Darrell Green 2008 HOF?

[HailGreen28]

Apparently you can't read. Okay, let me help.

He didn't say Art Monk isn't a Hall of Famer. He said he was NOT the greatest WR in the NFL when he retired.

You replied that he owned all the important records. Whoop-dee-freaking-doo.

Paul Krause owns the all time Interception record but he isn't even close to the best Safety to ever play the game. Just the record holder. You see there was this Safety named Ronnie Lott who was the best ever. He doesn't own the INT record, but records do not make anyone the best.

Within 3 or 4 years of being in the NFL it was obvious to anyone with eyes in their head that Jerry Rice was the greatest WR in the History of the game.

No charge for the education. There will be a test later.

And people have different standards. I agree there's room for disagreement. But records do count. Is it "Whoop-dee-freaking-doo" what record Emmitt Smith broke? Is Barry Sanders being the best running back of his time reason that Emmitt Smith shouldn't be considered for HOF?

Setting aside that the Monk question is a derailment of this Green thread, I'm incredulous over the derailment of the Monk question. If the best contrary argument is "well, he wasn't the greatest OF ALL TIME", it's a nitpick, and speaks for itself.

 

[HailGreen28]

No, it was the truth. Art Monk wasn't the greatest WR in the History of the NFL when he retired. He was dead on right about that.

Going by the record book, he was. I understand you disagree, but so do I.

 

[Hostile]

And people have different standards. I agree there's room for disagreement. But records do count. Is it "Whoop-dee-freaking-doo" what record Emmitt Smith broke? Is Barry Sanders being the best running back of his time reason that Emmitt Smith shouldn't be considered for HOF?

Setting aside that the Monk question is a derailment of this Green thread, I'm incredulous over the derailment of the Monk question. If the best contrary argument is "well, he wasn't the greatest OF ALL TIME", it's a nitpick, and speaks for itself.

There are people who believe Barry Sanders, Walter Payton, Jim Brown, and even LaDanian Tomlinson are better than Emmitt despite the fact that Emmitt owns the 2 most important records for RBs.

I'm fine with that. I could have used him instead of Paul Krause, but there's actually no debate about Lott being the best Safety ever.

Monk was never the best WR in the NFL. I'm sorry if that hurts your feelings but don't come here and call people stupid for posting that fact.

 

[HailGreen28]

There are people who believe Barry Sanders, Walter Payton, Jim Brown, and even LaDanian Tomlinson are better than Emmitt despite the fact that Emmitt owns the 2 most important records for RBs.

I'm fine with that. I could have used him instead of Paul Krause, but there's actually no debate about Lott being the best Safety ever.

Monk was never the best WR in the NFL. I'm sorry if that hurts your feelings but don't come here and call people stupid for posting that fact.

Again, "despite" Emmitt owning the 2 most important records, other players were better. Same applies for Monk when he retired (all-time receptions leader, single-season receptions leader, and other records) I don't think there's much argument that Sanders and Rice were the best of their time. Not much argument that Monk and Smith belong in the HOF either.

With the insults thrown around by others on both sides in other threads, I didn't think what I said would be taken too hard by anybody.

 

[Hostile]

Actually that blog is a joke. Monk the best WR in the history of the game when he retired? Don't make me laugh.

Again, "despite" Emmitt owning the 2 most important records, other players were better. Same applies for Monk when he retired (all-time receptions leader, single-season receptions leader, and other records) I don't think there's much argument that Sanders and Rice were the best of their time. Not much argument that Monk and Smith belong in the HOF either.

With the insults thrown around by others on both sides in other threads, I didn't think what I said would be taken too hard by anybody.

There's plenty of debate about who is the best RB. Same as QB. Not much debate about WR, CB, OLB, and MLB in the minds of most football historians.

Note that one of those undebatable categories is WR. The position Monk played. He wasn't the best in anyone's mind. Anyone who thinks he was the best is a fool. Jerry Rice (note, not a Dallas Cowboy) was the best WR in the History of the game within 3 or 4 years of being in the NFL. Monk was still in the NFL when football people everywhere were calling Jerry the greatest.

Ask Art Monk if he was the greatest WR in the NFL. Ask him if he ever was the greatest WR in the NFL. I guarantee you he won't say yes and it isn't because he is a humble man, which I admit he is. It's because Rice was that freaking good.

Again, he said Monk was not the best when he retired. I posted his post which pissed you off so much above. You can see for yourself.

He wasn't insulting, you were. Unless that is your blog he called a joke. I doubt that. He didn't insult Art Monk. He did say he's not sure if he's a HOFer in a previous post, but at no time did he insult him.

 

[HailGreen28]

There's plenty of debate about who is the best RB. Same as QB. Not much debate about WR, CB, OLB, and MLB in the minds of most football historians.

Note that one of those undebatable categories is WR. The position Monk played. He wasn't the best in anyone's mind. Anyone who thinks he was the best is a fool. Jerry Rice (note, not a Dallas Cowboy) was the best WR in the History of the game within 3 or 4 years of being in the NFL. Monk was still in the NFL when football people everywhere were calling Jerry the greatest.

Ask Art Monk if he was the greatest WR in the NFL. Ask him if he ever was the greatest WR in the NFL. I guarantee you he won't say yes and it isn't because he is a humble man, which I admit he is. It's because Rice was that freaking good.

Again, he said Monk was not the best when he retired. I posted his post which pissed you off so much above. You can see for yourself.

He wasn't insulting, you were. Unless that is your blog he called a joke. I doubt that. He didn't insult Art Monk. He did say he's not sure if he's a HOFer in a previous post, but at no time did he insult him.

The records say otherwise, as to whether he was the best at his position when he retired.
Wow, you saw through my monitor that I was pissed instead of this while posting. Are you sure you're talking to the right guy?

Going by the standards of this board, "Anyone who thinks he was the best is a fool." and "Apparently you can't read.", who's throwing around insults?

 

[Hostile]

The records say otherwise, as to whether he was the best at his position when he retired.
Wow, you saw through my monitor that I was pissed instead of this while posting. Are you sure you're talking to the right guy?

Going by the standards of this board, "Anyone who thinks he was the best is a fool." and "Apparently you can't read.", who's throwing around insults?

You were. I made a commentary about no one, because no one has maintained I am wrong about Jerry Rice.

 

[HailGreen28]

You were. I made a commentary about no one, because no one has maintained I am wrong about Jerry Rice.

And I've been saying, at the time that he retired, going by the record book.

 

[Hostile]

And I've been saying, at the time that he retired, going by the record book.

Then define yourself, because no one in the world who knows jack about football will ever agree with that. By the time Monk retired Jerry Rice was already the best WR in the History of the game. He just needed more time to set all the records.

 

[HailGreen28]

Then define yourself, because no one in the world who knows jack about football will ever agree with that. By the time Monk retired Jerry Rice was already the best WR in the History of the game. He just needed more time to set all the records.

You disagree that Art Monk, at the time he retired as the all-time receptions leader, single-season receptions leader, and all-time leader in most consecutive games with a reception, the top receiver of a team that won 3 Superbowls (Gary Clark was faster, but who got the ball the most?) wasn't the greatest receiver in the history of the game at that time?

Wow.

 

[burmafrd]

hail, stop being a homer if possible. Art Monk was a very good WR. A game changer sometimes, but not often. If Drew Bledsoe had played long enough he would have had most of the all time records (at least before Manning breaks them). Does that make him the greatest QB of all time. Your so called arguement is pathetic at best.

 

[jman]

hail, stop being a homer if possible. Art Monk was a very good WR. A game changer sometimes, but not often. If Drew Bledsoe had played long enough he would have had most of the all time records (at least before Manning breaks them). Does that make him the greatest QB of all time. Your so called arguement is pathetic at best.

Largent, Steve 14 Years 1976 - 1989 Rec: 819 Yds: 13089 Avg: 16.0 TD: 100

Monk, Art 16 Years 1980 - 1995 Rec: 940 Yds: 12721 Avg: 13.5 TD: 68

Irvin, Michael 12 Years 1988 - 1999 Rec: 750 Yds: 11904 Avg: 15.9 TD: 65

Lofton, James 16 Years 1978 - 1993 Rec: 764 Yds: 14004 Avg: 18.3 TD: 75

Stallworth, John 14 Years 1974 - 1987 Rec: 537 Yds: 8723 Avg: 16.2 TD: 63

Swann, Lynn 9 Years 1974 - 1982 Rec: 336 Yds: 5462 Avg: 16.3 TD: 51

Joiner, Charlie 18 Years 1969 - 1986 Rec: 750 Yds: 12146 Avg: 16.2 TD: 65

Biletnikoff, Fred 14 Years 1965 - 1978 Rec: 589 Yds: 8974 Avg: 15.2 TD: 76

Pearson, Drew 11 Years 1973 - 1983 Rec: 489 Yds: 7822 Avg: 16.0 TD: 48

You make the call. All but two are HOF'ers.

 

[Hostile]

You disagree that Art Monk, at the time he retired as the all-time receptions leader, single-season receptions leader, and all-time leader in most consecutive games with a reception, the top receiver of a team that won 3 Superbowls (Gary Clark was faster, but who got the ball the most?) wasn't the greatest receiver in the history of the game at that time?

Wow.

Yes, I disagree vehemently. Art Monk's career concluded in 1995.

Monk finished 1995 with 940 career receptions, 12,721 career yards, and career 68 TDs. His career began in 1980.

When 1995 was over Jerry Rice had 942 career receptions, 15,123 career yards, and 146 career TDs. His career began in 1985, a full 5 years AFTER Art Monk.

Therefore, when he retired Art Monk didn't actually own any receiving records as you and that blog have maintained.

So, I will tell you one more time so that there is no question. When Art Monk retired he was NOT the best WR in NFL History and is not even close to the guy who is the greatest WR in NFL History, despite a 5 year head start.

The name is Jerry Rice. He's not only the greatest WR of all time, he's probably the greatest football player of all time. Art Monk pales in comparison. That's no shame because everyone else does too.

Oh yeah, and at the time Monk retired his best season was 106 receptions. In 1995, the year Monk retired Jerry Rice caught 122 passes. Yet another "record" destroyed.

Also, Jerry Rice had 4 rings to Monk's 3.

 

[HailGreen28]

hail, stop being a homer if possible. Art Monk was a very good WR. A game changer sometimes, but not often. If Drew Bledsoe had played long enough he would have had most of the all time records (at least before Manning breaks them). Does that make him the greatest QB of all time. Your so called arguement is pathetic at best.

Drew Bledsoe? Who's being the homer now? I think he has one record of note (most pass attempts (70) and completions (45) in a game in 1994), and he's finished seventh all-time in yards passing. How does he compare to Monk, who was number one in all the records I listed earlier when he retired? Is a "homer" anyone who thinks Walter Payton and Emmitt Smith are great players?

Art Monk was always the go-to receiver for the Skins while he played there. He excelled in his own way, set all-time records, and kept his honor and nose clean while doing so.

Bledsoe was a good QB through his career, but any argument comparing him to any of the other players I mentioned is pathetic.

 

[Hostile]

Drew Bledsoe? Who's being the homer now? I think he has one record of note (most pass attempts (70) and completions (45) in a game in 1994), and he's finished seventh all-time in yards passing. How does he compare to Monk, who was number one in all the records I listed earlier when he retired? Is a "homer" anyone who thinks Walter Payton and Emmitt Smith are great players?

Art Monk was always the go-to receiver for the Skins while he played there. He excelled in his own way, set all-time records, and kept his honor and nose clean while doing so.

Bledsoe was a good QB through his career, but any argument comparing him to any of the other players I mentioned is pathetic.

He's mocking the idea of Bledsoe as an all time great, not endorsing it. Therefore it's still you being the homer.

 

[HailGreen28]

He's mocking the idea of Bledsoe as an all time great, not endorsing it. Therefore it's still you being the homer.

Wrong. Throwing Bledsoe into the mix has been the most homer-ific thing said yet.

 

[HailGreen28]

Yes, I disagree vehemently. Art Monk's career concluded in 1995.

Monk finished 1995 with 940 career receptions, 12,721 career yards, and career 68 TDs. His career began in 1980.

When 1995 was over Jerry Rice had 942 career receptions, 15,123 career yards, and 146 career TDs. His career began in 1985, a full 5 years AFTER Art Monk.

Therefore, when he retired Art Monk didn't actually own any receiving records as you and that blog have maintained.

So, I will tell you one more time so that there is no question. When Art Monk retired he was NOT the best WR in NFL History and is not even close to the guy who is the greatest WR in NFL History, despite a 5 year head start.

The name is Jerry Rice. He's not only the greatest WR of all time, he's probably the greatest football player of all time. Art Monk pales in comparison. That's no shame because everyone else does too.

Oh yeah, and at the time Monk retired his best season was 106 receptions. In 1995, the year Monk retired Jerry Rice caught 122 passes. Yet another "record" destroyed.

Also, Jerry Rice had 4 rings to Monk's 3.

Good points. I appreciate you taking the time to gather all that info. I stand corrected about where Rice and Monk stood at the end of Monk's career. IF only Rice could've waited a year? But by your logic then, no other receiver belongs in the HOF?

If you're arguing that Monk doesn't deserve to be in the HOF, I really don't know what could convince you, because the facts speak for themselves.

If you're arguing with me the single point that Monk was the best receiver ever when he retired, (You objected to being called out for nit-picking) I'd say no now, but only compared to Jerry Rice.

 

[Hostile]

hail, stop being a homer if possible. Art Monk was a very good WR. A game changer sometimes, but not often. If Drew Bledsoe had played long enough he would have had most of the all time records (at least before Manning breaks them). Does that make him the greatest QB of all time. Your so called arguement is pathetic at best.

Wrong. Throwing Bledsoe into the mix has been the most homer-ific thing said yet.

Yeah, sure he did. He used Bledsoe as a simile of Monk as the greatest. Look at his summation above in red.

Yeah, he really believes Bledsoe as the record holder would be the greatest.

No one can be that dense. He was MOCKING with the mention of Bledsoe.

 

[Hostile]

Good points. I appreciate you taking the time to gather all that info. I stand corrected about where Rice and Monk stood at the end of Monk's career. IF only Rice could've waited a year? But by your logic then, no other receiver belongs in the HOF?

If you're arguing that Monk doesn't deserve to be in the HOF, I really don't know what could convince you, because the facts speak for themselves.

If you're arguing with me the single point that Monk was the best receiver ever when he retired, (You objected to being called out for nit-picking) I'd say no now, but only compared to Jerry Rice.

You really don't read and comprehend do you? I discounted the idea of Monk as ever being the "greatest" WR. Nothing more.

I've said Monk deserves to be in several times.

One more thing, If Rice had been 2 years later and his recpetions and yards stats behind Monk he STILL would have been the greatest WR ever.

No football Coach in NFL History would ever bypass Jerry Rice to take another WR and that was true by his 3rd year in the league. The guy was a marvel from the word go.

 

[peplaw06]

Good points. I appreciate you taking the time to gather all that info. I stand corrected about where Rice and Monk stood at the end of Monk's career. IF only Rice could've waited a year? But by your logic then, no other receiver belongs in the HOF?

If you're arguing that Monk doesn't deserve to be in the HOF, I really don't know what could convince you, because the facts speak for themselves.

If you're arguing with me the single point that Monk was the best receiver ever when he retired, (You objected to being called out for nit-picking) I'd say no now, but only compared to Jerry Rice.

You really need to stop posting in this thread. It's painful reading this. I almost feel sorry for you.:spanking: