Fish: Crawford is McCoys replacement

[Hennessy_King]

Your comment, and my response to you, was not on the topic of Crawford's pay, so saying he is overpaid doesn't address my response to you. You should also note that I agreed with stash that Crawford is overpaid.

And, by the way, I don't think you and I are always on opposite sides of every topic. Usually when I have disagreements it's because I feel people exaggerate. In this case, I feel the notion that over Crawford's time in the NFL there is no other team in the NFL that has used a less than ideal D-Lineman like Crawford to be an exaggeration.

Yet provided no actual examples of another team. Just grasping at anything to make an argument.

 

[Stash]

Yet provided no actual examples of another team. Just grasping at anything to make an argument.

https://lh3.***BROKEN***/proxy/okKTxj5SCiHqkv-ykIIqhuIk0cMWs0SKUajs90VhWtgyaSwNFwAqrARMaUzk1ZiCnZRVFAni21h7

 

[OmerV]

Yet provided no actual examples of another team. Just grasping at anything to make an argument.

Did you prove there was never another team that ever started a player at Crawford's level? You made an absolute statement as if fact, and you didn't prove it, so how can you argue I didn't prove mine?

And, realistically, my point wasn't an absolute the way yours was, it was simply that the Cowboys aren't the only team that has problems and sometimes has to start players that are less than ideal. Surely you aren't saying that isn't true.

 

[Hennessy_King]

https://lh3.***BROKEN***/proxy/okKTxj5SCiHqkv-ykIIqhuIk0cMWs0SKUajs90VhWtgyaSwNFwAqrARMaUzk1ZiCnZRVFAni21h7

Omer is definitely the Blue guy

 

[OmerV]

Omer is definitely the Blue guy

When did you become this "I'm being picked on" guy? You're starting to talk about me the way Pappy talks about Dak. lol

 

[Hennessy_King]

Did you prove there was never another team that ever started a player at Crawford's level? You made an absolute statement as if fact, and you didn't prove it, so how can you argue I didn't prove mine?

And, realistically, my point wasn't an absolute the way yours was, it was simply that the Cowboys aren't the only team that has problems and sometimes has to start players that are less than ideal. Surely you aren't saying that isn't true.

Crawfords play has told me he would never start on another team. He's only been a starter here because our d line has been a disaster. Which I blame on the front office. It's a fact. Put $$ on it. When he gets cut I guarantee he wont start on another team. I'll put $100 on it right now.

 

[Hennessy_King]

When did you become this "I'm being picked on" guy? You're starting to talk about me the way Pappy talks about Dak. lol

O I don't care about being attacked on here. Especially for my "other" views by mods and the like. I'm still gonna air ppl out if I see a trend. I'm just making others aware. The dog whistling on this forum is the posterchild tbh.

 

[GhostOfPelluer]

I think he also had something to do with our run stoppage being so poor the last few years.

All of those lightweight DTs that he insistently counted upon so much couldn't plug the run.

Hill was immature on his own. Many players respond to some coaches better than others.

Tristen has to learn to get along with his superiors better than he was or be sent packing!

I have no qualms with Marinelli being let go. Just proving a point.

 

[Bullflop]

I have no qualms with Marinelli being let go. Just proving a point.

Yep -- I hear ya! There was a tendency for many here to demonize him a bit. I'm sure your version was tongue-in-cheek, tho!

 

[OmerV]

Crawfords play has told me he would never start on another team. He's only been a starter here because our d line has been a disaster. Which I blame on the front office. It's a fact. Put $$ on it. When he gets cut I guarantee he wont start on another team. I'll put $100 on it right now.

So, your claim is you know the situation over 8 years with every team and every player so well you can claim none of them ever started a player that wasn't clearly better than Crawford?

That alone throws up major red flags. 8 years, 32 teams, 3-4 starting D-Linemen on every team, and you say you know all of them so well that you can unquestionably say every one was notably better than Crawford ….

As for the bet you propose, you already admitted you were judging from watching Crawford play and said nothing of watching every other D-Lineman in the NFL play, so you are ignoring what is clearly a key element to your claim. But aside from that, who gets to decide the criteria? Is it stats? We all know stats alone don't tell the whole story, but even if going by stats, if stats are similar how do we decide who was better? Does it revert back to you simply saying "well, I've seen Crawford play, so I know"?

Let's look, for example, at 2018, which was Crawford's last healthy year. He started 15 games at RDE, had 34 tackles, 5.5 sacks, 4 tackles for loss, and 12 QB hits.

That same year, Michael Johnson started 15 games at RDE for Cincinnati, had 33 tackles, 0.5 sacks, 2 tackles for a loss, and 2 QB hits.

So, in that case do stats matter, or does the fact that you have seen Crawford play override what the stats indicate?

 

[Hook'em#11]

Oh yay. Not a downgrade there at all. Sign Snacks.

 

[OmerV]

Oh yay. Not a downgrade there at all. Sign Snacks.

If it were Poe that got hurt, this would make sense. But we don't need both DT's to be 350 lb run stuffers. McCoy obviously also has run duties, but he was there to penetrate, make plays in the backfield, and chase down plays. The team will still want quickness in the middle, so getting as close as possible to McCoy could do is what we will want what we will want from a replacement.

 

[Hennessy_King]

So, your claim is you know the situation over 8 years with every team and every player so well you can claim none of them ever started a player that wasn't clearly better than Crawford?

That alone throws up major red flags.

As for the bet you propose, you already admitted you were judging from watching Crawford play and said nothing of watching every other D-Lineman in the NFL play, so you are ignoring what is clearly a key element to your claim. But aside from that, who gets to decide the criteria? Is it stats? We all know stats alone don't tell the whole story, but even if going by stats, if stats are similar how do we decide who was better? Does it revert back to you simply saying "well, I've seen Crawford play, so I know"?

Let's look, for example, at 2018, which was Crawford's last healthy year. He started 15 games at RDE, had 34 tackles, 5.5 sacks, 4 tackles for loss, and 12 QB hits.

That same year, Michael Johnson started 15 games at RDE for Cincinnati, had 33 tackles, 0.5 sacks, 2 tackles for a loss, and 2 QB hits.

So, in that case do stats matter, or does the fact that you have seen Crawford play override what the stats indicate?

Crawford had 21% more snaps than m johnson in 2018. You also dont know if m johnson was in there to help against the run or be a nickel pass rusher. M johnson did have an int for a td at the age of 31 too. Was also paid 4.7m that year. Also wouldnt have been starting if lawson aint get hurt

 

[Stash]

If it were Poe that got hurt, this would make sense. But we don't need both DT's to be 350 lb run stuffers. McCoy obviously also has run duties, but he was there to penetrate, make plays in the backfield, and chase down plays. The team will still want quickness in the middle, so getting as close as possible to McCoy could do is what we will want what we will want from a replacement.

I wish more people would understand this.

 

[Kaiser]

If it were Poe that got hurt, this would make sense. But we don't need both DT's to be 350 lb run stuffers. McCoy obviously also has run duties, but he was there to penetrate, make plays in the backfield, and chase down plays. The team will still want quickness in the middle, so getting as close as possible to McCoy could do is what we will want what we will want from a replacement.

If we started Poe and Snacks I picture the team having a couple of those medical carts that ran out after every series to cart those two off the field.

 

[OmerV]

Crawford had 21% more snaps than m johnson in 2018. You also dont know if m johnson was in there to help against the run or be a nickel pass rusher. M johnson did have an int for a td at the age of 31 too. Was also paid 4.7m that year. Also wouldnt have been starting if lawson aint get hurt

21% more snaps, and 11 times more sacks and 6 times more QB hits. Still clearly a Crawford advantage. But let's say the 1 INT evens things out (a stretch) - who gets the tiebreaker, and how is it that there even being a tiebreaker indicates Johnson was clearly better?

But let's look at others from 2018...

Ogbah played 14 games and 173 more defensive snaps than Crawford and had 40 tackles, 3 sacks, 3 tackles for loss and 8 QB hits (and no INT). So, was he clearly better even though stats say he wasn't as good?

Other 2018 starting RDE's to look at … Margus Hunt, Brandon Graham, Arik Armstead, Arden Key, Alex Okafor … all 4-3 DE's who had stats similar to Crawford.

And that's just 2018. lol. You think we might find the same in other years? Especially with 5 sacks at DT in 2015?

 

[OmerV]

If we started Poe and Snacks I picture the team having a couple of those medical carts that ran out after every series to cart those two off the field.

Timeouts would have to be used for oxygen breaks.

 

[Kaiser]

Timeouts would have to be used for oxygen breaks.

Sure, but our Goal Line Defense will be awesome.

 

[Techsass]

His 'interior pass rush' will be much needed, keep your eyes on #98:

Wish we could get a couch to do a show like that. I know he's over-hyping the opponents, but I'd just love to see McCarthy, Nolan or Moore, etc. break down plays for us.