ESPN: Who is the best defensive player in NFL history?

[ABQCOWBOY]

Decon Jones was the best defensive player I've ever seen. IMO, he was the best. I'd take Reggie White over LT but LT was certainly great. There were a good 2 seasons that you never saw Reggie in his prime. When with the Showboats, he had 23.5 sacks, 192 tackles and 7 forced fumbles that are not included in his career totals.

LT was blessed with the fact that he played in a 34 which was pretty new to everybody in those days. He was a great player but I think the scheme helped him a great deal.

What can you say about Decon. If records were being kept when he played, there would really be no discussion of who is the greatest. Decon Jones would be a hands down winner IMO. He was that great.

 

[YosemiteSam]

You mentioned Ed reed and not Darren Woodson or Cliff Harris?
The Niner you are thinking of is Tim McDonald probably.

I'm a huge Darren Woodson fan. I Think he was a tremendous safety, but not the best ever. I would take Cliff Harris over Woodson. (don't hit me Woody'sGirl!)

Nope, wasn't Tim McDonald. This guy played in the 60s/70s I believe. He used to lower his shoulder and knock people flat (flat knock them out sometimes!)

 

[THUMPER]

Ronnie Lott spent a lot of time playing CB, but he is one of the all-time great safeties. Of course, you can't forget the likes of Larry Wilson. Ed Reed is pretty damn good. Rodney Harrison had something like 81 INTs over his career I beleive.

Who was that safety that used to play for the 49ers that used to knock people out with his shoulder. I can't remember his name for the life of me...

That would be Hardy Brown who played for the Niners in the 50s. He used his shoulder as a weapon to knock out opposing players. he was a small guy but could somehow "throw" his shoulder at just the right moment into the face of a player and knock him cold or at least wipe him out.

The guy actually lost his mind later in life and died in an asylum if I recall.

I was about to respond to the other post with Larry Wilson as well. He was the first to blitz from the safety position. He is also tied with Mel Renfro with 52 INTs for his career.

Edit: A little more on Hardy Brown...

His father was shot to death in front of him when he was 4 years old. Then one of his father's murderers was killed in front of him a few months later by a family member. He was abandoned by his mother when he was 5 at a Masonic home for orphans. He drank himself into an institution and died there.

His (in)famous shoulder broke an untold number of noses, jaws, cheekbones, and eye-sockets over the years. Depending on who you ask it was dozens or even hundreds over the course of his career. On more than one occasion George Halas had his shoulder pads ripped apart and inspected to look for metal pieces as no one could figure out how a guy who weighed 190 lbs could hit with such force. Other teams sent "hitmen" after him during games to try and take him out. Sometimes they were successful but Hardy always got his man eventually.

 

[burmafrd]

I have always wondered why someone did not comb through old game accounts, film, etc and be able to figure out stats for sacks for players from the 60s untill the sack was an official sack. Would be interesting to see the numbers.

 

[THUMPER]

I have always wondered why someone did not comb through old game accounts, film, etc and be able to figure out stats for sacks for players from the 60s untill the sack was an official sack. Would be interesting to see the numbers.

They did for Deacon Jones (as much as was possible) and came up with 173.5 but even that is in dispute as he claims anywhere from 175 to 200. You can read a little about it here: http://archive.profootballweekly.com/content/archives/features_1999/turney_062600.asp


The problem is that for many games back then they used only a few cameras and didn't catch a lot of the action. It is not like today where the networks, NFL Films, and the teams themselves have dozens of cameras to catch every angle of the action. Back then on some plays it is impossible to tell who got to the QB.

I would love to know how many sacks Bob Lilly actually had (as well as the other Cowboys DLs like Andrie and Pugh).

 

[THUMPER]

Hooray!! Someone who knows what he is talking about. Lt doesn't hold a candle to Butkus. No one does.

Yeah, we're not all under 21 here. :fogeys:

 

[Chocolate Lab]

I would love to know how many sacks Bob Lilly actually had (as well as the other Cowboys DLs like Andrie and Pugh).

Didn't Harvey Martin have well over 20 at least once? That was just a few years before they made the sack an official stat, IIRC.

 

[Jarv]

Decon Jones was the best defensive player I've ever seen. IMO, he was the best. I'd take Reggie White over LT but LT was certainly great. There were a good 2 seasons that you never saw Reggie in his prime. When with the Showboats, he had 23.5 sacks, 192 tackles and 7 forced fumbles that are not included in his career totals.

LT was blessed with the fact that he played in a 34 which was pretty new to everybody in those days. He was a great player but I think the scheme helped him a great deal.

What can you say about Decon. If records were being kept when he played, there would really be no discussion of who is the greatest. Decon Jones would be a hands down winner IMO. He was that great.

And Deacon did it (most sacks) in 12 and 14 game seasons. The guy was a monster, you should have seen him. He gets my vote.

 

[Mansta54]

LT does it for me... Reggie White in a close 2nd place.. I didn't get to see D. Jones play but I have much respect for him...

 

[PullMyFinger]

LT hands down.

 

[Hostile]

This will ruffle some feathers. Deion Sanders deserves some votes.

 

[ZeroClub]

I remember a particular "The Tom Landry Show" (his weeky pre-game regular season coach show) that was taped and aired during Taylor's rookie season.
Landry spent some time showing film on Taylor and marveling at his abilities. Landry couldn't keep from smiling when talking of Taylor's ability.

---

Jerry Rice may have had "the best ever career."

In my book, that doesn't make him "the greatest ever player."

IMO, Rice is the most fortunate great player in NFL history.

Clearly he was a great player, with a great work ethic, who had the incredibly good fortunate of catching passes from TWO Hall of Fame QBs while playing in a pass intensive offense.

Although Rice did experience serious injury along the way, he also had the great fortunate of remaining healthy enough to enjoy an unsually long career.

 

[ZeroClub]

This will ruffle some feathers. Deion Sanders deserves some votes.

He does, no doubt.