FA Pass Rusher

[RoyTheHammer]

Ratliff is our best pressure player from the DL. Why move him to a position further from the QB? The idea is to get him getting quick pressure up the middle so the QB cannot step up in the pocket when Ware collapses it.

..and yet QB's were doing that at ease against us all season long. Strange, isn't it?

 

[InmanRoshi]

The thing is you have people here who have a very elementary understanding of the 3-4 and think that nosetackle plays 60 snaps a game in the 0 tech, and that all 4-3 defensive linemen play every snap a game at the 3 tech. To they trying to hammer a junior high understanding of the game peg into the a very nuanced and complicated NFL stystems. They don't grasp the fact that New England played as much 4 man line as 3 man line, nor that Rob Ryan has his interior DL playing as much 3 tech as many 4-3 defenses.

 

[InmanRoshi]

..and yet QB's were doing that at ease against us all season long. Strange, isn't it?

Yeah, it's almost like we played guys like Kenyon Coleman and Marcus Spears and had a starting OLB who averages 4 sacks a season.

 

[rangers71]

The thing is you have people here who have a very elementary understanding of the 3-4 and think that nosetackle plays 60 snaps a game in the 0 tech, and that all 4-3 defensive linemen play every snap a game at the 3 tech. To them it's a very black and white world and they just don't grasp the concept that Ryan has his interior DL playing as much 3 tech as many 4-3 defenses.

But most people on here don't know what a 0 or 3 tech is.

 

[RoyTheHammer]

The thing is you have people here who have a very elementary understanding of the 3-4 and think that nosetackle plays 60 snaps a game in the 0 tech, and that all 4-3 defensive linemen play every snap a game at the 3 tech. To them it's a very black and white world and they just don't grasp the concept that Ryan has his interior DL playing as much 3 tech as many 4-3 defenses.

..and yet Rat had 2 sacks all year and we got no interior pressure. You can bring in the technical jargon all you'd like but when it comes down to it, what we were doing wasn't working. Bottom line.

We had no interior pressure and Rat had 2 sacks all year, one of which was a clean up sack. He was ineffective the entire year at generating pressure, everyone saw we got no push up the middle at all, and yet some here are defending what we did still. Unreal.

 

[Vintage]

..and yet QB's were doing that at ease against us all season long. Strange, isn't it?

Easier to do when our ILBs don't get much pressure, the other OLB added little ... and no pressure came from the DE position.

The answer is to get more athletic pass rushers.

 

[RoyTheHammer]

Yeah, it's almost like we played guys like Kenyon Coleman and Marcus Spears and had a starting OLB who averages 4 sacks a season.

Its almost like one of our starting DE's got more pressure than Rat and the other had only one less sack and our OLB has averaged 6 sacks over the past 3 seasons.

Oh wait..

 

[RoyTheHammer]

Easier to do when our ILBs don't get much pressure, the other OLB added little ... and no pressure came from the DE position.

The answer is to get more athletic pass rushers.

Hatcher had more sacks than Rat. Try again.

 

[Future]

No, the funniest part is the part where you want to take our quickest interior pass rusher who's best asset is an exceptional first step, and move him further away from the quarterback. have him play a 5 tech, and give him a worse angle to the QB and completely neutralize his first step.

We play so much nickel, he'd still be rushing from the DT position most of the time.

But to think that our base defense wouldn't benefit from having a space-eater in there at the nose and moving him to end wouldn't be beneficial is....wrong imo.

 

[RoyTheHammer]

Easier to do when our ILBs don't get much pressure, the other OLB added little ... and no pressure came from the DE position.

The answer is to get more athletic pass rushers.

Its our interior DL. You have to get more athletic than Coleman, but the guy still has to be around 300 lbs to play the DE spot in the 34.

If you're suggesting we go 43, that's a different story.. but if you look at all the successful 34 defenses around the league.. you'll see they all have pretty much the same build.

300 lb DE's and 320-350 lb NT's.

Its not a coincidence..


BTW.. know how we could get more athletic at DE?

 

[Vintage]

Its almost like one of our starting DE's got more pressure than Rat and the other had only one less sack and our OLB has averaged 6 sacks over the past 3 seasons.

Oh wait..

Ratliff has 3 year totals of 6, 3.5, and 2. 11 sacks over 3 years. 3.83 per year.
Spencer has 3 year totals of 6, 5, and 6. 17 sacks over 3 years. 5.67 per year.

Spencer doesn't even average 2 more sacks per season over that 3 year period of time (which you chose) than our starting NT.

I guess I expect more from our starting OLB spot.

 

[Dodger]

Honestly, I don't care where Ratliff plays. I just want the Cowboys to find more pass rushers on the defensive line and let the chips fall where they may. Production is my focus from here on out. Play these guys all over the line, and whoever ends up playing best at NT is who you play there. If we find someone better than Rat, and Rat isn't a good fit at DE, well guess what...you say goodbye to Rat.

 

[InmanRoshi]

But to think that our base defense wouldn't benefit from having a space-eater in there at the nose and moving him to end wouldn't be beneficial is....wrong imo.

It would accomplish absolutely nothing other than making an already slow unit even more slow. Ratliff is very athletic for a nosetackle. He's not athletic for defensive end. Moving him to defensive end is a wash at best in adding athleticism to the DE position. Then you get less athletic at nosetackle when he's replaced by the hypothetical big immobile fat tub of goo. You've now downgraded the athleticism of two positions along the DL and made it more immobile, when every other team in the NFL is getting more ahtletic and smaller along their defensive front.

If you have a SS who hits 35 homers a season, you enjoy the fact that you have the rare shortstop who has the ability provide power at his position. You don't move him to 1B and replace him with a SS who hits 5 HRs a season. You go out and get a good first basemen to pair with your great shortstop.

 

[InmanRoshi]

our OLB has averaged 6 sacks over the past 3 seasons.

Oh wait..

Wow, six sacks a season? This guy is a regular Eb Ekuban rushing from the outside.

 

[Vintage]

BTW.. know how we could get more athletic at DE?

Draft. FA. I'm not going to throw out names... mainly, because I'm not going to pretend like I've done a great deal of scouting or have the knowledge of it to do it even if I chose to...

But I think our scouting department does... and could assemble that, if they choose to do so.

 

[RoyTheHammer]

Ratliff has 3 year totals of 6, 3.5, and 2. 11 sacks over 3 years. 3.83 per year.
Spencer has 3 year totals of 6, 5, and 6. 17 sacks over 3 years. 5.67 per year.

Spencer doesn't even average 2 more sacks per season over that 3 year period of time (which you chose) than our starting NT.

I guess I expect more from our starting OLB spot.

How many SOLB's have produced overall more consistently than Spencer in the last 3 years?

65 tackles, 6 sacks, 3 FF's and 6 stuffs ..i'd say that's pretty darn productive.


Again, if we had any kind of an interior pass rush, Spencer's sack totals would go up to the 8-10 a year range, easily.

Also, the year you included where Rat had 6 sacks, he was being used differently, not the traditional NT role that we use him in now. Wade had him picking a gap and slashing, instead of trying to take on the double team and push the pocket. He's simply not good in that role, and we've seen it the last two years man.

 

[Future]

It would accomplish absolutely nothing other than making an already slow unit even more slow. Ratliff is very athletic for a nosetackle. He's not athletic for defensive end. Moving him to defensive end is a wash in adding athleticism to DE. Then you get less athletic at nosetackle when he's replaced by the hypothetical big immobile fat tub of goo. You've now downgraded the athleticism of two positions along the DL and made it more immobile, when every other team in the NFL is getting more ahtletic and smaller along their defensive front.

He's far more athletic than Spears, Hatcher or Coleman.

We're talking about only in the 3-4 that this change would happen, not when we have 4 down lineman, and his quickness is all but useless when he's just getting pounded on by double teams.

a base set with something like

Ware - Campbell - Fatty McFatpants - Ratliff - Spencer

Then the nickel is

Ware - Campbell - Rat - Spencer

I mean I doubt we'll get Campbell, but that type of formation makes a lot of sense to me.

 

[RoyTheHammer]

Draft. FA. I'm not going to throw out names... mainly, because I'm not going to pretend like I've done a great deal of scouting or have the knowledge of it to do it even if I chose to...

But I think our scouting department does... and could assemble that, if they choose to do so.

How about a 300 lb beast of a man who not only has great strength, but also is very quick and athletic for his size who knows how to rush the passer when not being double teamed by two guys who outweigh him by 80 lbs every single play?

 

[Vintage]

It would accomplish absolutely nothing other than making an already slow unit even more slow. Ratliff is very athletic for a nosetackle. He's not athletic for defensive end. Moving him to defensive end is a wash in adding athleticism to DE. Then you get less athletic at nosetackle when he's replaced by the hypothetical big immobile fat tub of goo. You've now downgraded the athleticism of two positions along the DL and made it more immobile, when every other team in the NFL is getting more ahtletic and smaller along their defensive front.

Exactly. With teams gearing up to pass more... you combat that with quicker pass rushers across the board. Not gobs of goo.

 

[Vintage]

How about a 300 lb beast of a man who not only has great strength, but also is very quick and athletic for his size who knows how to rush the passer when not being double teamed by two guys who outweigh him by 80 lbs every single play?

Sign me up for several!

But those are rare to find. Its why Mario Williams went #1 overall. Its why Tyson Jackson was drafted 3rd overall. Hard to find.