Gotta Say, I don't love the new 42 look on Defense

[quickccc]

We saw the pats handle the rams perfectly running a 5-2 look in the SB. Why we didn't do the same thing after they ran roughshod on us in the same playoffs. We ran a 4-2 look all game then too. I swear coaching in the nfl is just bad.

Pats had a lot more physical front and smarter, more instinctive players. And you don't have to go to just the Pats either ..as a saints were able to
shut down Rams ground and screens as well in the NFC title game.

- IF Poe doesn't work out, we need a much more effective 1 tech starter and even a better backup too (Woods) ,Poe just simply did not show up
and i wonder if he was so gassed and out of shape, that could have limited him to such few snaps. i just did not like his energy.

- and simply we cannot have freakin' Crawford starting and getting a ton of snaps than what he did vs Rams. Dude got tossed all around the field !
But i guess i'll hear about his hip recovery is causing him poor play by the Crawford apologists...

- Hill has a ton to learn but he was active and showing up for tackles for losses. Gallimore is super green in terms of NFL trench wars, he's a back burner
at this very early point.

 

[AKATheRake]

We didn't look staunch against the run obviously as it looks like we game planned for more of a passing attack and fair well in that regard.

The defense was not what lost the game but because the Rams could hold onto the ball with an effective change of motion before the snap running game they won that time of possession battle.

We won the turnover battle but they hit our QB more and our 3rd down conversion was non existent and when y0u lose time of possession you better convert on your offensive possession or your done.

That's what's what lost us the game. They got to our QB who played solid yet unspectacular. But our offensive tempo was not there and that makes things predictable for a d-line and that's when offensive execution and timing break down in key moments. Like 3rd downs.

 

[Cebrin]

When the MLB goes out so quickly it gets ugly. I expect different looks this week.

Not to mention losing your starting 1T before the season even started.

 

[Typhus]

LVE wasn't all that good either before getting hurt, though.

The regression of our LBs has been puzzling.

Im with you,, seems that we spend a high draft pick on a player and most of the fan base believes problem solved.
Not so fast,, plenty of teams bust every year with 1st round picks,, not calling LVE a total bust just yet, but he is entering that realm of possibility.
Now the upside, if there is any, is that he broke his collarbone,,, has nothing to do with his surgically repaired neck, so if we look at this with some positive light, its two completely different injuries and collarbones heal.
The downside is that he has sustained significant injuries his first two seasons, so fingers crossed this is just a fluke, but we have all seen this pattern before.

 

[Cebrin]

We didn't look staunch against the run obviously as it looks like we game planned for more of a passing attack and fair well in that regard.

The defense was not what lost the game but because the Rams could hold onto the ball with an effective change of motion before the snap running game they won that time of possession battle.

We won the turnover battle but they hit our QB more and our 3rd down conversion was non existent and when y0u lose time of possession you better convert on your offensive possession or your done.

That's what's what lost us the game. They got to our QB who played solid yet unspectacular. But our offensive tempo was not there and that makes things predictable for a d-line and that's when offensive execution and timing break down in key moments. Like 3rd downs.

 

[Typhus]

We didn't look staunch against the run obviously as it looks like we game planned for more of a passing attack and fair well in that regard.

The defense was not what lost the game but because the Rams could hold onto the ball with an effective change of motion before the snap running game they won that time of possession battle.

We won the turnover battle but they hit our QB more and our 3rd down conversion was non existent and when y0u lose time of possession you better convert on your offensive possession or your done.

That's what's what lost us the game. They got to our QB who played solid yet unspectacular. But our offensive tempo was not there and that makes things predictable for a d-line and that's when offensive execution and timing break down in key moments. Like 3rd downs.

Indeed, and Aaron Donald is a one man wrecking crew, and the OL was and is in turmoil.
This teams signature calling card is no longer established, we drastically need a Williams, McGovern, to step up, if not this team fails this season, its really that simple.

 

[AKATheRake]

Indeed, and Aaron Donald is a one man wrecking crew, and the OL was and is in turmoil.
This teams signature calling card is no longer established, we drastically need a Williams, McGovern, to step up, if not this team fails this season, its really that simple.

Either of those guys stepping right up and getting nasty would be a real positive injection.

McCarthy was talking how young players end up starting near the end of the year as an NFL trend so I won't be surprised to see some of that throughout the team.

 

[glimmerman]

Not to mention losing your starting 1T before the season even started.

That hurt badly.

 

[Hennessy_King]

Pats had a lot more physical front and smarter, more instinctive players. And you don't have to go to just the Pats either ..as a saints were able to
shut down Rams ground and screens as well in the NFC title game.

- IF Poe doesn't work out, we need a much more effective 1 tech starter and even a better backup too (Woods) ,Poe just simply did not show up
and i wonder if he was so gassed and out of shape, that could have limited him to such few snaps. i just did not like his energy.

- and simply we cannot have freakin' Crawford starting and getting a ton of snaps than what he did vs Rams. Dude got tossed all around the field !
But i guess i'll hear about his hip recovery is causing him poor play by the Crawford apologists...

- Hill has a ton to learn but he was active and showing up for tackles for losses. Gallimore is super green in terms of NFL trench wars, he's a back burner
at this very early point.

Yeh Poe was bad. And crawford was being crawford. When woods and trysten hill are your best dts it's going to be a long season

 

[Jarntt]

As expected, Trysten Hill was no better than last year regardless of the BS we heard in camp. Him starting just shows how poorly prepared we were for McCoy's injury and it happened a month ago. I was a little surprised that Poe provided such little resistance. I know he isn't going to penetrate, but expected a little more lateral movement or at least clogging of his two gaps a little better. If a team runs like that against us we need to put Poe and Woods next to each other on early downs. Not ideal, but about the best we could do. Man do I wish we brought Snacks in this offseason or at least after McCoy went down. He penetrates and moves down the line and could play the 3 tech even though his best spot is obviously NT. Then on passing downs rotate the DEs and Crawford on the inside. Again, not ideal but it would help solve the immediate problem.

 

[Jarntt]

Not to mention losing your starting 1T before the season even started.

3, but yeah

 

[Bullflop]

Dontari Poe seems to be much worse off now than than he was in the distant past.
He gets pushed around like a shopping cart. LVE is too brittle to be a MLB.

 

[xwalker]

I absolutely hate what I saw on Sunday from this against the Rams. We really got pushed around, right up the middle against the Rams. I hate this 42 look we are running.

What are you talking about?

4-2-5 Nickel

That is standard vs 3 WR sets.

Rams led the league the past 2 season in 11 personnel.

 

[DEA_dad]

I absolutely hate what I saw on Sunday from this against the Rams. We really got pushed around, right up the middle against the Rams. I hate this 42 look we are running.

Go to golden pride, get a #9 and you’ll feel better

 

[Cebrin]

3, but yeah

Oops.

 

[ABQCOWBOY]

Second time in the past three years that the Rams offensive coaches outsmarted our defensive ones. The only difference I saw was that we actually adjusted. If the offense had been up to the task, the defense did its job in the second half.

I agree. Had a few breakdowns in the second half, most because of great individual plays by Rams players, but the game was there to be won. Play calling was actually not terrible from Moore, we just didn't execute the plays IMO.

You are right.

 

[GORICO]

I absolutely hate what I saw on Sunday from this against the Rams. We really got pushed around, right up the middle against the Rams. I hate this 42 look we are running.

cant disagree

 

[GORICO]

Which defensive system is best suited for Dallas based on personnel?

Is it best for them to run a 3-4 defense with in essence a 5-2 hybrid?

LDE D. Lawrence

NT D. Poe

RDE T. Crawford

OLB J. Smith

ILB J. Thomas

ILB E. Griffin

OLB A. Smith

Obviously I am not a defensive expert but just trying to figure out how Dallas can get the right players on the field in a defensive scheme to allow for some flex pass rushing without compromising run defense.

I guess I figured with the above defense it allows both Griffen and A. Smith to jump in on the DL to in essence form a 5-2 scheme.

US Army--- i like it man

 

[ABQCOWBOY]

when it came to being pushed around, and being constantly suckered and out-fooled, i thought it was first more the player personnel, than the 42 look scheme.
the one issue i had was this crazy DL rotation, with players jumping all around the DL on a play by play basis

- Poe was brought in to make a more physical presence but he was so ineffective the few snaps he did get,..and he was even taken out of the goal line
defense, with Crawford (who got bounced around all night) taking his place.
Hill actually ended up being the most effective and active DT. Woods contributed more as a lead FB than an effective DT

.- frankly only Hill on a few plays ( he had a tackle for a loss) was the only DT i thought was making his presence felt on a few plays, and it was DTs that were supposed to clear the traffic for the LBs
Rams ran for 136 yards and much was in the interior. We were supposed to have new lineup players that was supposed to change how we play defense.
Bring a more physical brawny style vs marinelli days. i didn't come close to seeing that vs Rams

and 42 " look or not, we have LBs that can be had vs screens,..misdirection kills them! . and we have LBs that run around blocks, he can't shed
and get thru blocks and he's a liability in coverage. Jaylon's poor LB play has nothing to do with his knee issues, he's just a limited player because
he has very questionable instincts, and simpy and no where near the hype he was made out to be as a top 10 overall defender in his 2016 draft class.

A lot of stuff to discuss in this post. I guess I would start with the idea that the personnel and not the 42 were the problem. I guess I feel like it's the same problem. The idea of the 42 with our LBs is unwise IMO for all the reasons you touch on. To play LB in a 42, you gotta have stud LBs. They have to both, be able to stick and move and they have to be able to get out in space and cover. Those guys have to be able to hang in and engage a Guard and still make a play on a back. Your LBs have to be very, very capable. To be honest, I really don't like the scheme because in todays game, I just feel like the passing game can easily take advantage of it on the edges, in the short passing game and a good running game can be effective as well. You just ask too much from your LBs. If you have LBs that good, then they are studs and that means you gotta pay them big time so that translates into a lot of cap. WE don't have LBs like that. We have athletic LBs who can move but we don't have LBs who can take on Guards and make plays. I never liked Smith coming out of ND, for specifically that reason. I had lots of discussions with my Son over this and I just felt like he was not the guy everybody thought he was. I don't like the 42.

Good observation on Hill. I was surprised at how well he can actually move. That guy could be a MLB if he was just a little bit smaller. I was disappointed in our interior defense, especially early, but we did a much better job as the game went on. We just weren't prepared.

 

[ABQCOWBOY]

What are you talking about?

4-2-5 Nickel

That is standard vs 3 WR sets.

Rams led the league the past 2 season in 11 personnel.

What is confusing here? I don't like how we looked in the 42 and I don't like the 42 to begin with. Just because most teams are using the 42 more and more for coverage doesn't mean we are good at it or that it's the best way for us to go. Good teams dictate, they don't follow along. I'm surprised you even asked the question you do here Walker.