Does Romo go in the RoH?

[USMarineVet]

It will be Jerry's call and so far he's only added players who've helped the Cowboys win championships. There's a love/hate relationship amongst Cowboy fans with Romo. Most were ready to move on from him after the 2012 season not wanting to resign him. If the Cowboys never win a SB with him he'll receive most of the blame for it. It's going to be hard for Jerry to add a player to the ROH that so many Cowboy fans are torn on. Everyone knows he's real good but there's been a stigma with him that only a SB win will remove. There's times everyone loves Romo and there's been times everyone hates the post game threads every week are proof of it. Fans live in the moment with Romo and after last season everyone loves him. I just can't see how Jerry can justify putting him in the ROH if his playoff record remains sub 500 and he never even leads the team to a SB. It's a tough sell not having even reached a title game with him but it will be in the hands of Jerry. Even Meredith and Danny White led the Cowboys to a title games.

Mmm.. Like I said. That's your opinion and you're entitled to it. It's ok to agree to disagree.

But I could have the best RB of all time behind me and hand the ball off to him for 2000 yards a season and win 5 Super Bowls in my 10 year career due to the fact I have a superior talent running the ball. That doesn't put me in the HOF nor should it put me in the ROH. Not saying you're saying this, but it's not totally off the mark.

Romo has broken many QB records held by those whose names now glorify the ROH as we speak and he will continue to add to the list and distance himself even further on those he has already broken as his career continues to progress. Romo is 1 of 53 men on the team and there have been years when this team's name wouldn't have amounted to MUD if it wasn't for his efforts.

His personal contributions and leadership to this team have been exemplary both on and off the field. IMO it would be a travesty to see his reputation and resume as one of the greats to have ever played the game downplayed by the fact that he has not yet won a Super Bowl. As you know many factors equate into winning the big one. Team balance being one of them. Now that this team is finally becoming balanced, Romo will be praised more because there are more team wins, even though statistically he has remained the same. And that's the shame of it all. A player's greatness can be easily overlooked when his team's name isn't heralded in lights.

 

[dstovall5]

Mmm.. Like I said. That's your opinion and you're entitled to it. It's ok to agree to disagree.

But I could have the best RB of all time behind me and hand the ball off to him for 2000 yards a season and win 5 Super Bowls in my 10 year career due to the fact I have a superior talent running the ball. That doesn't put me in the HOF nor should it put me in the ROH. Not saying you're saying this, but it's not totally off the mark.

Romo has broken many QB records held by those whose names now glorify the ROH as we speak and he will continue to add to the list and distance himself even further on those he has already broken as his career continues to progress. Romo is 1 of 53 men on the team and there have been years when this team's name wouldn't have amounted to MUD if it wasn't for his efforts.

His personal contributions and leadership to this team have been exemplary both on and off the field. IMO it would be a travesty to see his reputation and resume as one of the greats to have ever played the game downplayed by the fact that he has not yet won a Super Bowl. As you know many factors equate into winning the big one. Team balance being one of them. Now that this team is finally becoming balanced, Romo will be praised more because there are more team wins, even though statistically he has remained the same. And that's the shame of it all. A player's greatness can be easily overlooked when his team's name isn't heralded in lights.

Well said.

 

[KJJ]

Romo has broken many QB records held by those whose names now glorify the ROH as we speak and he will continue to add to the list and distance himself even further on those he has already broken as his career continues to progress.

He should be breaking their records as much as the game has changed since they all played. Romo has played in an offense that's leaned heavily on the pass for most of his career. QB's are ultimately judged by how they perform in the playoffs and by SB's unless they're Dan Fouts or Dan Marino.

 

[KJJ]

IMO it would be a travesty to see his reputation and resume as one of the greats to have ever played the game downplayed by the fact that he has not yet won a Super Bowl.

Romo will never go down as one of the greats to ever play the game most don't consider him one of the elite QB's of this era. He's been a very good QB but several of his peers out produce him every year and have accomplished much more than he has. Now that the Cowboys are going to continue leaning on the run his passing numbers will be well down the all-time list by the time he retires.

 

[jnday]

Just my thoughts, but there are several players that should be in the ROH before Romo. These guys helped win Super Bowls or kept the Cowboys in the playoffs for years. Romo hasn't done that yet. He might not do it at all. I hope he does, but that is just hope right now.

 

[USMarineVet]

He should be breaking their records as much as the game has changed since they all played. Romo has played in an offense that's leaned heavily on the pass for most of his career. QB's are ultimately judged by how they perform in the playoffs and by SB's unless they're Dan Fouts or Dan Marino.

Maybe so. But compared to his competition at the position (In this passing era) he has still outperformed most of his competition. And just because the Cowboys haven't been well-rounded enough to be a perennial playoff team; we shouldn't discredit Tony for not being able to perform in games he and his team have never reached.

We can only hold him accountable for the games he HAS played in, in which he has overachieved. Let's not throw out the baby with the bath water.

 

[KJJ]

IMO you can't possibly induct Witten without Romo. If Witten had played with the QB carousel in Cleveland his whole career he certainly would not be the shoe in HOFer he is. And he's won as many championships as Romo, so why doesn't that apply to TEs? Especially a TE who has been considered one of the primary team leaders around here for over a decade?

If the team hasn't won because of Romo's mysterious lack of 'leadership', certainly Witten shares some of the blame for that as well, right?

I can see the thought process behind that and that's a good point. Jerry Rice is considered the greatest player of all-time but in my opinion he wasn't even the greatest player on his team Joe Montana was. Witten produced with Romo so if Jerry adds Witten he may have to include Romo. The same doesn't apply to QB's and TE's because QB's impact games in a way that a TE could never impact a game. Every receiver is at the mercy of their QB. I never said anything about Romo's leadership in this thread and every player on the team shares the blame for losses but QB's always take the brunt of it.

 

[jnday]

Romo will never go down as one of the greats to ever play the game most don't consider him one of the elite QB's of this era. He's been a very good QB but several of his peers out produce him every year and have accomplished much more than he has. Now that the Cowboys are going to continue leaning on the run his passing numbers will be well down the all-time list by the time he retires.

It took a great running game to allow Elway to win Super Bowls. He really choked bad against the Rexskins during the Super Bowl and he didn't have a running game to help him out. Romo's career may follow Elway's career. If it means a couple more rings, I am fine with that. Stats should be low on the list of things that put a player in the ROH. I see posts supporting the stats argument though.

 

[USMarineVet]

Romo will never go down as one of the greats to ever play the game most don't consider him one of the elite QB's of this era. He's been a very good QB but several of his peers out produce him every year and have accomplished much more than he has. Now that the Cowboys are going to continue leaning on the run his passing numbers will be well down the all-time list by the time he retires.

I was waiting for you to pinpoint this.

IMO he is. We both know the writers of today love to pick on Tony Romo, QB of the dreaded Dallas Cowboys. The team everyone loves or loves to hate. Bungle a snap in the playoffs and that's it for you buddy. Dead meat from here on out.

But the truth is he holds the #2 spot amongst the all-time leaders in Passer Rating. He's surpassed former Cowboy QB greats in throwing yards and TDs. Ok I'm a little biased with the Cowboys and shouldn't have used the words All-Time greats. Maybe not all-time, but certainly amongst this team.

And isn't that what the Ring of Honor is all about?

 

[KJJ]

Maybe so. But compared to his competition at the position (In this passing era) he has still outperformed most of his competition. And just because the Cowboys haven't been well-rounded enough to be a perennial playoff team; we shouldn't discredit Tony for not being able to perform in games he and his team have never reached.

We can only hold him accountable for the games he HAS played in, in which he has overachieved. Let's not throw out the baby with the bath water.

He's outperformed most of his competition but several of his peers still rank ahead of him in numbers, playoff wins and SB wins. Romo gets overshadowed by Brady, Peyton Manning, Rodgers while some of the young guns are stealing some of the spotlight like Luck and Wilson. Heading into last season not many had Romo ranked in the top 10 QB's. His performance in 2014 will improve his ranking but there's always going to be a stigma with him that he can't win the big one until he does. I'm not discrediting Romo on games he never reached but he's partly to blame for not reaching them ( not last year) but in previous seasons due to turnover issues. When most people think of Romo it's the fumbled snap in Seattle in 06 and all the other ill-timed mistakes he's made. Only a championship will make everyone forget all that.

 

[KJJ]

It took a great running game to allow Elway to win Super Bowls. He really choked bad against the Rexskins during the Super Bowl and he didn't have a running game to help him out. Romo's career may follow Elway's career. If it means a couple more rings, I am fine with that. Stats should be low on the list of things that put a player in the ROH. I see posts supporting the stats argument though.

Too much was put on Elway and he caved in the SB's. Those Bronco teams were a one man show with Elway and if he was stopped so was Denver. Last season we saw what a great running game can do for Romo now we have to hope we can still run the ball as efficiently in 2015 and the defense has improved. Even a great running game isn't going to get you far if your defense can't make stops.

 

[percyhoward]

The big difference between Staubach/Aikman and White/Romo is that White/Romo were more mistake prone.

This is true, but it's also misleading. After all, mistakes are only one aspect of a player's performance. I looked at each QB"s 7 best seasons and found their average league rank in interception percentage, touchdown percentage, completion percentage, and yards per pass attempt. Then I adjusted the rankings for league size.

INT%
Staubach 6th
Aikman 7th
Romo 14th
White 19th

TD%
Romo 5th
Staubach 7th
White 10th
Aikman 17th

Comp%
Aikman 4th
Romo 6th
Staubach 7th
White 8th

YPA
Staubach 4th
Romo 4th
Aikman 6th
White 10th

When you put these four factors together, you get passer rating.

Staubach 3rd
Aikman 6th
Romo 6th
White 12th

 

[USMarineVet]

He's outperformed most of his competition but several of his peers still rank ahead of him in numbers, playoff wins and SB wins. Romo gets overshadowed by Brady, Peyton Manning, Rodgers while some of the young guns are stealing some of the spotlight like Luck and Wilson. Heading into last season not many had Romo ranked in the top 10 QB's. His performance in 2014 will improve his ranking but there's always going to be a stigma with him that he can't win the big one until he does. I'm not discrediting Romo on games he never reached but he's partly to blame for not reaching them ( not last year) but in previous seasons due to turnover issues. When most people think of Romo it's the fumbled snap in Seattle in 06 and all the other ill-timed mistakes he's made. Only a championship will make everyone forget all that.

Right. I haven't forgotten about the fumbled snap, but I don't think about it anymore either. People continue to judge him on a play that isn't even QB related. Now he needs a Super Bowl to exonerate himself and finally have credibility?

It's nonsense.

I truly believe Tony will get his Super Bowl. But even if he doesn't, it shouldn't take away from his legacy with this team over the past decade. Truly deserving of the ROH.

 

[KJJ]

I was waiting for you to pinpoint this.

IMO he is. We both know the writers of today love to pick on Tony Romo, QB of the dreaded Dallas Cowboys. The team everyone loves or loves to hate. Bungle a snap in the playoffs and that's it for you buddy. Dead meat from here on out.

But the truth is he holds the #2 spot amongst the all-time leaders in Passer Rating. He's surpassed former Cowboy QB greats in throwing yards and TDs. Ok I'm a little biased with the Cowboys and shouldn't have used the words All-Time greats. Maybe not all-time, but certainly amongst this team.

And isn't that what the Ring of Honor is all about?

That's your opinion because you admitted you're biasd but in the opinion of most who aren't biased he's not an all-time great. He would have to rank in the top 10 in all-time numbers to be an "all-time great" or have multiple SB wins. I don't put a lot of weight in passer ratings it's a stat most never even knew existed in the 70's and 80's. Romo can surpass all the great former Cowboy QB's numbers but he'll never be looked at in the same light as Roger Staubach and Troy Aikman until he wins a SB. What the ROH is about has changed over the years due to the change in ownership and the number of great players and championships the team has won. The ROH under Jerry has been about adding players that helped the Cowboys win SB's. Haley would have never gotten in had Jerry not seen him as a major contributor to the Cowboys 3 SB wins of the 90's.

 

[USMarineVet]

That's your opinion because you admitted you're biasd but in the opinion of most who aren't biased he's not an all-time great. He would have to rank in the top 10 in all-time numbers to be an "all-time great" or have multiple SB wins. I don't put a lot of weight in passer ratings it's a stat most never even knew existed in the 70's and 80's. Romo can surpass all the great former Cowboy QB's numbers but he'll never be looked at in the same light as Roger Staubach and Troy Aikman until he wins a SB. What the ROH is about has changed over the years due to the change in ownership and the number of great players and championships the team has won. The ROH under Jerry has been about adding players that helped the Cowboys win SB's. Haley would have never gotten in had Jerry not seen him as a major contributor to the Cowboys 3 SB wins of the 90's.

Yup. You've mentioned everything you've just said a couple times already. I've got it.

I responded to this thread because the OP asked for opinions. I've given mine. You've given yours. We disagree.

Just don't let me catch you in support of the "Tony Romo Inducted into ROH" thread or I'm gonna call you out! (kidding)

 

[USMarineVet]

Next time I'm at VR I'm gonna drop a note in the suggestion box.

Let's change the name of the Ring of Honor to The Ring of Honor *For those who have played in a Super Bowl for us"

 

[KJJ]

This is true, but it's also misleading. After all, mistakes are only one aspect of a player's performance. I looked at each QB"s 7 best seasons and found their average league rank in interception percentage, touchdown percentage, completion percentage, and yards per pass attempt. Then I adjusted the rankings for league size.

INT%
Staubach 6th
Aikman 7th
Romo 14th
White 19th

TD%
Romo 5th
Staubach 7th
White 10th
Aikman 17th

Comp%
Aikman 4th
Romo 6th
Staubach 7th
White 8th

YPA
Staubach 4th
Romo 4th
Aikman 6th
White 10th

When you put these four factors together, you get passer rating.

Staubach 3rd
Aikman 6th
Romo 6th
White 12th

I'm not just talking mistakes I'm talking "ill-timed mistakes" in big games and both White and Romo had their share and they were memorable mistakes. White was a very good QB but his career is best remembered for the fumble in the final 30 seconds of the 81 title game. If Romo's career ended today it will best be remembered for his bobbled snap vs Seattle in the playoffs. Jackie Smith was a HOF TE but is best remembered for dropping what would have been a TD pass in the SB. A poll was started wanting everyone to name the most hated players in Cowboys history and sure enough Jackie Smith's name came up more than anyone. Hard to escape disastrous plays like that when you don't have a SB win on your resume. Russell Wilson screwed up big time in the SB but he has a ring so although it may be a play that haunts him he won't be remembered by it.

 

[percyhoward]

I'm not just talking mistakes I'm talking "ill-timed mistakes" in big games and both White and Romo had their share and they were memorable mistakes.

Right. You're talking about one aspect of the players' performance (whether it be mistakes, or more specifically "mistakes at certain times"), while I'm talking about the whole performance.

 

[Jstopper]

That's your opinion because you admitted you're biasd but in the opinion of most who aren't biased he's not an all-time great. He would have to rank in the top 10 in all-time numbers to be an "all-time great" or have multiple SB wins. I don't put a lot of weight in passer ratings it's a stat most never even knew existed in the 70's and 80's. Romo can surpass all the great former Cowboy QB's numbers but he'll never be looked at in the same light as Roger Staubach and Troy Aikman until he wins a SB. What the ROH is about has changed over the years due to the change in ownership and the number of great players and championships the team has won. The ROH under Jerry has been about adding players that helped the Cowboys win SB's. Haley would have never gotten in had Jerry not seen him as a major contributor to the Cowboys 3 SB wins of the 90's.

Dude that's a loaded statement. You're saying nobody has been inductee lately without a superbowl. Well we haven't won one in 20 years, so in that time who on our team has been good enough of a player to deserve to be in the roh? That's a catch 22. We have had more bad years than good years in that time frame and yet Romo has been a top qb every year he's been a starter, and there is no way in hell he is left out of the ROH whether he wins a ring or not.

 

[KJJ]

Yup. You've mentioned everything you've just said a couple times already. I've got it.

I responded to this thread because the OP asked for opinions. I've given mine. You've given yours. We disagree.

Just don't let me catch you in support of the "Tony Romo Inducted into ROH" thread or I'm gonna call you out! (kidding)

Just wanted to make sure you got it now let's move on.