Dez already asked to take a pay cut?

[GORICO]

If this conversation had taken place already, we would know in several ways. When it does happen, I expect Dez to not take it well. It will be like a fart inside a space suit-you will smell it.

We will see how mature Dez is.

canters-- i was a sonarman in US Navy..very very small spaces with many sailors....i could rip the stinkiest silencers...and the whole crew gagged
and pointed fingers at everyone but me for some reason?......how i held in the laughter i still cannot understand?

 

[Jake]

Dez had 109 more targets than Butler.

Dez had 54 more catches than Butler.

Dez had 3 more TDs than Butler.

Dez had 1 more reception over 20 yards than Butler.

Dez made $13 million more than Butler.

Yep, Dez is irreplaceable.

 

[KJJ]

Only one more TD than old man Witten despite 46 more targets than anyone else on the team. If that was an attempt to demonstrate Dez's current value, it wasn't the best effort.

Wasn’t making an attempt to demonstrate his current value just pointing out a stat. He’s in decline and has been very disappointing the past three seasons but he was still our leading receiver this year in catches, yards and TDs. Don’t read too much into that, he’s not a #1 receiver and needs to be replaced. He’s never been the same receiver since the overturned catch in Green Bay, his contract extension and the foot and ankle surgery in 2015.

 

[jterrell]

This, according to DeMarcus Ware.

"They're going to go - they already went to Dez and said we're not going to pay you 12.5, can you do something for us to help out the team? If you say no, I'm not going to take a pay cut - guess what, you're not going to be with the Dallas Cowboys.”

There were some on this board that doubted whether this conversation would happen. It apparently already has.

Personally, I’d rather cut him then have him at a reduced salary. Dez’s better years are behind him.

He’s not capable of carrying the #1 WR mantle at this point in his career. He’s top 5 in the league in drops, which are drive killers, and he handles the ball carelessly. They’re covering him 1 on 1 now, he doesn’t have the speed to scare anyone and is unreliable as a red zone threat.

Wide receiver will be a major priority this off season.

This was obvious.
Dez in 2017 was actually improved merely by staying on the field.
The team needs him to extend for less money.
The obvious compromise is smaller bases going forward then restructure to reduce the cap hits now.
He gets his 12.5 in 2018 but has to take smaller bases in 2019/2020 to get it.

I'd hand Dez his current valuation (probably something like 7-8m per year) and say we can turn your deal into that with a slight overpay but we cant pay you on the current deal.

 

[jterrell]

Dez had 109 more targets than Butler.

Dez had 54 more catches than Butler.

Dez had 3 more TDs than Butler.

Dez had 1 more reception over 20 yards than Butler.

Dez made $13 million more than Butler.

Yep, Dez is irreplaceable.

This is terrible logic.
Dez got those targets because there werent better options, including Brice Butler who wasn't even playing when it mattered most though he was likely healthier than Dez was all year.

Dez is very replaceable if we go find a #1 WR. But there isn't one in house.. possibly including Dez but certainly after him.

 

[okstateCowboy]

Stephen was just on 105.3 and pretty much said (indirectly) that Dez will be cut it he doesn’t take a pay cut. Will post the sound clip if I can find it

 

[BigD_95]

Coaching staff needs to move Dez around. He should be playing in the slot once in awhile. Also trying having him run across the middle of the field more - short catches.

Once he has the ball he is a beast to bring down.

 

[fairviewfarmer]

Re-Sign Butler. Draft a WR. Cut Dez.

 

[Typhus]

It kinda forces you to draft for need rather than just take the best player so it’s a concern. Just got to hope they listen to the scouts or address it in FA

I believe in this scouting dept, they have done very well recently, but we have all witnessed in the past, drafting what.. 3 DEs early after Haleys departure... without checking, please feel free to respond with valid numbers,, it was like Pittman, etc. etc,,, I forget now.

All I'm saying is that unless there is some really special player that is very high on our board, a player that we covet, I don't want to waste bullets just because we have them.

This draft will be proven over the next few months, even on this board, no slam, but there are draft nicks that reside here as well, you know what I'm saying.

These comp picks this year will prove to be very worthy additions or draft leverage, I just firmly believe that this 2018 draft holds some very special gems in round 3-6.

I like those picks staying put,
Might even try moving back and acquiring more,
RBs are deeper than ever. "hands, speed, 3rd down".

LBs
DL
etc...

In McClay we trust.

 

[xwalker]

Even on a real down year Dez still has more TDs than any receiver on the team. You would actually be fine with Noah Brown replacing Dez? All Brown has shown he can do that Dez can do is drop balls and not get open. He’s looked like a complete JAG so far.

Maybe Butler over Brown.

Escobar had 4 TDs one season. Dez has 6 this season. It's not a good measurement considering Dez gets so many targets.

What would Butler do with 120+ targets?

 

[KJJ]

Maybe Butler over Brown.

Escobar had 4 TDs one season. Dez has 6 this season. It's not a good measurement considering Dez gets so many targets.

What would Butler do with 120+ targets?

I would go with Butler over Brown but that certainly doesn’t make him a candidate to replace Dez. Get real! Butler has shown flashes but isn’t consistent. He’s made some nice catches down the field but disappears for stretches and has had his share of drops. The 2 catches he had on Sunday were the first he’s had since week 12 vs the Chargers when he had one catch. He hasn’t caught more than two passes in a single game all season. There’s not a team in the league that would look at him as a #1 or #2 WR. As for Escabar he had 4 TDs on a 12-4 team with Romo having a career year in 2014. He only caught 9 passes that season.

Dez caught 69 passes with 6 TDs this past season despite playing with a young QB he has no chemistry with, who was pressured all season due to poor OL play. Not trying to defend Dez, just making a point. We don’t have a #1 WR on this team. I find it hard to believe that anyone would want to go with Brown or Butler at that position. That would be going from not very good to real bad.

 

[xwalker]

I would go with Butler over Brown but that certainly doesn’t make him a candidate to replace Dez. Get real! Butler has shown flashes but isn’t consistent. He’s made some nice catches down the field but disappears for stretches and has had his share of drops. The 2 catches he had on Sunday were the first he’s had since week 12 vs the Chargers when he had one catch. He hasn’t caught more than two passes in a single game all season. There’s not a team in the league that would look at him as a #1 or #2 WR. As for Escabar he had 4 TDs on a 12-4 team with Romo having a career year in 2014. He only caught 9 passes that season.

Dez caught 69 passes with 6 TDs this past season despite playing with a young QB he has no chemistry with, who was pressured all season due to poor OL play. Not trying to defend Dez, just making a point. We don’t have a #1 WR on this team. I find it hard to believe that anyone would want to go with Brown or Butler at that position. That would be going from not very good to real bad.

The Dez numbers come from a very high number of targets. Most teams quit targeting a WR with a very low catch rate at some point, but the Cowboys do the opposite.

 

[KJJ]

The Dez numbers come from a very high number of targets. Most teams quit targeting a WR with a very low catch rate at some point, but the Cowboys do the opposite.

They don’t quit targeting him because he’s our best big play threat at receiver. It’s pretty obvious why he gets targeted a lot. He puts more TDs on the board and has made more big plays down the field than any receiver we have. Again, not trying to defend him just making a point.

 

[KJJ]

Escobar had 4 TDs one season.

One other point I want to make about Escobar’s 4 TDs in 2014. Another reason for those TDs was Dez having a career year and scoring a franchise record 16 receiving TDs. Everyone trying to defend Dez in the redzone opened up opportunities for Escabar. Dez was such a threat in the redzone it left Escobar alone on at least a couple of those scores.

 

[xwalker]

They don’t quit targeting him because he’s our best big play threat at receiver. It’s pretty obvious why he gets targeted a lot. He puts more TDs on the board and has made more big plays down the field than any receiver we have. Again, not trying to defend him just making a point.

There is no way to know what would happen if they gave his targets to someone else.

Based on catch rates, the 69 catches Dez had would be 90 catches if Williams had the same number of targets.

It is obvious that they force Dak to make him the primary target a majority of the time. Dak throws the ball away when Dez is covered and many fans think Dak was just inaccurate. In reality he just throws it high or low when Dez is covered to avoid an INT.

The "scheme" could have been much different just by changing the primary read on many plays but they don't give Dak the option to make that change based on pre-snap aligmment of the defense.

 

[KJJ]

There is no way to know what would happen if they gave his targets to someone else.

Based on catch rates, the 69 catches Dez had would be 90 catches if Williams had the same number of targets.

It is obvious that they force Dak to make him the primary target a majority of the time. Dak throws the ball away when Dez is covered and many fans think Dak was just inaccurate. In reality he just throws it high or low when Dez is covered to avoid an INT.

The "scheme" could have been much different just by changing the primary read on many plays but they don't give Dak the option to make that change based on pre-snap aligmment of the defense.

Williams can’t make contested catches he’s a body catcher. He can’t go up, battle and snatch the ball like Dez. I’ve explained why Dez gets so many targets. Granted they force him the ball a lot because he wins battles and the potential for a big play is always there with him.

 

[xwalker]

One other point I want to make about Escobar’s 4 TDs in 2014. Another reason for those TDs was Dez having a career year and scoring a franchise record 16 receiving TDs. Everyone trying to defend Dez in the redzone opened up opportunities for Escabar. Dez was such a threat in the redzone it left Escobar alone on at least a couple of those scores.

The point with Escobar is that TD stats don't mean that much without context.

Back in the day people laughed about how often Irvin made a big play but got stopped just short of the goalline and Emmitt would get the TD on a simple 1-yard run.

They've continued to throw the fade to Dez in the endzone regardless of how often it fails. Most NFL WRs or TEs will score a TD occasionally on that play if given enough chances.

 

[KJJ]

The point with Escobar is that TD stats don't mean that much without context.

Back in the day people laughed about how often Irvin made a big play but got stopped just short of the goalline and Emmitt would get the TD on a simple 1-yard run.

They've continued to throw the fade to Dez in the endzone regardless of how often it fails. Most NFL WRs or TEs will score a TD occasionally on that play if given enough chances.

In the NFL, TD stats do mean a lot they put points on the board. What made Dez great was making contested catches and scoring TDs. They continue to throw fades in the endzone to him because he’s still capable of winning battles and our receivers have trouble getting open. Like I said he’s the only receiver we have that can win battles. You have to take advantage of his size and strength. The problem has been he and Dak can’t seem to connect on fades.

The problem appears to be more with Dak who can’t seem to place the ball where Dez can make a play on it. Romo mentioned this during a Cowboys telecast that Dez likes the ball placed on his outside shoulder. Romo was real good at placing the ball where Dez likes it. If no one is getting open you have to give Dez the opportunity to go up and make a play on a contested ball. Dak doesn’t appear comfortable throwing 50-50 balls or making tight window throws.

 

[gimmesix]

The problem appears to be more with Dak who can’t seem to place the ball where Dez can make a play on it. Romo mentioned this during a Cowboys telecast that Dez likes the ball placed on his outside shoulder. Romo was real good at placing the ball where Dez likes it. If no one is getting open you have to give Dez the opportunity to go up and make a play on a contested ball. Dak doesn’t appear comfortable throwing 50-50 balls or making tight window throws.

It isn't even just that he likes the ball placed on the outside shoulder. That's where his routes set it up for the ball to be placed. When it's thrown to the inside, he has to try to fight through contact to get over to the ball. Frankly, to the outside and toward the sideline is where the ball has to be placed on the deep route Dez runs most often. If we can't place the ball there, then we need to change up his routes and have him slant back toward the middle of the field. The problem with that is usually a safety is going to be roaming in that area just waiting for a chance to make an interception.

Teams game-planned us based off Dez and Dak not being able to connect, essentially giving us one-on-one coverage on the deep sideline route, and we didn't make them pay for it. It's impossible to know how many of those one-on-ones Dez would have won if the ball placement had been correct.

What bothers me more than Dak not being comfortable throwing it there is the coaches not adjusting for it. Instead of just having Dez go deep when he got the one-on-one, we needed to have him drive the corner deep and run some comebacks. At least we started using him more on digs over the middle, but we still put him on to many flies that Dak was either not going to throw or not complete.

 

[KJJ]

It isn't even just that he likes the ball placed on the outside shoulder. That's where his routes set it up for the ball to be placed. When it's thrown to the inside, he has to try to fight through contact to get over to the ball. Frankly, to the outside and toward the sideline is where the ball has to be placed on the deep route Dez runs most often.

It’s not just to the outside shoulder he wants the ball placed, he wants to be able to go up after it, so the ball has to have air under it and not come in at a flat angle. Romo described exactly how he wants the ball placed during a telecast this season. The ball came in a little too flat allowing the defender to get a hand on it. You have to be able to take advantage of Dez’s leaping ability.