Future of Hardy - Ware like money. Is that what the future looks like to retain him?

[KJJ]

He wasn't found guilty of anything. You can't keep saying that. If a person is found guilty and it is reversed on appeal, they are not guilty. The whole process has to play out. It would be like saying Dallas beat GB because they were winning at halftime.

And the first offense under the old policy was 2 games and 6 games under the new policy. His career is not in jeopardy.

He was initially found guilty that's good enough for me and the Panthers who released him. Very few teams showed interest in him despite winning his appeal and Jerry clearly doesn't trust him only signing him to a one year incentive based deal. He got charged just prior to the new policy but if he gets charged again no team will have anything to do with him regardless if he's suspended 6 games his NFL career will be over.

 

[Toruk_Makto]

Suh has been a dominant pro bowl. / all pro type performer since the first day he entered the league

Hardy isn't that guy. Saying he is getting Suh type money next year is a joke.

 

[AzorAhai]

He was initially found guilty that's good enough for me and the Panthers who released him. Very few teams showed interest in him despite winning his appeal and Jerry clearly doesn't trust him only signing him to a one year incentive based deal. He got charged just prior to the new policy but if he gets charged again no team will have anything to do with him regardless if he's suspended 6 games his NFL career will be over.

And how do you know the Cowboys didn't have interest in a long term deal? It could very well be Hardy didn't want what he felt was a well below market long term deal and opted to seek a 1 year deal. Your assuming he would jump on a long term deal and it's not nearly as simple as your trying to make it out to be.

 

[Nightman]

He was initially found guilty that's good enough for me and the Panthers who released him. Very few teams showed interest in him despite winning his appeal and Jerry clearly doesn't trust him only signing him to a one year incentive based deal. He got charged just prior to the new policy but if he gets charged again no team will have anything to do with him regardless if he's suspended 6 games his NFL career will be over.

He wasn't released by CAR, he was an Unrestricted Free Agent. They would have had to give him 15.7m to Franchise Tag him again. They chose not to.

Hardy and Rosenhaus seemed pretty set on a one year deal and made Dallas sign a 'No Franchise Tag' clause. They don't seem too worried. If he has the year he is expected to, he can look forward to a pretty sizable guarantee next year. I would say somewhere around 5/65m with 25m guaranteed.

 

[NorthwestDallas40]

He wasn't found guilty of anything. You can't keep saying that. If a person is found guilty and it is reversed on appeal, they are not guilty. The whole process has to play out. It would be like saying Dallas beat GB because they were winning at halftime.

And the first offense under the old policy was 2 games and 6 games under the new policy. His career is not in jeopardy.

Voice of reason

 

[NorthwestDallas40]

Really anyone is one DV incident away from big trouble. If someone gets arrested and put on that crazy Commissioner's Exempt list they are basically guilty until the League decides how much bad press they can take. They will drop the hammer on anyone, whether it is their first or second offense.

If the NFLPA can somehow get the Commissioners' List removed as a disciplinary option a first offense will still be a minimum of 6 games and maybe more. Hardy had no previous history so he is no more likely than Romo of getting into this kind of trouble again.

At least with the drug policy teams know exactly what the penalties will be and there won't be any Ray Rice tapes showing up. I think teams may be wary of Hardy because of this incident and use it against him in contract talks, but I don't think he is any more of an actual risk.

Voice of reason II

 

[burmafrd]

amazing how some internet lawyers here think they have the answers.

One thing Doty did in the Peterson case was rule that you could not use the new policy for incidents that occurred before that policy was put in place. So Hardy is NOT subject to it. Only the old policy. Which really was no policy at all.
Realistically since he already sat out 15 games any SUSPENSION now will be appealed and the way the NFL has been losing them it is not likely to stand up. I can see maybe a two game suspension but no more.

 

[KJJ]

He wasn't released by CAR, he was an Unrestricted Free Agent. They would have had to give him 15.7m to Franchise Tag him again. They chose not to.

Hardy and Rosenhaus seemed pretty set on a one year deal and made Dallas sign a 'No Franchise Tag' clause. They don't seem too worried. If he has the year he is expected to, he can look forward to a pretty sizable guarantee next year. I would say somewhere around 5/65m with 25m guaranteed.

The Panthers considered releasing Hardy but decided to let him walk because they didn't want him anymore due to his assault charge coming down on the heels of the Ray Rice surveillance video that angered and shocked the entire country. Hardy had no choice but to take a one year incentive based deal because if any team offered more he would have taken it. To earn $13M in 2015 he's going to have to meet a number of incentives including playing the entire season and that appears to be one incentive he won't be able to meet. Players don't sign one year deals if there's better offers out there. Hardy could put up another 15 sacks and he won't get $25M guaranteed at least not from Jerry. He only offered Dez $20M guaranteed and if Jerry is worried about off the field issues with Dez he must be scared to death knowing he would have to cut Hardy if he committed to him long-term and eat a lot of guaranteed money if he gets accused of assaulting another woman.

Jerry had an opportunity to lock him up (no pun intended) long-term at a much cheaper price than Hardy will likely get offered if he has a big 2015 season so Jerry's not looking past the 2015 season with him. Any team that commits a lot guaranteed money to Hardy after 2015 will be taking a big gamble because one more assault charge on a woman will have him suspended and that team will be forced to cut him unless they want to lose sponsors and endure an incredible public relations nightmare. No team will have anything to do with Greg Hardy if he's ever even accused of assaulting another woman. His options were limited after this situation he won't have any options in the NFL if it ever happens again.

 

[Nightman]

The Panthers considered releasing Hardy but decided to let him walk because they didn't want him anymore due to his assault charge coming down on the heels of the Ray Rice surveillance video that angered and shocked the entire country. Hardy had no choice but to take a one year incentive based deal because if any team offered more he would have taken it. To earn $13M in 2015 he's going to have to meet a number of incentives including playing the entire season and that appears to be one incentive he won't be able to meet. Players don't sign one year deals if there's better offers out there. Hardy could put up another 15 sacks and he won't get $25M guaranteed at least not from Jerry. He only offered Dez $20M guaranteed and if Jerry is worried about off the field issues with Dez he must be scared to death knowing he would have to cut Hardy if he committed to him long-term and eat a lot of guaranteed money if he gets accused of assaulting another woman.

Jerry had an opportunity to lock him up (no pun intended) long-term at a much cheaper price than Hardy will likely get offered if he has a big 2015 season so Jerry's not looking past the 2015 season with him. Any team that commits a lot guaranteed money to Hardy after 2015 will be taking a big gamble because one more assault charge on a woman will have him suspended and that team will be forced to cut him unless they want to lose sponsors and endure an incredible public relations nightmare. No team will have anything to do with Greg Hardy if he's ever even accused of assaulting another woman. His options were limited after this situation he won't have any options in the NFL if it ever happens again.

Hardy did not want a multi-year deal at his lowest value. He wants to re-establish himself and test the market again next year. It is possible he has a good enough year and a big enough impact that Dallas offers him a multi-year deal midseason, but it is more likely he reaches UFA with a much cleaner slate next year. It doesn't have to be Dallas.

Every player is one serious incident away from severely impacting their future. Hardy will take the hit this year, but if he does what he is supposed to he will make at least 10m, that is not chump change.

 

[KJJ]

Hardy did not want a multi-year deal at his lowest value. He wants to re-establish himself and test the market again next year. It is possible he has a good enough year and a big enough impact that Dallas offers him a multi-year deal midseason, but it is more likely he reaches UFA with a much cleaner slate next year. It doesn't have to be Dallas.

Every player is one serious incident away from severely impacting their future. Hardy will take the hit this year, but if he does what he is supposed to he will make at least 10m, that is not chump change.

Why would he pass up the security of a multi-year deal that includes some guaranteed money and risk having a down season or a career threatening injury on a one year incentive based deal? If he doesn't play up to par in 2015 or suffers some injuries he many not get many offers at all. No team will want to risk much money on him if he doesn't play well or has injury problems and they also have to worry about off the field issues with him.

Hardy isn't like every player the incident he was accused of and found guilty of initially is a very serious incident that will get him blacklisted from the NFL if it happens again. Just because a player has served a suspension and has been reinstated doesn't mean a team has to sign them. The Cowboys will have some incentive not to resign Hardy to a multi-year deal after the 2015 season because if some team does sign him to a big contract the Cowboys will get a 3rd round compensatory pick.

 

[Nightman]

Why would he pass up the security of a multi-year deal that includes some guaranteed money and risk having a down season or a career threatening injury on a one year incentive based deal? If he doesn't play up to par in 2015 or suffers some injuries he many not get many offers at all. No team will want to risk much money on him if he doesn't play well or has injury problems and they also have to worry about off the field issues with him.

Hardy isn't like every player the incident he was accused of and found guilty of initially is a very serious incident that will get him blacklisted from the NFL if it happens again. Just because a player has served a suspension and has been reinstated doesn't mean a team has to sign them. The Cowboys will have some incentive not to resign Hardy to a multi-year deal after the 2015 season because if some team does sign him to a big contract the Cowboys will get a 3rd round compensatory pick.

What is so hard to understand about Hardy being at his lowest value right now? That is the worst time to sign a long term deal. He is betting on himself. He was never in criminal trouble before and he can stay out of trouble again. What he was accused of was a misdemeanor. There are much worse offenders that are still in the League. Don't get carried away with the lifetime ban stuff.

 

[KJJ]

What is so hard to understand about Hardy being at his lowest value right now? That is the worst time to sign a long term deal. He is betting on himself. He was never in criminal trouble before and he can stay out of trouble again. What he was accused of was a misdemeanor. There are much worse offenders that are still in the League. Don't get carried away with the lifetime ban stuff.

Why is it so hard for you to understand that a player betting on themselves with a one year incentive based deal isn't being offered a multi-year deal? Multi-year deals carry some sort of guarantee. Why do you think Hardy is at his lowest value right now? See how many players you can find who were offered long-term deals after going through months of legal issues due to an assault charge. It shouldn't be that difficult for Hardy to stay out of trouble for one year after all he's gone through the past few months and with him facing a multi game suspension to start the 2015 season but if he does stay out of trouble that doesn't mean you're out of the woods with him. You're getting carried away acting like what he did wasn't a big deal.

Ray Rice was originally charged with simple assault, a misdemeanor but a grand jury ended up indicting him for third-degree aggravated assault which is a felony 6 weeks after the surveillance video was released showing exactly what took place. We don't have a surveillance video of Hardy's assault so we don't know exactly what happened. You honestly believe if he gets charged with another assault against a woman and has to go through months of legal issues again and a 6 game league suspension that a team will risk the public relations nightmare they would endure to sign him?

 

[burmafrd]

Why is it so hard for you to understand that a player betting on themselves with a one year incentive based deal isn't being offered a multi-year deal? Multi-year deals carry some sort of guarantee. Why do you think Hardy is at his lowest value right now? See how many players you can find who were offered long-term deals after going through months of legal issues due to an assault charge. It shouldn't be that difficult for Hardy to stay out of trouble for one year after all he's gone through the past few months and with him facing a multi game suspension to start the 2015 season but if he does stay out of trouble that doesn't mean you're out of the woods with him. You're getting carried away acting like what he did wasn't a big deal.

Ray Rice was originally charged with simple assault, a misdemeanor but a grand jury ended up indicting him for third-degree aggravated assault which is a felony 6 weeks after the surveillance video was released showing exactly what took place. We don't have a surveillance video of Hardy's assault so we don't know exactly what happened. You honestly believe if he gets charged with another assault against a woman and has to go through months of legal issues again and a 6 game league suspension that a team will risk the public relations nightmare they would endure to sign him?

those that make general assumptions usually are wrong. Since as a Romo hater you are always wrong I am now more confident in Hardy then ever before.

 

[Nightman]

Why is it so hard for you to understand that a player betting on themselves with a one year incentive based deal isn't being offered a multi-year deal? Multi-year deals carry some sort of guarantee. Why do you think Hardy is at his lowest value right now? See how many players you can find who were offered long-term deals after going through months of legal issues due to an assault charge. It shouldn't be that difficult for Hardy to stay out of trouble for one year after all he's gone through the past few months and with him facing a multi game suspension to start the 2015 season but if he does stay out of trouble that doesn't mean you're out of the woods with him. You're getting carried away acting like what he did wasn't a big deal.

Ray Rice was originally charged with simple assault, a misdemeanor but a grand jury ended up indicting him for third-degree aggravated assault which is a felony 6 weeks after the surveillance video was released showing exactly what took place. We don't have a surveillance video of Hardy's assault so we don't know exactly what happened. You honestly believe if he gets charged with another assault against a woman and has to go through months of legal issues again and a 6 game league suspension that a team will risk the public relations nightmare they would endure to sign him?

We don't know what he has been offered. If it was 4/32m with 16m guaranteed you are saying he should take it because it is greater than 1/10-13m. That is taking a low ball deal. Next year he could get a 5/65m deal with 25million guaranteed. That is a huge improvement.

Or he could get the same 1/10-13m deal and still be ahead of the game.

 

[John813]

I think people are getting carried away suggesting Hardy is primed for a Suh or Watt contract if he has a good year.

If Hardy gets that, what does Justin Houston get with a good year in 2015 after posting 22 sacks in 2014? $200M?

I don't even think Suh is worth the contract he received and I'm willing to bet he never sees a fat chunk of it. His contract has "cap casualty" written all over it in year 4, which would leave over $50M unpaid.

I should of clarified. I doubt he gets the guaranteed money that Watt got, but I believe the average per year will be somewhere in the range of Watt's deal. Which means very little, in that these guys never see out the duration of their deals, nor the full amount.

While Hardy has that negative image over his head, if he can stay out of trouble and get close to a sack a game ratio, I think teams will be willing to talk to him. In a years time, people forget and move on.

IIRC Suh's first 3 years have guaranteed money. After that, the rest of the salary is not guaranteed. So basically, he'll be a Dolphin for at least 3 years, then probably gets cut if his play were to drop.

 

[KJJ]

We don't know what he has been offered. If it was 4/32m with 16m guaranteed you are saying he should take it because it is greater than 1/10-13m. That is taking a low ball deal. Next year he could get a 5/65m deal with 25million guaranteed. That is a huge improvement.

Or he could get the same 1/10-13m deal and still be ahead of the game.

Whatever he was offered couldn't have been better than the Cowboys offer or he wouldn't have taken it. Players don't bet on themselves when they have a team willing to bet on them with $16M guaranteed. Everyone knows he can play but no one wants to gamble a lot of money on him he carries too much risk. If he was offered anything with $16M guaranteed he would have taken it because he's playing on a one year deal where he has to meet a number of incentives to earn $13M. HIs future will be up in the air after the 2015 season because the character concerns with him and the risk a team will take signing him long-term will never go away. One year of him staying on the straight and narrow isn't going to lesson the risk with him. If he were to get slapped with another assault charge on a woman his NFL career will be over no NFL team will touch him and you know that as well as I do which is why you wouldn't answer the question. Only 6 teams showed interest in him and it wasn't because they questioned his talent he's a sack machine.

His character is in serious question and if he gets charged with the same offense again any team that commits to him would have to release him immediately due to morality issues. You can't have a player representing your organization who's been charged twice with assaulting a woman. If he stays out of trouble the next year he could blow out a knee or suffer through some nagging injuries in 2015 causing his production to drop resulting in teams losing interest. He's going to have to have a great 2015 season to keep teams interested enough to take the gamble he'll stay out of trouble. With him not having played in awhile and likely having to serve a multi game suspension to start the 2015 season he could very easily suffer an injury upon his return. Whatever teams have interest in him after the 2015 season are going to be looking to sign him to a contract that protects the team.