Fire Zimmer Now!!!

[Hostile]

Wrong !!!!!

You have gone down a rabbit trail.

My original counterpoint was (and still is) in direct response to the first post in this thread. Period.

What you have chosen to add to subtract to it is your problem...not mine.

You still don't grasp the fact that the original post was tongue in cheek sarcasm?

 

[Hostile]

LOL

Why do you think Parcells has the reputation of a control freak ? Give me a break.

Yes he believes in you. He believes that you are on board his bus and can get the job done.

Parcells is Captain Ahab?

I don't see it that way at all.

 

[Mike 1967]

True, and I certainly shouldn't have either.

But if you wanted Zimmer to go, why were okay with him staying when you found out we were switching to 3-4?

Because I truly did not comprehend that a DC would stay and learn a new system. The only reason I did not comprehend it was because I have never seen it before.

My experience has been that a DC or Head Coach has a very specific personality or fingerprint that they bring to a defensive or offensive scheme. I could not, for example, see Spurier employing a power running game...or Martz employing a power running game...or Buddy Ryan employing a 3-4.

So in my mind a new scheme meant a new coordinator. Especially since that was the scheme that Zimmer had been working within for so many years.

It did not cross my mind that you could keep the DC and simply change the scheme. Once I saw that possibility I really had no issue with Zimmer.

Because ultimately my issue was in two area's: (1) the scheme was old and tired (2) we were doing a poor job of selecting defensive talent. Specifically DE's.

Since we could change the scheme and still keep Zimmer...I had no issue's. And since Parcells would be controlling (along with Jerry) the defensive personnel selections....why would I have any reason to fear Zimmer.

And like others have said. If I have confidence in PArcells, then why would that not translate into confidence in his choice of DC.

Zimmer obviously is a good coach...or (like others have already said) PArcells would not have chosen him.

 

[Mike 1967]

You still don't grasp the fact that the original post was tongue in cheek sarcasm?

Nope...I did not know that.

Are you saying that the original poster is not taking a true stab at those who questioned Zimmer and the defense last year ?

 

[Mike 1967]

Parcells is Captain Ahab?

I don't see it that way at all.

Yes..he is kind of like captain Ahab. It is his ship...and he makes the rules.

But...Captain Ahab was obviously deranged. I am not saying that Parcells is deranged.

 

[Hostile]

Nope...I did not know that.

Are you saying that the original poster is not taking a true stab at those who questioned Zimmer and the defense last year ?

Here's what he said.

His defense has given up 4 Touchdowns in the last 5 games!!! Man we could do so much better.

You don't get the irony? How about the Eagles giving up 4 TDs to Jake Plummer alone yesterday in 1 game, let alone 5?

Fog clearing?

It was a sarcastic post about those who hate Zimmer for whatever reason and still do despite the fact his D is playing pretty good football. Like him or hate him, fien with me. At least acknowledge he's doing the job entrusted to him. And way better than people had a right to expect given his inexperience with the system.

If he learned it this fast isn't it just possible that the guy really is a pretty damned good coach? Isn't it possible that is why Jerry and Bill coaxed him out of taking the Nebraska job? Isn't it possible that the definition of him as a DC was just a bit off base?

I'd say the club thinks so. I'd say the results say so. It seems real obvious to me.

You don't ask incompetent personnel to stick around. You don't ask the same incompetent personnel to undertake the biggest task of the off season.

That just doesn't make a lick of sense and never has.

 

[Mike 1967]

Here's what he said.

You don't get the irony? How about the Eagles giving up 4 TDs to Jake Plummer alone yesterday in 1 game, let alone 5?

Fog clearing?

It was a sarcastic post about those who hate Zimmer for whatever reason and still do despite the fact his D is playing pretty good football. Like him or hate him, fien with me. At least acknowledge he's doing the job entrusted to him. And way better than people had a right to expect given his inexperience with the system.

If he learned it this fast isn't it just possible that the guy really is a pretty damned good coach? Isn't it possible that is why Jerry and Bill coaxed him out of taking the Nebraska job? Isn't it possible that the definition of him as a DC was just a bit off base?

I'd say the club thinks so. I'd say the results say so. It seems real obvious to me.

You don't ask incompetent personnel to stick around. You don't ask the same incompetent personnel to undertake the biggest task of the off season.

That just doesn't make a lick of sense and never has.

It was obviously sarcastic. And it was aimed at those who questioned Zimmer as DC.

I questioned Zimmer as DC last year...so I debated the original posters thought process behind his statement.

I stand by my message.

The only thing that has cleared is that my original interpretation, of the original posters statement, was correct.

I have no issue's with the points you have stated above regarding Zimmers abilities as a coach.

Again..I am counterpointing the original post that states that the success of the defense is proof that Zimmer is the man...because Zimmer is the reason behind the success. Sarcastic message yes...but that was the point being made.

And I will argue it all day long (that Zimmer is not the reason behind the defensive success. He may be a part of the whole..but he is not the catalyst)...I will argue that PArcells was the primary catalyst, regardless of what rabbit trails you attempt to create in an effort to win an argument.

 

[Mike 1967]

I'd say the club thinks so. I'd say the results say so. It seems real obvious to me.

You don't ask incompetent personnel to stick around. You don't ask the same incompetent personnel to undertake the biggest task of the off season.

That just doesn't make a lick of sense and never has.

Yes..you keep saying it....I'm just trying to figure out who you are debating

You keep setting up a straw man and knocking it down.

My dog in this fight is simple: PArcells is the catalyst behind the defensive success.

My dog was introduced in direct response to the first post on this thread.

 

[Jimz31]

I must admit that I didn't much care for Zimmer a couple of years ago, but I think he has done a GREAT job....especially since this is the first time that he has had to implement a 3-4 defense. Granted, we aren't running it 100% of the time...more of a hybrid defense, but he has had the #1 ranking a couple of years back. Yes, Campo helped him to acheive that....yes Campo.

Our defense is pretty stout and look at who we have playing....alot of very young guys.

 

[Hostile]

It was obviously sarcastic. And it was aimed at those who questioned Zimmer as DC.

I questioned Zimmer as DC last year...so I debated the original posters thought process behind his statement.

I stand by my message.

The only thing that has cleared is that my original interpretation, of the original posters statement, was correct.

I have no issue's with the points you have stated above regarding Zimmers abilities as a coach.

Again..I am counterpointing the original post that states that the success of the defense is proof that Zimmer is the man...because Zimmer is the reason behind the success. Sarcastic message yes...but that was the point being made.

And I will argue it all day long...regardless of what rabbit trails you attempt to create in an effort to win an argument.

By all means, show me where he (the author of the thread) said he's (Zimmer that is) the sole credit for the success of the D.

That's your interpretation, so back it up.

All last year Zimmer was the only flaw in our defense. That was the never ending mantra. Injuries be damned. Shoe is on the other foot, change the rules. Convenient.

He's simply saying the man deserves some credit. That's all any of us are telling you. Call that a rabbit trail if you wish. It changes nothing.

There's no evidence that an incompetent is in charge of the Cowboys' defense or has no control over it at all. Not one little shred of evidence.

That is all we're saying.

 

[Trip]

My dog in this fight is simple: PArcells is the catalyst behind the defensive success.

But that's an undebatable point, if you believe he was most responsible for choosing the free agents and draft choices, which I do.

The same statement could be true for last year: Parcells is the catalyst behind the defensive meltwown.

 

[Mike 1967]

The same statement could be true for last year: Parcells is the catalyst behind the defensive meltwown.

To a certain extent ... yes...

But with one major difference. The system being employed last year was not his own...it was one he inherited.

If it fails now...then it is a different story.

 

[Hostile]

To a certain extent ... yes...

But with one major difference. The system being employed last year was not his own...it was one he inherited.

If it fails now...then it is a different story.

Wow.

I'd love to have that kind of autonomy.

 

[Mike 1967]

By all means, show me where he (the author of the thread) said he's (Zimmer that is) the sole credit for the success of the D.

That's your interpretation, so back it up.

All last year Zimmer was the only flaw in our defense. That was the never ending mantra. Injuries be damned. Shoe is on the other foot, change the rules. Convenient.

He's simply saying the man deserves some credit. That's all any of us are telling you. Call that a rabbit trail if you wish. It changes nothing.

There's no evidence that an incompetent is in charge of the Cowboys' defense or has no control over it at all. Not one little shred of evidence.

That is all we're saying.

It is simple hermeneutics

Fire Zimmer Now!!!
His defense has given up 4 Touchdowns in the last 5 games!!!
Man we could do so much better.

This is obviously a sarcastic statement that is making a jibe at anyone who had previously questioned Zimmer as DC.

Fire Zimmer now because his defense has given up 4 touchdowns in the last 5 games. Man we could do much better...

4 touchdowns in 5 games is obviously a very good statistic. So the poster is obviously using that stat to support his position that to question Zimmer was clearly wrong. The obvious conclusion drawn from this statement is that Zimmer is the one responsible for the defensive success.

It is also obvious, based on the following 4-5 responses, that this translation was clear to others besides myself.

That begs the question.....why do we assume that Zimmer is the reason behind the success of our defense this year.

If we are going to choose a primary source of the success...(Which is what this poster did)...then why would we not choose PArcells instead of Zimmer. And for obvious reasons.

If the poster was not saying this...then he needs to do a better job of written communication.

And if neither you or anyone else is saying this...then there is nothing for us to debate.

 

[Wolverine]

Parcells should be getting the credit for our Defense since he is the one who is really running it. Parcells did not want Henson or Romo running our offense cuz they had no experience and did not wanna go through some years till they were good. He went with Bledsoe cuz Bledsoe has been around awhile and is a good proven QB.

The same for Zimmer. Zimmer sucked anyways. But Zimmer is a rookie with no experience in the 3-4. So like Parcells is not gonna let a rookie QB run this offense he aint gonna let some rookie to the 3-4 run our D.

I think BP let Zimmer have a chance at first but when he saw how totally lost he was that is when BP took over and that is why you see a much better D now.

DUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH!!!!!!!

 

[Hostile]

I was gonna respond but why bother? I'm done. It's like talking into an oscilating fan.

In the absence of logic, insert paranoia. In the face of facts, shout louder.

You guys can have the last word. Enjoy.

 

[THUMPER]

My hope is that some college team offers Zimmer a job as their HC and he takes it this time.

 

[Zimmy Lives]

I was gonna respond but why bother? I'm done. It's like talking into an oscilating fan.

In the absence of logic, insert paranoia. In the face of facts, shout louder.

You guys can have the last word. Enjoy.

Hostile, it is futile arguing will these people. They remind me of my burro, Pedro. You see, Pedro, he is one stubborn mule. I once fed him carrots from Walmart and it upset his stomach. Now Pedro, he refuses to take carrots from me. He only wants carrots from my father, Pablo. He refuses to even look at the carrots I try to feed him even though they are the same savory carrots (bought from Simon David) he receives from my father. No matter how hard I try and convince him, Pedro will always believe that I will feed him bad carrots even though I have improved their quality.

Let those that question Zimmer continue to believe like Pedro.

 

[Vinnie2u]

I didn't realize that starting this thread would cause such a reaction on this board... But I like it. My main reason for this thread was that I noticed that last year and earlier this year, Zimmer was getting 99% of the blame for the defenses deficiencies. Now that things seem to have been turned around, Big Bill seems to be getting all the credit. I belive that the truth is some where in the middle. I know it's Parcell's scheme but Zim has to do the game planning, watch the film and call the defensive signals as the game unfolds. There is no way in hell that Bill can Micro-manage all aspects of a game. There are too many things going on at game time. I'm not a expert but I believe a good head coach puts a team in the best position to win by surrounding himself with good coaches and players. Then he should watch over them, making sure
his scheme is being executed, but stay far away enough not to undermine their authority.

 

[Sarge]

I was gonna respond but why bother? I'm done. It's like talking into an oscilating fan.

In the absence of logic, insert paranoia. In the face of facts, shout louder.

You guys can have the last word. Enjoy.

Yep - they didn't (and wouldn't) give Zimmer any credit a few years ago when the defense ranked right at the top (with MUCH less talent than we have now) and they aren't going to give him any credit now.

#1 - Many of them don't 'get it.'

#2 - If they DO get it - they aren't going to admit it now.


We have one of the best defenses in the league so............get rid of Zimmer???