George Zimmerman charged with 2nd degree murder of Trayvon Martin **Read Post #142**

[Kangaroo]

What i find interesting is this story has gotten more run then the two Tulsa guy that went on a rampage killing people 3 dead and like 2 wounded it looks a lot like a hate crime.

http://www.nytimes.com/2012/04/10/us/tulsa-murder-suspects-have-bail-set-at-9-1-million.html

 

[WoodysGirl]

What i find interesting is this story has gotten more run then the two Tulsa guy that went on a rampage killing people 3 dead and like 2 wounded it looks a lot like a hate crime.

http://www.nytimes.com/2012/04/10/us/tulsa-murder-suspects-have-bail-set-at-9-1-million.html

I've read about it...but I'm not following it heavily.

Just reading some headlines, looks like it's a pretty cut and dry case and they've confessed to the crimes.

 

[Manwiththeplan]

What i find interesting is this story has gotten more run then the two Tulsa guy that went on a rampage killing people 3 dead and like 2 wounded it looks a lot like a hate crime.

http://www.nytimes.com/2012/04/10/us/tulsa-murder-suspects-have-bail-set-at-9-1-million.html

because they got arrested and are going to spend the rest of their lives in jail. murder whether it's black on white, white on black or any other nationality, isn't a huge story.

Someone killing someone and not being charged is. As I've said all along, if GZ was charged, it likely wouldn't have been more than a blip on the national radar

 

[Hoofbite]

The Trajectory of the bullet will be a factor. Was Trayvon truly on top at the time of the shot? Maybe the Autopsy results on his body played a part in them going with 2nd degree.


The screams on the 911 tapes could have also played a factor. Wonder if they had voice experts test to see if it was Zimmerman before they decided to charge him.

Two experts using two different techniques both concluded that the voice on the tape was NOT Zimmerman.

They couldn't comment on it in relation to Trayvon because they don't have a recording of his voice.

 

[Tusan_Homichi]

I've been taking 911 calls for over 6 years now. You would be surprised (or maybe you wouldn't) at how many people call in black males just walking around in their neighborhood. Usually they say something to the effect of "I don't recognize them from around here" or "He doesn't belong in this neighborhood". These guys would be doing nothing wrong. You'd ask what makes them suspicious and they'd say something to the effect of "Well, they keep looking at vehicles and houses." What else do you do when you're walking in a neighborhood? Stare at the ground?

This happens ALL THE TIME. Now, I haven't listened to the tape on this and honestly, I hate listening to 911 tapes. I hear enough of this crap everyday, but figured I'd just post some stuff from personal experience.

 

[TheCount]

Well, race was brought up in this thread and even one of the moderators here said it was a factor so I was just bringing more evidence to the discussion. And a hate crime is far different than a race related crime.

What is a race related crime? The fact that Zimmerman MAY have profiled Trayvon because he was black, wearing a sweatshirt and unfamiliar doesn't make it a race related crime. Profiling isn't a crime.

I've read about it...but I'm not following it heavily.

Just reading some headlines, looks like it's a pretty cut and dry case and they've confessed to the crimes.

This is what perplexes me. People keep bringing up all these other cases, where the criminals are caught and brought to justice. The vast majority of the outrage over the Zimmerman/Martin case is that Zimmerman had not been arrested and Trayvon was unarmed, a teenager and close to home. If Zimmerman had been arrested immediately following the shooting, I highly doubt it would have become what it became.

 

[casmith07]

What is a race related crime? The fact that Zimmerman MAY have profiled Trayvon because he was black, wearing a sweatshirt and unfamiliar doesn't make it a race related crime. Profiling isn't a crime.



This is what perplexes me. People keep bringing up all these other cases, where the criminals are caught and brought to justice. The vast majority of the outrage over the Zimmerman/Martin case is that Zimmerman had not been arrested and Trayvon was unarmed, a teenager and close to home. If Zimmerman had been arrested immediately following the shooting, I highly doubt it would have become what it became.

If Zimmerman would've been arrested after the shooting and the police did their job, nobody would have ever known about it.

It would've been another footnote in the thousands of other crimes committed daily.

 

[justbob]

As a student having taken a smorgasbord of classes about criminal law, spending a lot of my free time reading criminal cases for fun, and being a future prosecutor, all I'm trying to do, as I've always done, is help people understand the basics of the law so that all of the make believe law doesn't go flying around.

As a student who has taken classes and read criminal cases and hopes of being a future prosecutor----You have slightly more knowledge then the people who watch all the cop shows on TV. I don't mean that with any disrespect but it is true. The grand idea that the law is black and white is only for the books. The back door dealing in the legal profession would embarrass a politician...

I never said a word about this case in the original thread because all the comments were based on nothing but what the media said....It stirred up this board and it stirred groups in the real world.....I have seen the same thing played out with black,white ,young and old. Rich people and drug dealers.
Many of the mouths that helped stir this up have law degrees or access to lawyers. But they went flying around with it anyway --because they decided that a man had done something wrong based on the victim...I don't know who is right or wrong ,because I didn't work the case...But is should be tried in the media with a bunch of professional hatemongers pushing it.

There is only one thing in a case that doesn't lie--the lawyers,the judges .the witness and everyone involved can and many have lied on case.
The evidence doesn't.....Let it be the deciding factor when presented to a jury...not all the crap that is going around

 

[justbob]

If Zimmerman would've been arrested after the shooting and the police did their job, nobody would have ever known about it.

It would've been another footnote in the thousands of other crimes committed daily.

Their is nothing there that says they didn't do their job and you can always just arrest someone on the spot ---You know that

 

[joseephuss]

Probably he would have. He was a watch captain. That's what they do. And since Zimmerman is Hispanic, I doubt race played any part of it.

Maybe you should at least listen to the 911 call if you haven't already.

I am not sure what you mean by that. Anybody can be a racist no matter what their background.

I never really have bought into the race angle in this particular case. It just seems like a case of a guy who was overzealous and loved being in a position with some authority. Being the so called head of the neighborhood watch gave him a sense of power and he enjoyed or looked forward to flaunting it.

 

[Cajuncowboy]

I am not sure what you mean by that. Anybody can be a racist no matter what their background.

I never really have bought into the race angle in this particular case. It just seems like a case of a guy who was overzealous and loved being in a position with some authority. Being the so called head of the neighborhood watch gave him a sense of power and he enjoyed or looked forward to flaunting it.

Considering he is Hispanic and works with young black males I doubt that race was a factor.

Oh and here some news. Martin's mom said she thinks the whole thing was an accident and not murder.

 

[Cajuncowboy]

I am not sure what you mean by that. Anybody can be a racist no matter what their background.

I never really have bought into the race angle in this particular case. It just seems like a case of a guy who was overzealous and loved being in a position with some authority. Being the so called head of the neighborhood watch gave him a sense of power and he enjoyed or looked forward to flaunting it.

Considering he is Hispanic and works with young black males I doubt that race was a factor.

Oh and here some news. Martin's mom said she thinks the whole thing was an accident and not murder.


Asked what she would like to ask to Zimmerman, Trayvon's mother, Sybrina Fulton, said on The Today Show that she wants an apology from him.

"I believe it was an accident. I believe it just got out of control and he couldn't turn the clock back," Fulton said, revealing her opinion about what happened the night her 17-year-old son was shot to death. "I would ask him, did he know that that was a minor, that that was a teenager and that he did not have a weapon."

http://articles.orlandosentinel.com/2012-04-12/news/os-trayvon-martin-george-zimmerman-charged-jail-20120412_1_face-murder-charges-today-show-accident

 

[Cajuncowboy]

If Zimmerman would've been arrested after the shooting and the police did their job, nobody would have ever known about it.

It would've been another footnote in the thousands of other crimes committed daily.

Because we know that every crime that is committed has an arrest the moment after it happens.

 

[zrinkill]

To appease the "masses".

All a show.

 

[joseephuss]

Considering he is Hispanic and works with young black males I doubt that race was a factor.

Oh and here some news. Martin's mom said she thinks the whole thing was an accident and not murder.

I get you now. It wasn't clear in your previous post. Shows how specifics are clearer than generalizations.

 

[Manwiththeplan]

"I believe it was an accident. I believe it just got out of control and he couldn't turn the clock back," Fulton said, revealing her opinion about what happened the night her 17-year-old son was shot to death. "I would ask him, did he know that that was a minor, that that was a teenager and that he did not have a weapon."

I actually do believe that is what occured, but that doesn't excuse it or make it okay. Again, no one is suggesting he woke up that mourning and decided he wanted to kill a black person or any peron, but Zimmerman made an error in judgement that resulted in my opinion the unlawfull death of another and that usually results in going to jail.

 

[Cajuncowboy]

I actually do believe that is what occured, but that doesn't excuse it or make it okay. Again, no one is suggesting he woke up that mourning and decided he wanted to kill a black person or any peron, but Zimmerman made an error in judgement that resulted in my opinion the unlawfull death of another and that usually results in going to jail.

Unless Martin attacked him, which is alleged.

 

[The30YardSlant]

I've been taking 911 calls for over 6 years now. You would be surprised (or maybe you wouldn't) at how many people call in black males just walking around in their neighborhood. Usually they say something to the effect of "I don't recognize them from around here" or "He doesn't belong in this neighborhood". These guys would be doing nothing wrong. You'd ask what makes them suspicious and they'd say something to the effect of "Well, they keep looking at vehicles and houses." What else do you do when you're walking in a neighborhood? Stare at the ground?

This happens ALL THE TIME. Now, I haven't listened to the tape on this and honestly, I hate listening to 911 tapes. I hear enough of this crap everyday, but figured I'd just post some stuff from personal experience.

I went to school in College Station, and it's neighbor Bryan is a very low-income, crime ridden area and that crime tends to spill into CS. The university had a campus crime alert system that emailed all the current students and staff about criminal acitivity (robbery, murder, assault, etc.) that occured on or close to campus. In four years there I was sent 43 campus crime/area crime alerts, and 41 of them listed a "young black male" as the suspect. Every suspect ever apprehended in a follow up was a young black male.

It may not be right and it is definitely profiling, but sadly the state of certain cultures in certain areas renders it statistically justifiable.

 

[Manwiththeplan]

I went to school in College Station, and it's neighbor Bryan is a very low-income, crime ridden area and that crime tends to spill into CS. The university had a campus crime alert system that emailed all the current students and staff about criminal acitivity (robbery, murder, assault, etc.) that occured on or close to campus. In four years there I was sent 43 campus crime/area crime alerts, and 41 of them listed a "young black male" as the suspect. Every suspect ever apprehended in a follow up was a young black male.

It may not be right and it is definitely profiling, but sadly the state of certain cultures in certain areas renders it statistically justifiable.

so you are changing your argument to race played a factor, but that's ok?

 

[The30YardSlant]

Considering he is Hispanic and works with young black males I doubt that race was a factor.

Oh and here some news. Martin's mom said she thinks the whole thing was an accident and not murder.

Anybody can be racially biased, and you'd be surprised at the disdain blacks and hispanics have for each other in certain parts of this country. The Dallas area cops that I know including my brother in law indicate that a very large percentage of violent crimes in the area are between black and hispanic gangs.

That being said, what annoys me is that the media is trying SO hard to make the general population believe this was a white man shooting a black kid. Far fewer people would care (sadly enough) if Zimmerman were portrayed as hispanic.