Drew Pearson; what is the deal?

[KJJ]

Charlie Waters, Too Tall Jones

Waters wasn't close to a ROH or HOF player.

 

[KJJ]

I still don't understand how Haley got into the ROH before Too Tall.

Haley helped Jerry and the Cowboys win 3 SB's that's how.

 

[Plankton]

Charlie Waters, Too Tall Jones

Neither belong in the Hall of Fame. Too Tall made three Pro Bowls and was All Pro once in his career. He was a very good player, but not a great one. Waters also made three Pro Bowls, and for six seasons, he was a terrific strong safety. He struggled mightily as a cornerback, and played next to a better player who hasn't received HOF honors. Keep in mind that there are only seven players who only played safety in the Hall of Fame, and none have been selected in the last 29 years. It's a grossly under-represented position in the HOF.

 

[jobberone]

that's right, I forgot he got into the ROH......but yes, he and Cliff Harris should be in the HOF, along with Chuck Howley, Cornel Green, Harvey Martin, and either Ralph Neely or John Niland.

I agree Pearson, Howley, Green, and Martin should be in. I can't argue one way or the other re: Niland and Neely. Martin, Green and Howley should be no brainers. Pearson should also go although I feel less strongly than the others.

I could argue Martin was on a rough par with White whom he played next to. Green was as good as Adderley maybe better. Howley might be in the top 5-10 outside LBers to ever play IMO. Landry considered playing him at RB but needed him more at LB. If he hadn't hurt his knee before coming to the Boys we wouldn't be having this conversation. Even then he played in the 4.55-4.6 range.

 

[KJJ]

How does a guy who was one selected to the all-70s decade team not make it to the Hall of Fame?

So many memorable plays, too.

The Steelers dominance during the 70's including their 2 SB wins over the Cowboys would be the only explanation. It doesn't appear the HOF committee likes adding several players from the same era who played the same position to the HOF and championships along with head to head battles seem to be the deciding factor. Although Pearson had many memorable plays he didn't play great in any of his 3 SB appearances. In 3 SB appearances he only had 7 catches for 145 yards and one TD. In the Cowboys SB win over Denver Pearson only had one catch for 13 yards. He was outshined by Butch Johnson who made one of the most memorable catches in SB history. Lynn Swann had probably the weakest regular season stats of any WR in the HOF but he won 4 SB's with the Steelers and put up more receiving yards vs the Cowboys in SB X than Drew Pearson produced in his 3 SB appearances. Swann torched the Cowboys with 10 catches for 285 yards and 2 TD's in the Steelers 2 SB wins over Dallas.

Swann produced 16 catches for 364 yards and 3 TD's in the Steelers 4 SB wins including a SB MVP performance and that was his ticket to the HOF. Although John Stallworth's SB stats weren't as impressive as Swann's he produced more catches, yards and TD's during the regular season than Drew Pearson. The Steelers 4 SB wins including their 2 SB wins over the Cowboys were the difference.Take the Packers Dave Robinson for example he and Chuck Howley who many feel should be in the HOF played the same position and had comparable stats but Robinson was given the HOF nod due to winning all those championships with the Packers including 2 title game wins over Howley and the Cowboys. When those outside Cowboys Nation look back at Pearson's career some only see the Hail Mary and forget some of the other clutch plays he made.

 

[KJJ]

Why Jackie Smith? Why? I still can picture that drop and it still hurts as much as it did in my youth.

Smith had already had a HOF career when that drop happened. He had retired after 15 years and Landry talked him out of retirement to play the 79 season because Jay Saldi broke his arm and the Cowboys needed a replacement. He didn't catch a single pass during the regular season that year but was used as a blocker in a 2 TE formation. He made 3 catches including a TD vs Atlanta in the playoffs and that got the Cowboys looking to him as a receiver which led to one of the biggest SB gaffs ever.

 

[big dog cowboy]

I think it's more about the greatness of those Steeler teams of that time period and not so much Pearson and others have been overlooked.

You mean those great Stealer teams of the 70's that did not win as many games as the Cowboys did that decade? I know they got the rings but give me a break.

 

[Keifer]

Haley helped Jerry and the Cowboys win 3 SB's that's how.

Yeah I get that and I'm not trying to take anything away from Haley, I think he absolutely deserves to be in the hall. I just think the ROH should be for Cowboy lifers with the exception of players riding out their twilight years with another team when they aren't ready to hang em up.

 

[KJJ]

Yeah I get that and I'm not trying to take anything away from Haley, I think he absolutely deserves to be in the hall. I just think the ROH should be for Cowboy lifers with the exception of players riding out their twilight years with another team when they aren't ready to hang em up.

I agree 100% the ROH should be for true Dallas Cowboys who's careers were built playing for the Cowboys. Haley spent most of his career in SF he started his career there and ended his career there. By choosing Eddie DeBartolo over Jerry Jones to present him at the HOF shows where Haley's heart is at. You have wonder if Jerry regrets adding Haley to the ROH now that's he's been snubbed as Haley's presenter.

 

[Alexander]

Waters wasn't close to a ROH or HOF player.

Agreed. He was a good player, but not great.

 

[Alexander]

I agree 100% the ROH should be for true Dallas Cowboys who's careers were built playing for the Cowboys. Haley spent most of his career in SF he started his career there and ended his career there. By choosing Eddie DeBartolo over Jerry Jones to present him at the HOF shows where Haley's heart is at. You have wonder if Jerry regrets adding Haley to the ROH now that's he's been snubbed as Haley's presenter.

I doubt it. I do not believe he has the reverence for the history of the team before he took over. Haley is part of his history, even if it was for only four years. He has the shortest history with the team of any ring of honor inductee.

 

[KJJ]

I doubt it. I do not believe he has the reverence for the history of the team before he took over. Haley is part of his history, even if it was for only four years. He has the shortest history with the team of any ring of honor inductee.

The criteria for the ROH changed once Jerry bought the team. The old regime would have never added a player who was once a foe that contributed to another franchises championship success. Jerry decided to add all the key players that contributed to the Cowboys 3 SB wins including Haley despite the fact Haley helped beat up 2 of Jerry's teams in 89 and 90. Adding Haley to the ROH was a decision I'm sure a lot of older Cowboys fans who followed the team through the years didn't agree with I certainly didn't agree with it. Haley didn't grow with the Cowboys he jumped on board an already great Cowboy team and reaped the benefits from it. I don't like the idea of having a player in our ROH who's also in the 49ers ROH. Don't care what anyone Jerry adding Charles Haley to the Cowboys ROH was a bad decision.

 

[Plankton]

The criteria for the ROH changed once Jerry bought the team. The old regime would have never added a player who was once a foe that contributed to another franchises championship success. Jerry decided to add all the key players that contributed to the Cowboys 3 SB wins including Haley despite the fact Haley helped beat up 2 of Jerry's teams in 89 and 90. Adding Haley to the ROH was a decision I'm sure a lot of older Cowboys fans who followed the team through the years didn't agree with I certainly didn't agree with it. Haley didn't grow with the Cowboys he jumped on board an already great Cowboy team and reaped the benefits from it. I don't like the idea of having a player in our ROH who's also in the 49ers ROH. Don't care what anyone Jerry adding Charles Haley to the Cowboys ROH was a bad decision.

Haley did more than just jump on a great team - he put them over the top. The Cowboys in 1991 couldn't rush the passer at all, yet in 1992, were able to rotate Jim Jeffcoat in off the bench at DE to the tune of 10.5 sacks. Haley's presence had a lot to do with the improvement rushing the passer, and the team ultimately finishing #1 in the league in defense that season.

That being said, Haley shouldn't be in the Ring Of Honor.

 

[landroverking]

Waters wasn't close to a ROH or HOF player.

Wrong and Wrong

 

[Plankton]

Wrong and Wrong

Why do you think he is? He never made All Pro, was never the best secondary player on the team when he played, and made the Pro Bowl three times in a 12 season career. I loved Charlie Waters as much as the next guy, and thought he won the 1978 NFC Championship Game for the Cowboys with his two interceptions, but it's a stretch to say he's a Ring Of Honor guy, and there's no way he's a Hall of Famer.

 

[DandyDon52]

The HOF can only add like 4 players a year?
That means a lot of great players are going to be left out, they cant all get in.

If they add someone that means busts and display and room at HOF.
If it was a virtual hall then they could add more at hardly any cost.

As it is they have limitations so many greats will be left out.

 

[KJJ]

Haley did more than just jump on a great team - he put them over the top. The Cowboys in 1991 couldn't rush the passer at all, yet in 1992, were able to rotate Jim Jeffcoat in off the bench at DE to the tune of 10.5 sacks. Haley's presence had a lot to do with the improvement rushing the passer, and the team ultimately finishing #1 in the league in defense that season.

That being said, Haley shouldn't be in the Ring Of Honor.

Haley jumped on board an already great Cowboys team that went 11-5 the year before with a playoff win and helped put them over the top in 92. Haley going from SF to Dallas created a shift in power which is why I'm so concerned about Murray going from Dallas to Philly. No question Haley was one of the main contributors to those great Cowboys 90's teams but he didn't grow with the team and his tenure in Dallas wasn't long enough to warrant a ROH induction. I'm a traditionalist when it comes to the ROH and prior to Haley only Chuck Howley started his career with another team. Howley started with the Bears but hardly saw the field in 58 and 59 before coming to Dallas. He established himself as a great player with the Cowboys. Every player in the ROH except for Haley will always be remembered as Dallas Cowboys.

 

[KJJ]

Why do you think he is? He never made All Pro, was never the best secondary player on the team when he played, and made the Pro Bowl three times in a 12 season career. I loved Charlie Waters as much as the next guy, and thought he won the 1978 NFC Championship Game for the Cowboys with his two interceptions, but it's a stretch to say he's a Ring Of Honor guy, and there's no way he's a Hall of Famer.

Charlie Waters had a lot of heart but wasn't blessed with speed or great talent. He got toasted a lot playing corner due to his lack of speed. I'll never forget the roasting he took at the hands of Harold Jackson in 1973 vs the Rams. Jackson had over 200 yards and 4 TD's in the first half of that game. Waters was a good player but probably the weakest link on those great Doomsday defenses.

 

[Plankton]

How does that compare for other decades?

The earlier statement about Pearson/Harris is not true. They are the only position players on the 1970's All Decade First team to not be in. There are others on the Second Team that didn't get selected for the HOF as well.

Here's the non Hall of Famers for all of the All Decade Teams (keep in mind that the All Decade Teams for the 1920s through the 1960's were selected in 1969 in honor of the NFL's 50th season) COWBOYS AFFILIATION IN BOLD:

1920's All Decade Team - E Lavern Dilweg, G Hunk Anderson (also coached the Bears and Notre Dame)

1930's All Decade Team - QB Cecil Isbell, HB Beattie Feathers (1st player in league history to rush for 1000 yards), E Gaynell Tinsley, T Frank Cope, T George Christensen, T Bill Lee, G Ox Emerson, G Buckets Goldenberg, G Russ Letlow, G George Svendsen

1940's All Decade Team - HB Byron "Whizzer" White, FB Pat Harder, FB Bill Osmanski, E Jim Benton, E Jack Ferrante, E Ken Kavanaugh, E Mac Speedie, E Ed Sprinkle, T Al Blozis, T Bucko Kilroy (a great player who made huge contributions as a scout, was a Cowboys scout), T Buford Ray, T Vic Wears, T Al Wistert, G Bruno Banducci, G Bill Edwards, G Buster Ramsey, G Len Younce, C Charley Brock

1950's All Decade Team - FB Alan Ameche, E Bobby Watson, G Dick Barwegan, G Dick Stanfel, LB Joe Fortunato

1960's All Decade Team - HB John David Crow, SE Del Shofner, FL Gary Collins, FL Boyd Dowler, OT Ralph Neely, OG Howard Mudd (all time great OL coach as well), OG Jerry Kramer, DT Alex Karras, LB Larry Morris, LB Tommy Nobis, CB Bobby Boyd, S Eddie Meador, PK Jim Bakken, P Don Chandler

1970's All Decade Team:

First Team: WR Drew Pearson, S Cliff Harris, PK Garo Yepremian, KR Rick Upchurch
Second Team: QB Ken Stabler, WR Harold Carmichael, DE L.C. Greenwood, S Dick Anderson, PK Jim Bakken, P Jerrel Wilson, KR Billy 'White Shoes" Johnson

​

1980's All Decade Team:

First Team: OT Jimbo Covert, S Kenny Easley, PK Morten Andersen, P Sean Landeta, KR Mike Nelms, PR Billy "White Shoes" Johnson
Second Team: FB Roger Craig, OT Joe Jacoby, OG Bill Fralic, DT Keith Millard, DT Dave Butz, LB Carl Banks, LB John Anderson, CB Frank Minnifield, CB Lester Hayes, S Deron Cherry, S Joey Browner, S Nolan Cromwell, PK Gary Anderson, PK Eddie Murray, P Reggie Roby, KR Rick Upchurch, PR John Taylor

​

1990's All Decade Team:

First Team: OT Tony Boselli, LB Kevin Greene, S Steve Atwater, S LeRoy Butler, PK Morten Andersen, P Darren Bennett, KR Michael Bates
Second Team: QB Brett Favre, RB Terrell Davis, TE Ben Coates, OT Richmond Webb, OG Steve Wisniewski, C Mark Stepnoski, DE Neil Smith. DT Bryant Young, LB Hardy Nickerson, LB Cornelius Bennett, LB Levon Kirkland, S Carnell Lake, PK Gary Anderson, P Sean Landeta, PR/KR Mel Gray

​

The team for the 2000's has far too many eligible, active and non-HOF players to list.

 

[Plankton]

The HOF can only add like 4 players a year?
That means a lot of great players are going to be left out, they cant all get in.

If they add someone that means busts and display and room at HOF.
If it was a virtual hall then they could add more at hardly any cost.

As it is they have limitations so many greats will be left out.

Five players who haven't exhausted regular eligibility, and two that are either Seniors Candidates (players whose eligibility expired, but are being reconsidered) or contributors (front office types, television personalities, etc).

Both Rayfield Wright and Bob Hayes made it as Seniors Candidates, though Hayes is the only Seniors Candidate in history who did not get voted in (first time he was considered). It's usually a rubber stamp.