Garrett's 3 year plan

[rcaldw]

You nailed it. I have no issue with people being critical but for some to act like Garrett plays no part in the turn around to fit their own agenda is a bit much. If it was my call to make last season I would likely fired Jason because after 3 season we were still 8-8 and still missing post season. Jerry has stuck with Jason giving him this final year under contract and this team has responded. You bet Linehan and Marinnelli have played big parts and Jason has as well including the hiring of Linehan and the promoting of Marinnelli

And while I don't completely agree with every way you see the turn around, I do in large measure, and I respect the fact you can admit where you were wrong

 

[Idgit]

You nailed it. I have no issue with people being critical but for some to act like Garrett plays no part in the turn around to fit their own agenda is a bit much. If it was my call to make last season I would likely fired Jason because after 3 season we were still 8-8 and still missing post season. Jerry has stuck with Jason giving him this final year under contract and this team has responded. You bet Linehan and Marinnelli have played big parts and Jason has as well including the hiring of Linehan and the promoting of Marinnelli

Doomsday, you are the closest poster I've seen to nailing what the reality of the situation is. Many wanted JG gone and there were actual fact based factors, as I've alluded to here, that led to this conclusion. His blueprint has not been followed to a T and every off season was filled with turnover and addition/subtractions that were more Jerry tinkering than blueprint. On top of it we were sitting in the same place. I said it in my "new house" example above and I've said it all along. I give JG full credit to having an IDEA of what he wanted and sticking to it. He has a hand in it. But the last 3 years were not perfectly planned. There wasn't a strategy like we saw in the early 90s where every year you could see a "step-up." This was a stew of people and ideas that came together and formed what we have now. That is all and it is great to be 5-1.

It's sort of a spectrum. And while I give Jason a lot more credit than most in the process (I don't agree with your assessment here, Houston, for example), I can readily see a logical case that can be made for how much grey area there is in how it all came together. And I wouldn't say for a minute that Jason hasn't made some significant mistakes in the process that have cost us wins and probably post seasons as a result. And I'm not talking about play calling. I mean architectural mistakes in putting together his staff and his scheme that have hurt us a bit while this is all coming together. At the same time, though, I think the direction and the overall plan has been pretty obvious. It's just taken longer to bear fruit than it might have otherwise.

 

[khiladi]

Jason Garrett on drafting Tyson Smith in February 2012:

"In a perfect world, what you want to try to do is go into the draft without needs," coach Jason Garrett said. "I think you tend to draft worse when you say, 'I think we need to draft this position or that position.' And regardless of how objective you want to make that process, you invariably say, 'OK, we have a need here, so maybe we bump a player up ahead of this guy when they're really probably pretty similar."

"In an ideal situation you want to address your needs prior to the draft. Hard to do that, but you're trying to do that so you can draft as purely as possible. We couldn't do that last year."

http://www.bloggingtheboys.com/2013...-nfl-draft-2013-do-you-live-by-the-bpa-theory

That year in which he said they couldn't draft as purely possible was the year they took Smith. He emphatically states that needs should be addressed via free agency and drafting should be done according to BPA. This is how he defines his process.

He says 2011, the year they drafted Smith was an exception and they couldn't draft as purely as possible. This was the year they took Smith. And yet, Stephen Jones in 2011, the year before, said that they would pick the BPA which ended up being Smith.

"We're going to take the best player that's available when it comes time for us to pick," Cowboys executive vice president Stephen Jones said. "I know that's the old saying that people get tired of hearing about, but that's what we need to do with this team. You never know who is going to be injured and who is not going to work out from year-to-year, so you just need to take good football players, and that's what we're going to do."

And drafting Smith wasn't even a BPA issue, because he was potentially one of the best OL to come out of college in years.

Jeff Sullivan is full of garbage. Jason Garrett flat out denies him and Stephen Jones flat out denies him. You can spin it all you want, but that's reality.

Jason Garrett says that they don't build by need, thus refuting all you homers that think that Garrett was set on building the OL from the beginning. In fact, it gives more credence to the fact that Jerry Jones went Frederik. The need of OL was NOT built via free agency, it was build via the draft.

And we all know, per Jerry's own words, that they had 3 defensive players rated before Martin lined up to pick, but they all were taken. More people were scared about this defense and many kept whining about injuries.

 

[khiladi]

Further, where is this estimate that Garrett said he needed 3 years to rebuild a team? The only 3 year rule I have heard is Parcells, saying you know if you have a player after 3 years. Plus, this is year 4 as a HC anyways. He's only talked about process, every time his team choked. When they fired Rob Ryan, he said that they needed to generate more TOs to give the offense more chances to win.

http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap10...rett-lack-of-turnovers-led-to-rob-ryan-firing

"The Bears had 44 takeaways. We had 16. That's 28 more opportunities with the ball," Garrett told the Fort Worth Star-Telegram from the Senior Bowl. "Give me some of those 28 opportunities. That's something that we really sat back and thought a lot about, had a lot of discussions about -- what's the best way to try to achieve that, and then, 'OK, you want to do that, now who are the guys who can help implement that?' "

Nowhere was Jason Garrett blaming the offense for lack of production.

 

[khiladi]

And Larry Lacewell takes full credit for the 4-3...

http://www.***BANNED-URL***/sports/...owboys-horrible-defense-is-nobody-s-fault.ece

“I will take full blame for wanting Monte to be hired,” Lacewell said from Jonesboro, Ark., where he lives. “But I will not take blame for 7,000 injuries."

 

[Miller]

It's sort of a spectrum. And while I give Jason a lot more credit than most in the process (I don't agree with your assessment here, Houston, for example), I can readily see a logical case that can be made for how much grey area there is in how it all came together. And I wouldn't say for a minute that Jason hasn't made some significant mistakes in the process that have cost us wins and probably post seasons as a result. And I'm not talking about play calling. I mean architectural mistakes in putting together his staff and his scheme that have hurt us a bit while this is all coming together. At the same time, though, I think the direction and the overall plan has been pretty obvious. It's just taken longer to bear fruit than it might have otherwise.

I respect that Idgit...a long with most of your posts. Not everyone is going to agree. I just don't see a right or wrong in the process. That is my problem. And as you stated, I find a lot more gray, especially the transition from HC/OC to the set up we have now. To me that wasn't planned by JG and the process to get to Lineham wasn't planned by JG. I look at it as everyone maybe agreed what was needed but there were factors that pushed the agenda too....salary cap, Jerry, not winning, blown games. There is a reaction to all of those things whether it be cutting a high priced vet(which I'm proud Jerry finally started doing instead of loyalty), to getting another coordinator when JG was having issues with handling both jobs, etc. I also think, by Jerry's comments after last season, that there are a lot of things we don't know and that maybe he expected more at the end of last year...more to what should have been built into the process. In the NFL nothing is fluid.

 

[Idgit]

Jason Garrett on drafting Tyson Smith in February 2012:

http://www.bloggingtheboys.com/2013...-nfl-draft-2013-do-you-live-by-the-bpa-theory

That year in which he said they couldn't draft as purely possible was the year they took Smith. He emphatically states that needs should be addressed via free agency and drafting should be done according to BPA. This is how he defines his process.

He says 2011, the year they drafted Smith was an exception and they couldn't draft as purely as possible. This was the year they took Smith. And yet, Stephen Jones in 2011, the year before, said that they would pick the BPA which ended up being Smith.

And drafting Smith wasn't even a BPA issue, because he was potentially one of the best OL to come out of college in years.

Jeff Sullivan is full of garbage. Jason Garrett flat out denies him and Stephen Jones flat out denies him. You can spin it all you want, but that's reality.

Jason Garrett says that they don't build by need, thus refuting all you homers that think that Garrett was set on building the OL from the beginning. In fact, it gives more credence to the fact that Jerry Jones went Frederik. The need of OL was NOT built via free agency, it was build via the draft.

And we all know, per Jerry's own words, that they had 3 defensive players rated before Martin lined up to pick, but they all were taken. More people were scared about this defense and many kept whining about injuries.

Not sure what conclusion you're trying to draw here, but this says nothing to refute the obvious fact that the Cowboys under Garrett and a clear plan to address and rebuild the OL through the draft.

 

[khiladi]

Not sure what conclusion you're trying to draw here, but this says nothing to refute the obvious fact that the Cowboys under Garrett and a clear plan to address and rebuild the OL through the draft.

You know exactly what the conclusion is and you know what exactly it proves.

 

[khiladi]

http://www.***BANNED-URL***/sports/...an-do-to-avoid-2013-s-draft-day-confusion.ece

Even Stephen Jones admits they had Sharif Floyd as the BPA in the draft. And this was the year they were targeting defense.

“That was unfortunate with Sharrif,” Jones said last month. “I don’t want to single a guy out, but I think that can happen when you change a system and you move from what we were doing. We were so into that and all of a sudden you move to a 4-3 and you’ve got new coaches in the room and what they’re trying to accomplish. That one kind of slipped through the cracks a little bit on us. It won’t happen again.

There was utter confusion in the draft room that was reported by the papers when Jerry traded down and went Frederik, because of Marinelli. Frederik per Yakuza Rich even mentioned recently that it was Callahan that lobbied for the drafting of Frederik.

 

[visionary]

I've yet to see a group of posters on the site who didn't see and weren't able to talk about problems with the team. I think there were a lot of discussions on those topics, weren't there? And the front office has been rebuilding the OL since Jason Garrett took over--something else I don't think any red-blooded Cowboy fan ever had a problem with since Jason released Gurode and Davis and went shopping for a new LT....it was both obvious and necessary.

The issue comes in in that a lot of posters weren't satisfied with the steps it took to get there. For example, they didn't like Callahan coming in and the move to the zone defense because they thought Houck was just as good. They didn't like taking fliers on guys like Ron Leary in CFA because they wanted to spend $60M in VFA on Carl Nicks. They didn't like the drafting of Frederick, or the hiring of Linehan in the first place. They've called the head coach a clown and a puppet and an idiot for years.

I can't speak for anybody but myself in this case, but then to flip around in the middle of the most impressive 5 game winning streak in recent years to try to turn around and argue that they were right all along and that little or none of the success is of Jason Garrett's doing just comes off as disingenuous or phony. Cowardly even, maybe? It's really hard not to react to that. Honestly, to the extent that it can stay within the obvious guidelines and that it doesn't detract significantly from the topic of the thread, I have a hard time blaming them. Actually, I have a hard time not joining in.

I'd agree, though, that it's not good karma for the long-standing positive posters to turn around at the first sign of really positive play and unleash a lot of emotional frustration at 'realists' right now. What goes around, comes around in the NFL, and there's going to be a lot of adversity still this season. Lots of opportunities for Jason to turn back into an idiot. And you can bet when that happens, we won't be talking about whether the offense is going through him or through Scott Linehan. It'll be obvious at that point that this is the HC's show, win or lose.

Even though you and I have had our differences in the past, I largely agree with your post.

The reality is that I was a supporter of Garrett through the initial part of his tenure but IMO results beat hope. However , even though I think that some of what has transpired is serendipity and linehan /marinelli, if the team keeps playing well and wins some post season games , both Jason and Jerry will deserve the credit. As a fan, I think of the cowboys as my team, and if they can put a consistent contender on the field , no one will be happier.

As mods, I bet you guys can already see the change in tone on the board. Real hope is back , not just made up believe stuff

 

[rcaldw]

Even though you and I have had our differences in the past, I largely agree with your post.

The reality is that I was a supporter of Garrett through the initial part of his tenure but IMO results beat hope. However , even though I think that some of what has transpired is serendipity and linehan /marinelli, if the team keeps playing well and wins some post season games , both Jason and Jerry will deserve the credit. As a fan, I think of the cowboys as my team, and if they can put a consistent contender on the field , no one will be happier.

As mods, I bet you guys can already see the change in tone on the board. Real hope is back , not just made up believe stuff

There have been reasons for real hope for a while.

 

[khiladi]

In 2013, the year they went OL on what was clear confusion, they only drafted one player that played in the TRENCHES, whether offense or defense, and that was Frederik.

Todd Archer, the resident Jason Garrett homer at ESPN, said this about the draft:

Might be the best pick made by the Cowboys over the three days because of where they got him. They needed an every-down running back and not a third-down or change-of-pace guy because of DeMarco Murray's health problems, and they got one. Randle is not perfect, but he was productive and explosive. He had 43 touchdowns in three seasons and was not a fumbler. He can step in and play right away.

He said about Escobar:

If the Cowboys are really altering their offensive philosophy with two-tight end sets, then this pick makes more sense. If not, then they missed a chance to get better on the defensive line or safety. Escobar has terrific hands and could become a good red zone target as well but he needs work as a blocker. He will also be chasing ghosts of Anthony Fasano and Martellus Bennett.

How is altering your philosophy with two-tight ends part of the process, when that has been abandoned with Linehan?

 

[khiladi]

Even though you and I have had our differences in the past, I largely agree with your post.

The reality is that I was a supporter of Garrett through the initial part of his tenure but IMO results beat hope. However , even though I think that some of what has transpired is serendipity and linehan /marinelli, if the team keeps playing well and wins some post season games , both Jason and Jerry will deserve the credit. As a fan, I think of the cowboys as my team, and if they can put a consistent contender on the field , no one will be happier.

As mods, I bet you guys can already see the change in tone on the board. Real hope is back , not just made up believe stuff

I was a Garrett fan in 2007 and 2008, until the whole fall-out and Wade got all the blame and failure to recognize the poor play-calling of Garrett as one of the main problems. Things like not practicing in pads and culture and other ridiculous claims were given attention.

 

[visionary]

Jason Garrett on drafting Tyson Smith in February 2012:



http://www.bloggingtheboys.com/2013...-nfl-draft-2013-do-you-live-by-the-bpa-theory

That year in which he said they couldn't draft as purely possible was the year they took Smith. He emphatically states that needs should be addressed via free agency and drafting should be done according to BPA. This is how he defines his process.

He says 2011, the year they drafted Smith was an exception and they couldn't draft as purely as possible. This was the year they took Smith. And yet, Stephen Jones in 2011, the year before, said that they would pick the BPA which ended up being Smith.



And drafting Smith wasn't even a BPA issue, because he was potentially one of the best OL to come out of college in years.

Jeff Sullivan is full of garbage. Jason Garrett flat out denies him and Stephen Jones flat out denies him. You can spin it all you want, but that's reality.

Jason Garrett says that they don't build by need, thus refuting all you homers that think that Garrett was set on building the OL from the beginning. In fact, it gives more credence to the fact that Jerry Jones went Frederik. The need of OL was NOT built via free agency, it was build via the draft.

And we all know, per Jerry's own words, that they had 3 defensive players rated before Martin lined up to pick, but they all were taken. More people were scared about this defense and many kept whining about injuries.

Game set and match

 

[ConstantReboot]

You're being ridiculous. And we didn't always run on 3rd and short...again...because when we indicated run we'd get blown off the ball. That's why we ran the draw so much.

Look at that last touchdown drive versus the Seahawks. We lined up in jumbo set 3 straight times and ran the same play the last two times. We could NEVER have done that last year.

LOL now your being silly and too bad you can't seem to get it.

We could have ran that same package last year if we wanted to. It took a different playcaller. WE could have never have done that was because it was never called or practiced. We were to fixated on the pass.....

Do you not comprehend?

 

[ConstantReboot]

We pass less on 3rd down and short (1 to 3) now. Went from a 65.1%/34.9% pass to run in 2013 to so far in 2014 a 59.3%/40.7%. Not a huge difference and they still pass more than run in that situation.

Of course we pass less on 3rd down now. We have a different playcaller that wasn't fixated on passing compared to last year. There wasn't a major change in our offense besides having Linehan call the plays.

People here are so in love with Garrett that a little negativity about him gets them up and arms over nothing.

Face it. He wasn't the best playcaller all these years. In fact, he was terrible. Thank God for Linehan coming here and figuring out we are a running team. Thus you see the results that you see now.

 

[Toruk_Makto]

Of course we pass less on 3rd down now. We have a different playcaller that wasn't fixated on passing compared to last year. There wasn't a major change in our offense besides having Linehan call the plays.

People here are so in love with Garrett that a little negativity about him gets them up and arms over nothing.

Face it. He wasn't the best playcaller all these years. In fact, he was terrible. Thank God for Linehan coming here and figuring out we are a running team. Thus you see the results that you see now.

You mean the play caller who was pass happy the last half decade or so?

Also please look at our run / pass split from last year after our bye.

Please report back.

 

[rcaldw]

You mean the play caller who was pass happy the last half decade or so?

Also please look at our run / pass split from last year after our bye.

Please report back.

I admire the patience of you guys. Mine is spent. I really believe it doesn't matter what the question is, or what the answer is, the conclusion is: "I will not accept that Jason Garrett is #1 on the list of people deserving of respect for the turnaround." Notice, I didn't say the only person... not by far. But the head coach and the leader of the turnaround. They will never admit it, and it has nothing to do with Garrett. It has to do with them.

 

[ConstantReboot]

Lynch last week avg 6 yards a carry right? Do you think Lynch was very consistent or was it just 1 big run and a bunch of nothing? Avg per game can be misleading consistency in the running game is what we lacked. Facing 2nd and 8 or 2nd 9 puts you in passing situation. This year Dallas is not facing a lot of that and getting a lot more consistency in the running game I think in large part to a fully healthy Murray and the development of Fredrick and addition of Martin. This is not to say Dallas could not have ran more last season but there is a difference in how they are running this season as compared to last season.
I do agree that Linehan has come in and done a great job, he is a coach the Garrett has coached with before and a guy he fully trust.

One last thing Callahan was calling plays last season until late in the season when Garrett took more control over the play calling. Now Garrett has a playcaller he trust to do the job

Doomsy, totally agree with you.We are a different team this year compared to last year. Im not arguing or debating that. The major change is not with the personnel. The major change is our philosophy.

We had the same personnel as last year with the only addition is Martin. Mind you Martin is playing great. But the main factor to all this is Linehan calling the plays - and Callahan coaching the team how to block.

There was no definite 3 year plan that said lets draft linesmen so they can block and we can run the ball. The idea was to draft linesmen so that we can protect Romo and control the line of scrimmage.

The run game happened because all the pieces started to fall in place when Linehan came in here and all he did was rearrange the seating on the bus. He was the catalyst that brought about all this and not some 3 year plan.

 

[rcaldw]

Doomsy, totally agree with you.We are a different team this year compared to last year. Im not arguing or debating that. The major change is not with the personnel. The major change is our philosophy.

We had the same personnel as last year with the only addition is Martin. Mind you Martin is playing great. But the main factor to all this is Linehan calling the plays - and Callahan coaching the team how to block.

There was no definite 3 year plan that said lets draft linesmen so they can block and we can run the ball. The idea was to draft linesmen so that we can protect Romo and control the line of scrimmage.

The run game happened because all the pieces started to fall in place when Linehan came in here and all he did was rearrange the seating on the bus. He was the catalyst that brought about all this and not some 3 year plan.

And you know all of this how?