Felix vs Julius: I'm still not clear

[Bob Sacamano]

great point twodeep

Felix is great at spotting creases and getting through them

Julius needs a 4-lane highway

 

[DallasEast]

Your answer, CoCo.

Last year against the Jets. First and goal from the three.

Ball snapped and Romo takes the ball back to Jones 7-yards deep.

The line parted between Gurode and Davis, with Gurode and everyone left blocking left. Davis and everyone right blocking right. The hole was from tackle to tackle.

The full back took on the only linebacker in the hole and dropped him to his knees to the left side of the hole.

There was nobody between Jones and the touchdown.

Julius ran forward and somehow ended up behind the fullback running into him. Now keep in mind the fullback and the linebacker, who is now on his knees, did not move laterally.

Jones extracated himself the the grip of the back of the fullback's jersey and proceeded to follow Davis through the truck-sized hole that no one occupied.

However, as he dashed by the linebacker who was genuflecting in front of the fullback, the linebacker reached out and arm tackled Jones for no gain.

The very next play Barber got the ball and there was not a lineman that could move the Jets off the line of scrimmage. Barber turned sideways and shoved his way between the Kosier and Flo for a TD.

Now there is no way we can ever prove that Felix would have not been attracted by some magnetic power that took hold of Julius, somewhat like the moon is attracted by the earth.

But after seeing Felix's first touchdown while shoving his way through the line, one can only suspect he will not be merely a satelite for the nearest offensive lineman, dashing out hopes while he crashes into same like an astroid from space.

Great, great post.

 

[Cowboy_4_Life]

:laugh2::laugh1:
Someone hit him in the head.:spanking:

:sarcasm:

 

[jterrell]

I'm as hopeful as the next guy regarding Felix' Cowboy future. I want to believe he'll be tremendously productive for years to come.

Of course we all remember Julius entree as a rookie too and the board was giddy over the guy just like with Felix now.

So what is it about Felix that makes us think his performances will continue whereas Julius just faded away. Do you consider him faster than Julius? Better moves? More decisive?

I'm particularly interested in what people think Julius would have done with Felix opportunities in 2008. To me, Felix does not look faster than Julius. We've debated Felix combine 4.47 but it seems Julius could easily match that IMO. Felix big plays, to me, have been because of speed primarily. Moves? Not really. Broken tackles? I don't think so. Great decisions? The holes seemed obvious.

What's the difference that will make Felix productivity lasting?

ROFL.

This one is easy.
Julius Jones was productive on all of about 3 running plays. He never showed great vision. That was what held him back here and it will hold him back in Seattle as well because you don't develop vision.

I don't know that Felix would be a great every down back.

I do know that he is a great piece for an offense and special teams to have.

Teams have to game plan him in both.

Julius Jones never averaged more than 4.2 yards per carry as a Dallas Cowboy.

Felix is averaging 9.0 yards per carry....

 

[ANTHONYSCOTT]

you're kidding right? A blind squirrel can see the difference between the two.

I LOVE THIS!!!

 

[DaBoys4Life]

ROFL.

This one is easy.
Julius Jones was productive on all of about 3 running plays. He never showed great vision. That was what held him back here and it will hold him back in Seattle as well because you don't develop vision.

I don't know that Felix would be a great every down back.

I do know that he is a great piece for an offense and special teams to have.

Teams have to game plan him in both.

Julius Jones never averaged more than 4.2 yards per carry as a Dallas Cowboy.

Felix is averaging 9.0 yards per carry....

I disagree with the lack of vision on Julius Jones part.

 

[ANTHONYSCOTT]

:laugh2::laugh1:
Someone hit him in the head.:spanking:

:sarcasm:

Yo -

THIS IS EVEN BETTER!!!

 

[BIGDen]

Felix is already the oldest player on the team, possibly the oldest player in the NFL...therefore his exp is vast.

That's just funny.

 

[ThreeSportStar80]

Doesnt Felix already have more TD's than Julius entire Dallas Cowboy career?

BINGO!!! :laugh2:

 

[thescarface1989]

I'm as hopeful as the next guy regarding Felix' Cowboy future. I want to believe he'll be tremendously productive for years to come.

Of course we all remember Julius entree as a rookie too and the board was giddy over the guy just like with Felix now.

So what is it about Felix that makes us think his performances will continue whereas Julius just faded away. Do you consider him faster than Julius? Better moves? More decisive?

I'm particularly interested in what people think Julius would have done with Felix opportunities in 2008. To me, Felix does not look faster than Julius. We've debated Felix combine 4.47 but it seems Julius could easily match that IMO. Felix big plays, to me, have been because of speed primarily. Moves? Not really. Broken tackles? I don't think so. Great decisions? The holes seemed obvious.

What's the difference that will make Felix productivity lasting?

http://i81.***BLOCKED***/albums/j223/thescarface1989/Gifs/worfisfrustratedmz8.gif

 

[Alexander]

Two things stand out for Felix
1- Vision
2- Fluidity

3 - The proper attitude

There is one thing that ruined Jones and will continue to ruin him as a professional. He has a serious issue with insecurity and required constant maintenance. It goes all the way back to Notre Dame. He was not an easy player to deal with and certainly had a thin skin, despite whatever you read in the press.

He could say the right things publicly, but like we learned late in his tenure in Dallas and especially since he has left, he has an overinflated opinion of his abilities and honestly cares more about his status that success of the team. That is one reason we started him most of last season, simply to keep him appeased.

Felix Jones is a better team player and he gets it. That is why he will be more successful in the long run.

 

[jterrell]

I disagree with the lack of vision on Julius Jones part.

Disagree all you want but Julius has a 4.0 yards per carry average for his entire career.

That is indicative of a guy who can not see a hole.

Jones lost his job because Barber averaged an extra half yard per carry behind the same OL. Since Jones has 20 career carries that went more than 20 yards he clearly has enough speed when he gets free, his issue is getting free. And that points to vision.

He also works best out of the deep backfield off of draw plays where he can SEE clearly before he makes any moves.

I am not sure how anyone can watch Julius Jones and not come to the conclusion he lacks more than fair vision.

 

[Thomas82]

So far, Julius is doing better than I thought he would in Seattle.

 

[ZeroClub]

How bout I ask this question a different way.

Who here, when the board was gaga over Julius early, was the voice of reason who said he would eventually be revealed as fools gold?

I'm told there were a couple folks. Honestly, I was never on board with both feet like many were. So if Julius fooled the masses before what makes you so sure that Felix fate isn't eventually the same.

And I'm not talking 2006 & 2007 Julius. Duh, anyone can see the difference in productivity there. I'm talking vintage Julius versus today's Felix.

I think Julius Jones' career in Dallas was unusual ... he was an anomaly.

Most often, when a back comes into the league and enjoys the level of success that Julius Jones did, that back continues to be productive (unless injured).

Julius Jones wasn't. He was unusual in that it just doesn't happen very often that an RB shows excellence early on and then develops into an uninspired, robotic, and largely inept player.

So when I read your question, I read it like this:

"Why don't you expect Felix Jones to be as unusual as Julius Jones?"

My answer is that, from a probability standpoint, the unusual just doesn't happen that often. It is unlikely that Felix Jones' career will develop in the same unusual way that Julius Jones' career developed.


-- I agree with other posters who say that Julius Jones' unusual (and unfortunate) development was probably a result of mental factors (attitude, insecurity, lack of focus, etc.).

 

[Hypnotoad]

Even if your still not clear. I would take the uncertain over what is proven to be a dud.

 

[burmafrd]

Julius was never faulted for effort. I think insecurity is right; and I also think that BP misread him and messed him up mentally. For an introverted type like Julius, you have to handle them different then the extroverts. Introverts need more positive coaching, not negative coaching. By the end of his career BP had very little positive left in him. Shame because Julius had a lot of potential that he flashed that first year. He seems to be coming back some in Seattle- but I doubt he will ever post a monster game again.

 

[cowboyed]

From your list, and I'm not trying to be critical, I don't know that we have enough evidence to conclude the above.

1) Better vision? Perhaps so. Let's see some more.
2) Faster to the corner? Really? I'm not sure I agree with that yet.
3)Felix may well be stronger but I don't think that's been much of a factor in his success to date. I really don't recall him breaking tackles. Maybe I'm not remembering well.
4) Cut better and quicker? Not ready to buy that either. Go watch the highlight video 50cent put together on Julius first couple years here. He broke his share of ankles though I wouldn't put either runner in the "shifty" category.
5) Better receiver. He may well turn out that way. But how many catches does he have in Dallas to conclude that? Not many. I think it remains to be seen.

Honestly, I think Felix has been set up beautifully this far in Dallas. I'm not ready to conclude that he has been tried, tested and found superior. I'm hoping. But I just don't think we can say that yet.

I think the worst aspect of your thread is the fact that you started it at this highly premature juncture. If you want to comparatively fret over Felix, in the aggregate being similar to Julius, then you ought to hold off for a significant number of games down the road. Felix has been in a whopping 5 games and in a limited role. Despite that he has made some outstanding and point productive plays.

 

[burmafrd]

The finest game JJ had was the last game of the season against the giants. He had madden drooling over him. He was making the Giant d look like fools.
And he never looked that good again. Or even close to it.

 

[Velvet Jones]

How bout I ask this question a different way.

Who here, when the board was gaga over Julius early, was the voice of reason who said he would eventually be revealed as fools gold?

I'm told there were a couple folks. Honestly, I was never on board with both feet like many were. So if Julius fooled the masses before what makes you so sure that Felix fate isn't eventually the same.

And I'm not talking 2006 & 2007 Julius. Duh, anyone can see the difference in productivity there. I'm talking vintage Julius versus today's Felix.

It still astounds me how everyone wants to be able to point to that one thread two/three years ago to say, "See, I thought that first!!"

He could flame in another two years or he could take over the starting job. Why worry about it? He is playing insane football right now so why search for his replacement? I guess some people just like to either have their glass half full or half emtpy. Me? I just like to enjoy the tasty beverage.. and Felix has been sweet so far (Dude! That was an awesome soundbite!! )

 

[WarC]

What's the difference that will make Felix productivity lasting?

I think thats the big question, and something we'll just have to wait to see....I hope his spark lasts alot longer than JJ's did. He's an exciting runner to watch!