting wise. But he kept driving and going to the line. That's what you want out of him. He does it very, very well.

As for the proof, the foul was called. Thats all that needs to be said. Wade put the refs in a position where the refs were forced to call a foul for the contact.

Who's forcing the refs to call fouls?? Wade?? Or is it the Mavs defense? Did you mean to say Wade's forcing the refs to call fouls?? cause that doesn't really help your point, it helps mine.

And the proof that there was a foul is because a foul was called?? Kinda circular don't ya think??

 

[Vintage]

You're right, I'm refuting this... And you haven't made a point here either... Do you even have one anymore?

Yep, here it is....

1) Dallas lost, not the refs
a. Dirk has been playing bad
b. Wade has been clutch down the stretch
c. Mavs had ample opportunities to win it, but didn't.
d. Howards mistakes

 

[Vintage]

Who's forcing the refs to call fouls?? Wade?? Or is it the Mavs defense? Did you mean to say Wade's forcing the refs to call fouls?? cause that doesn't really help your point, it helps mine.

And the proof that there was a foul is because a foul was called?? Kinda circular don't ya think??

Wade is forcing the refs to call the fouls by driving on Dallas, drawing contact, which gets called.

Its that simple.

Mavs, if they want to stop it, need to take charges, cut off his cutting lanes, play better defense.

 

[Vintage]

I have to go.

Golf....

 

[peplaw06]

Yep, here it is....

1) Dallas lost, not the refs

Yes the Mavs lost... congratulations. I would be worried if the refs were down in the series 3-2. I don't think they could come back

a. Dirk has been playing bad

Agreed, as I've said a hundred times

b. Wade has been clutch down the stretch

No argument here, but that has nothing to do (or "shouldn't") with whether he was fouled.

c. Mavs had ample opportunities to win it, but didn't.

Both teams had ample opportunities to win it. The heat ultimately won the series. But if they hadn't you could say the same thing. They had a chance. When a game is a one point game, both teams have chances to win. Where the rubber hits the road is when refs have a hand in those chances. They often do, but if I want to question their judgment I have that right.

d. Howards mistakes

Howard was 9-11 in Game 5, had a great game. He missed two free throws, but so did Wade (4 actually). But Wade go to shoot more of em. As for the timeout call, I'm not blaming Josh Howard for that one. Blame goes to one of two places. 1) Avery Johnson... probably where I put most of the blame. He was going nuts on the sidelines signalling for a timeout. What is Howard supposed to do? 2) The refs don't escape all blame here. Wilbon said on PTI Monday said he was talking with an NBA vet who said the refs interpret ALL the time. The will often go to the bench and clarify what the coach wants to do if there's any doubt.

Wade is forcing the refs to call the fouls by driving on Dallas, drawing contact, which gets called.

Its that simple.

Mavs, if they want to stop it, need to take charges, cut off his cutting lanes, play better defense.

This is like saying the Knicks, Cavs, and Pacers, etc. should have played better defense on Jordan. If I recall, the Mavs ran four guys at Wade on the last play. Go watch the tape. Terry gets thrown into the scorers table, there's a pic HH posted where Wade grabbed Howard in the groin, then Wade splits two guys after cutting back inside and "gets fouled." There's not much else you could do. Wade doesn't often get called for charges, and he definitely wasn't going to get a charge on that last play. If you think this foul call was bad, Dallas was on the road. If they had called a charge on Wade, anarchy would have ensued.

 

[Vintage]

Prepaw, before I head out for the golf...

I must confess, I haven't be entirely honest with you. Allow me to do so. Yes, I do believe there were questionable calls. However, yes, I do believe Dallas lost the game on its own accord.

Do I want Miami to win? No. I hate Miami. Always have. Always will. I despise everything about Miami, except for Wade.

Wade went to Marquette. I go to Marquette. That's the only thing I like about Miami.

Before the series started, I predicted Dallas in 6. I have money on it. Unfortunately, I wont win....bec. Dallas cannot win in 6.

I want to see Dallas win, because I respect Avery Johnson, love Dirk, love Howard, (though I hate Stackhouse), and want to see the Mavs win a ring.

And I haaaaaaaaaaaaaate Miami.

That being said, I do want Dallas to win tonite, and tomorrow.

I am not copping out to anything, contrary to what you believe. I merely said a bunch of stuff to get you all riled up....which you did. I was bored at work and wanted to be amused.

That being said, I think Miami will win tonite. I hope not....but I think they will.

You can choose to believe some of this, all of this, any of this, or none of this...doesn't matter. Just thought I'd tell you....

 

[BlueStar22]

As for the proof, the foul was called. Thats all that needs to be said. Wade put the refs in a position where the refs were forced to call a foul for the contact.

100% utter B.S. The referees that were literally in position to make the call, DIDN'T. The official that was 35-40 feet away from the play, DID. Yet, this same referee who was literally in position to call an offensive foul when Mr. Wade extended his arm and sent Jason Terry flying into the scorers table, DIDN'T make that call, yet, he chose to make a call with Mr. Wade, out of control and desperate to make a shot attempt. That's neither here nor there...hopefully, Mav players will be able to look in the direction of Mr. Wade tonite without fear of being called for a foul.

 

[peplaw06]

I am not copping out to anything, contrary to what you believe. I merely said a bunch of stuff to get you all riled up....which you did. I was bored at work and wanted to be amused.

Do we need any more evidence to prove that Vintage is a troll...

So if you don't get banned, I'll just make a mental note not to take you seriously ever again.... You're a clown.

Either that or you decided you were in a bad spot in this argument and had to cop out.

I'll let the board decide.

 

[WoodysGirl]

Tracking the officials:

Foul on Terry against Wade - bad call. He fell on his own. Not the kinda thing you see on first glance. More than likely what happened is the official took his eyes

Foul on Harris - Questionable call. Wade initiated, but Harris wasn't defensively set.

Good charge taken by Haslem - Feet set and outside the circle.

Foul on Stackhouse against Wade - good call. contact made on the shot.

---I'll try to update as the game flows ---

Sidebar: Lots of careless turnovers by the Heat. Cant stand that kinda thing.

Foul on Daniels against WAde - not sure what the official saw. But I'm thinking because he swiped at him and Wade's arm moved, he assumed Daniels altered it.

Foul on Stackhouse against Posey - Stackhouse bailed him out. Cuz he wasn't set. He should've let Posey make it.

Foul on Walker against Nowitzki - dumb foul.

Sidebar: Looks like they cleaned up their play. If this game continues this flow, it's gonna go to the wire again, for sure.

Missed the jason Terry moving screen foul

Foul on Wade - tried to blow up Harris. Dumb foul.

Foul on Haslem - used body on Nowitzki.

Sidebar: Biggest difference I see in the Mavs are that they're going to the hole.

Foul on Diop against Shaq - lots of contact down there.

Sidebar: Wonder if Howard will get fined for disrobing on the open court like that?

Foul on Howard against Walker - Walker initiated the contact, but it looked like Howard got him on the arm on the shot. No replay to verify.

Foul on Harris against Haslem - obvious foul.

Foul on Stackhouse against Walker - foot in the restricted area. I hate that rule. Cuz on any other level, that's a charge.

Foul on Harris against Wade - He got away w/the hold when he stole the ball. The swipe was kinda obvious and yet a make-up call, too.

Sidebar: Dallas needs to go back to taking it to the basket. They're settling for jumpers.

Foul on Shaq against Nowitzki - Obvious call. If you're beat, don't stick your knee out. Players get hurt that way.

Goaltend on Mourning? - Hmmm. couldn't tell.

Block by Mourning - He might've fouled him. Just depends on whether he got ball before his right arm swung out.

Payton offensive foul - dumb foul. Never bump your man in the open court like that.

Mourning foul against Daniels - obvious foul. body contact.

Wade foul against Nowtizki - dumb foul while trying to steal the ball.

Posey foul against Daniels - was in restricted area and late getting there.

Daniels foul against Wade - can't clear your man into the stands on the rebound. That shot was off from the start.

Mourning foul against Dampier - He was blocked out of position. Shouldn't have tried to go thru him.

Payton foul against dont remember - another dumb foul.

Shaq foul and against Diop - Mourning blocks that shot...maybe w/o the foul.

Sidebar - U know the saying "Where's Waldo?" "Where's Terry?" Can't remember him doing anything this game.

Sidebar again - Awesome-freaking-block by Mourning!!!!!

Walker foul against Howard - (loose ball) used his arm to clear him out.

----Game tied at 79-79 at this point ----

Stackouse foul against Mavs - got Wade on the rebound.

Could've been a T on Wade there, but something like that can be let go w/ either an ignore or an official warning. Obviously they let it go.

Howard foul against Wade - got caught out of position. obvious foul.

Sidebar - Nice move by Stack.

Nowitzki foul against Wade - obvious foul on the rebound. Could've been called on Harris, too. Dirk got him first, tho.

Sidebar - Can't believe Dirk hadn't scored in the 4th quarter and that it took a foul to get him on the line. He's the Mavs best player, but can't say he's been MVP.

Nowitzki foul against Wade - dumb blocking foul.

Nowitzki foul against Wade - contact by both players. Dirk got body on Wade as Wade was going past him...and got popped in the face for his trouble.

Dampier foul against Wade - foul after turnover. One of the necessary kind.

Wade foul against Howard on missed foul - dumb, dumb foul.

Harris foul against Wade - final sec foul.

Sidebar - gotta make those foul shots.

Missed the possible foul at the end of the game. Gonna have to wait for the replays.

--- Game Over ---

Final thoughts

Game called reasonably fair. I don't think Mav fans should blame the refs for this game. They should blame their big three. Where the heck were they?

 

[Vintage]

Wow.

I get home from golf. Turn the TV on, see Dallas with a 10 point lead.

And within 2 minutes, Miami turns it into a 1 point lead.