Grade Lance's performance

[KingCorcoran]

How old is he Einstein? How much game experience does he have? Lol, Rush can not throw a football better than Lance. You need to turn in your scout card.

Lance only has to be better than Bo Mitchell and he’ll be a starting quarterback.

 

[glimmerman]

He started off doing good. But a bad throw to Rico hurt the chances of winning. Was an easy pass. You have to make those. But he didn’t exactly get a lot of playing time. If they would give him game experience he could improve. Still don’t understand why JJ wouldn’t let him play. Maybe trying to devalue him for a cheaper contract offer from SJ.

 

[thunderpimp91]

He started off doing good. But a bad throw to Rico hurt the chances of winning. Was an easy pass. You have to make those. But he didn’t exactly get a lot of playing time. If they would give him game experience he could improve. Still don’t understand why JJ wouldn’t let him play. Maybe trying to devalue him for a cheaper contract offer from SJ.

Yeah, Rush getting a little hot didnt help matters, but it seems clear that the main thing Lance needs is game reps. If they refuse to get the kid in games when the season is already lost it just makes it irresponsible to even trade for him in the first place. Of course it becomes more difficult with a HC on an expiring deal that probably felt he needed to win as much as possible even at the expense of player development. Bad situation all around created by Jerry.

 

[CowboysFaninHouston]

What was Aikman's record in his first 12 games?

The guy hasn't had much of a chance to put together any kind of body of work. He's had injuries. He hasn't been getting any meaningful reps in practice and he's never played with the starters. All I'm saying is give him a real chance before declaring he can't do it. How exactly is keeping him on the team in a backup capacity too big a risk?

Aikman played literally with players pulled off the street. almost none of those players on that team were on the cowboys 2 years after. please don't do Lance a disservice and compare him to AIkman.

this dude has had 4 years in the league, learning from the best coaches, being around best players, sitting in NFL game rooms and film studies and people want to give him meaningful reps. ok, lets say they do that, in year 4 of NFL. year 5 of NFL. what's his ceiling? to be a burrows? Allen? or is he a geno smith at best. I mean if he was really talented he would have been able to easily beat rush, whose wet spagetthi arm is one of the worst in the NFL. the coaches and the lovely GM had no confidence to let Rush walk and put Lance as his back up this year. minimally you expect a "talented" player to have that level of ability and he didn't show that.

he is what he is. a bust top 5 pick. NFL is riddled with those type of players.

 

[CowboysFaninHouston]

One thing I started thinking about today: we believe 1st round quarterbacks ahould be ready to play from day 1 and mid rounders should carry a clipbard and learn for a few years. Is that really true? Because it seems like the mid round success are ready to start from the beginning whil late career success stories are mainly about first round picks on their second or third team.. Lots of recent examples, espe ially this year.

often coaches, GMs and scouts fall in love with the physical abilities of a player, and think they can make him a player and teach him. after all as Al Davis use to say you can't teach speed, but I can take a fast player and make him WR...how many times has that failed. there is a lot of mental talent that goes into being an NFL football player. very subtle little things that they have to know instinctively. Lance doesn't seem to have those natural instincts and trying to learn them. he can throw hard. run a little, but that's good enough for college. not NFL.

 

[CowboysFaninHouston]

Yeah, Rush getting a little hot didnt help matters, but it seems clear that the main thing Lance needs is game reps. If they refuse to get the kid in games when the season is already lost it just makes it irresponsible to even trade for him in the first place. Of course it becomes more difficult with a HC on an expiring deal that probably felt he needed to win as much as possible even at the expense of player development. Bad situation all around created by Jerry.

I don't think Lance has instincts of a good NFL QB. those little things that come natural to most, including Rush. he is trying to "learn" those instincts and that's not a good thing for him.
he is not NFL QB talented.

 

[thunderpimp91]

I don't think Lance has instincts of a good NFL QB. those little things that come natural to most, including Rush. he is trying to "learn" those instincts and that's not a good thing for him.
he is not NFL QB talented.

I dont disagree with the bolded part, but how much of that is a complete lack of reps, even at the college level? He certainly seems to have the physical tools, but reps just seem needed. The little things like keeping your footwork as the pocket collapses is tough to get with modern day practices where its mostly a 3/4 speed game of touch football. Some instincts come natural, but a lot come from the failure of 300+ passes per year at lower levels and thousands of starter reps in practice.

Very fair to question if he can actually learn some of those instincts at the NFL level though....I cant think of an example of a QB this raw learning at the NFL level, nor can I think its reasonable to expect him to gain those instincts without actual game reps. Without a team that will actually commit to him for a full season I cant see how he actually develops at this point.

 

[CowboysFaninHouston]

I dont disagree with the bolded part, but how much of that is a complete lack of reps, even at the college level? He certainly seems to have the physical tools, but reps just seem needed. The little things like keeping your footwork as the pocket collapses is tough to get with modern day practices where its mostly a 3/4 speed game of touch football. Some instincts come natural, but a lot come from the failure of 300+ passes per year at lower levels and thousands of starter reps in practice.

Very fair to question if he can actually learn some of those instincts at the NFL level though....I cant think of an example of a QB this raw learning at the NFL level, nor can I think its reasonable to expect him to gain those instincts without actual game reps. Without a team that will actually commit to him for a full season I cant see how he actually develops at this point.

and that's the point, instincts get developed over time, through failures, learning etc. and it starts in high school. he didn't play a lot in highschool, then not a lot in college and worse yet he went to a small school, against lesser talented players where you physical ability will just get you ahead. so now 4 years in. not enough reps in highschool or college and NFL and we want to give him 1000s of reps to hopefully, perhaps maybe develop instincts. one season is not enough. it takes years.

I think the time for him has come and gone...in what way? that his ceiling is a lot lower. he will never be elite. he will never be great. he may have great moments and great games, but not consistent enough. and consitency is key. I mean Geno Smith played a lot more in college. was pretty good. happened to go in second round. and took him 7 year to break out into an slightly above average QB. same with Darnold, who was top first round. bounced around and is having a breakout season and surronded by great talent. great coaching. but no one will mistake Darnold for a great QB.

I think the Lance experiment is over, unless we are serious about backup position and just let Rush walk. we didn't have enough confidence to do that this year and that doesn't bode well for him.

 

[CowboysRule]

Aikman played literally with players pulled off the street. almost none of those players on that team were on the cowboys 2 years after. please don't do Lance a disservice and compare him to AIkman.

this dude has had 4 years in the league, learning from the best coaches, being around best players, sitting in NFL game rooms and film studies and people want to give him meaningful reps. ok, lets say they do that, in year 4 of NFL. year 5 of NFL. what's his ceiling? to be a burrows? Allen? or is he a geno smith at best. I mean if he was really talented he would have been able to easily beat rush, whose wet spagetthi arm is one of the worst in the NFL. the coaches and the lovely GM had no confidence to let Rush walk and put Lance as his back up this year. minimally you expect a "talented" player to have that level of ability and he didn't show that.

he is what he is. a bust top 5 pick. NFL is riddled with those type of players.

You don't know his ceiling or his floor. Maybe he is as good as someone like Burrow. Maybe he tops out as a Gardner Minshew. My whole point is that you just don't know at this point. Everyone wants to laud all the praise in the world on the 49ers. The team that gave up multiple firsts to move up and get him. Someone obviously saw something in him. And then he comes off the bench in the last game of the season, without having had meaningful snaps in years with actual NFL level talent (still missing our #1 WR), and plays...ok. With the difficulty some teams have finding a decent QB I'd at least give him a chance. I know it doesn't really matter at this point. Dak will be back next year and probably continue to play like Dak, which includes literally never coming out of a game except when pulled due to injury, and our backups can just sit and...get paid millions to stand around.

 

[CowboysFaninHouston]

You don't know his ceiling or his floor. Maybe he is as good as someone like Burrow. Maybe he tops out as a Gardner Minshew. My whole point is that you just don't know at this point. Everyone wants to laud all the praise in the world on the 49ers. The team that gave up multiple firsts to move up and get him. Someone obviously saw something in him. And then he comes off the bench in the last game of the season, without having had meaningful snaps in years with actual NFL level talent (still missing our #1 WR), and plays...ok. With the difficulty some teams have finding a decent QB I'd at least give him a chance. I know it doesn't really matter at this point. Dak will be back next year and probably continue to play like Dak, which includes literally never coming out of a game except when pulled due to injury, and our backups can just sit and...get paid millions to stand around.

well, you can pretty much then say this about any NFL player or college player....give them time to play and they "will" be good.

but there is evidence you look at and weight the possibility or probability. you know at this point, because you haven't been to practices, or film room or spent any time with him. you have a wishful thinking. a gamblers mentality. and 49ers made a mistake. realized it and then got what they could out of it. they walked away. he is not the first top 5 pick to fail in the NFL and become a bust, he won't be the last. so what did people see? he can scramble and run. he has a strong arm, and their egos told them we will make him a football player. his ceiling is not Burrows. that much is evident. hasn't come close. Burrows was good right off the bat, this kid is in year 4 in NFL and people are saying he needs a few more years.

so evidence to date says, he is nothing special. but if you are a gambler, wanting it all and betting on 0.000000000000000000012% chance he may become a burrows, then by all means push all your money to the middle.

if he was any good. had any potential. or any talent, then he would have supplanted Rush this year. the fact that after a year and a summer with the team, they just didn't trust him enough to even be the back up....and given his God given talent everyone keeps talking about couldn't beat a wet noodle arm Rush, should tell you all you need.

its the NFL. its become a QB driven league. so teams gamble. hoping to hit it. QBs get over drafted more than any other position. they get over paid more than any other position. and more QB busts happen than any other position. welcome to the NFL.

 

[sbark]

I don't think Lance has instincts of a good NFL QB. those little things that come natural to most, including Rush. he is trying to "learn" those instincts and that's not a good thing for him.
he is not NFL QB talented.

Does Dak?

His instincts seem to revert to panic, roll out slowly into a predictable sack

He started off doing good. But a bad throw to Rico hurt the chances of winning. Was an easy pass. You have to make those. But he didn’t exactly get a lot of playing time. If they would give him game experience he could improve. Still don’t understand why JJ wouldn’t let him play. Maybe trying to devalue him for a cheaper contract offer from SJ.

A post here...earlier in this thread i think
Stated, via Clarence Hill
Lance wouldve played earlier, but wouldnt sign offer given 3,4 weeks ago

Not sure of validity.

 

[charron]

Rush would have won that game. Lance is a jag, worth about 1 million a year as a backup.

 

[JayNovacek84]

The really good QB's have really good touch and accuracy, unfortunately he doesn't.

 

[CowboysFaninHouston]

Does Dak?

His instincts seem to revert to panic, roll out slowly into a predictable sack

A post here...earlier in this thread i think
Stated, via Clarence Hill
Lance wouldve played earlier, but wouldnt sign offer given 3,4 weeks ago

Not sure of validity.

what does this have to do with Dak? its a Lance discussion. the title literally says Lance's performance!!!!

but then again, here every discussion even the long snapper turns into a Dak argument...

is Lance the future? if you want another lesser Dak to support and others take the other side, then by all means, make him the future!!! because he is not a legit NFL QB that can get the job done. 4.5 speed or no 4.5 speed.

 

[goshann]

I don't think Lance has instincts of a good NFL QB. those little things that come natural to most, including Rush. he is trying to "learn" those instincts and that's not a good thing for him.
he is not NFL QB talented.

He also can't throw accurate passes to the sideline or ones that require touch.
That is the bigger issue and the reason the 49ers gave up on him.

 

[goshann]

The really good QB's have really good touch and accuracy, unfortunately he doesn't.

Agree. It's that simple. He isn't an NFL caliber passer.

 

[G2]

First, Jerry Jones is a complete imbecile to not give Lance more opportunities throughout the season. Ironically, by Rush NOT starting, Jerry doesn't have to honor extras financial incentives because of this last game. What a trash Owner/GM.
Secondly, Lance has potential, but needs the practice and game reps to get up to the NFL speed of the game. You're not going to get an accurate read on his abilities without playing time to develop.
Lastly, Jerry Jones is a trash Owner/GM.

 

[JustChip]

and that's the point, instincts get developed over time, through failures, learning etc. and it starts in high school. he didn't play a lot in highschool, then not a lot in college and worse yet he went to a small school, against lesser talented players where you physical ability will just get you ahead. so now 4 years in. not enough reps in highschool or college and NFL and we want to give him 1000s of reps to hopefully, perhaps maybe develop instincts. one season is not enough. it takes years.

I think the time for him has come and gone...in what way? that his ceiling is a lot lower. he will never be elite. he will never be great. he may have great moments and great games, but not consistent enough. and consitency is key. I mean Geno Smith played a lot more in college. was pretty good. happened to go in second round. and took him 7 year to break out into an slightly above average QB. same with Darnold, who was top first round. bounced around and is having a breakout season and surronded by great talent. great coaching. but no one will mistake Darnold for a great QB.

I think the Lance experiment is over, unless we are serious about backup position and just let Rush walk. we didn't have enough confidence to do that this year and that doesn't bode well for him.

I would think it would be wise for him to play in the UFL this spring if he can get a deal. I wonder if an NFL can sign him to a contract and then “assign” or “lease” him to a UFL team.

 

[CowboysFaninHouston]

I would think it would be wise for him to play in the UFL this spring if he can get a deal. I wonder if an NFL can sign him to a contract and then “assign” or “lease” him to a UFL team.

exactly. he needs playing time away from pressures of NFL and specially with his high draft status...so go get playing time

 

[DuncanIso]

He started off doing good. But a bad throw to Rico hurt the chances of winning. Was an easy pass. You have to make those. But he didn’t exactly get a lot of playing time. If they would give him game experience he could improve. Still don’t understand why JJ wouldn’t let him play. Maybe trying to devalue him for a cheaper contract offer from SJ.

It was a busted play. He should have been sacked.

Also, Rico and Lance not on the same page. Not surprised, due to the lack of starting time for Lance.

Was Lance expecting Rico to cut towards the pylon?