Great Contract Commanders LOL

[StanleySpadowski]

maybe in hindsight, but you have to remember that bailey is playing better now than he ever did in DC. he would make a nice play, then give up a huge one. rocket ismail, anyone?

that, and you have to consider that at the time, bailey wanted out. portis is very good, when healthy, and if champ was still the inconsistent DB he was in DC and his first year in denver when he was getting torched, i would like the deal. i think denvers line has helped him tremendously.

Bailey's not playing better now than he did in DC, you just don't often see the number of times he's been burned on the highlights like you see his better plays.

And Denver's line is worse talent wise than Washington's. Manned by a bunch of Cleveland castoffs.

 

[dbair1967]

http://i32.***BLOCKED***/albums/d2/superpunk2884/disappointcopy.jpg

that sig is hilarious

David

 

[StanleySpadowski]

Ouch.

That's going to leave a mark.

At least that's better than what they gave up for Lloyd and Duckett. What was it, two thirds and two fourths (at a minimum) and an insane extension for 0 TDs.

 

[dbair1967]

I can hardly wait till March 2007 to see who Commander 1 brings to town


David

 

[wileedog]

At least that's better than what they gave up for Lloyd and Duckett. What was it, two thirds and two fourths (at a minimum) and an insane extension for 0 TDs.

Lloyd was bad enough, but you can almost understand somebody falling in love with his highlight reel and ignoring all his warts. It happens to lots of teams and lots of players every offseason (although the extension was beyond ridiculous).

But the Duckett trade, even if you are (rightly) worried about Portis' health, still boggles my mind. A 3rd and a 4th for a guy who is going to be a FA at the end of the season, and you park him on the bench even when Portis doesn't play?

 

[AbeBeta]

I wouldn't have traded Champ Bailey to acquire a RB, so that's a push in my mind. They could have easily focused on the Draft to find a RB and kept Bailey. I would never have done that move.

Then again, I'd have hung on to Stephen Davis every day and twice on game days over Trung Canidate. Sorry Trung, you're my friend and all, but come on.

Some stuff right -- I'm not defending them -- just saying that they have made moves that came out well.

You are right that the Portis move was questionable -- I recall that they also gave up a pick in the move. But my point is that all of their moves don't turn to crap. I think we can say that Moss cost a pick as well as they used a pick in the signing of Coles (he was RFA). But still, both are very good players.

They clearly don't have a great scouting department -- so all the trades of picks makes some sense. Use the pick to get an established player. Of course, that logic simply doesn't work in the NFL but I like watching them try.

 

[Hostile]

It pre-dates Gibbs return, but it actually dates back to the George Allen era and went through Gibbs' first stint (they had something like an 8 year span without a first round pick).

Allen and Gibbs believed that you build your team through FA over the draft. When the salary cap came into fruition, they continued to use FA as a vehicle to build their rosters. But the advent of the salary cap makes it so that building through the draft and supplementing your roster with FA's is the best way to go.

I fully believe that Archuleta was Gregg Williams' guy and Gibbs had no problem with that and dearly wanted him and was willing to pay him outrageous $$$ to get him.



YAKUZA

That post was a clinic about why their strategy (which worked in the Allen & Gibbs/Beathard days) is a recipe for failure in today's NFL. I have been trying to explain that to Skins fans for 4 years. No luck.

 

[dbair1967]

You are right that the Portis move was questionable -- I recall that they also gave up a pick in the move. .

it was a 2nd

David

 

[AbeBeta]

But the Duckett trade, even if you are (rightly) worried about Portis' health, still boggles my mind. A 3rd and a 4th for a guy who is going to be a FA at the end of the season, and you park him on the bench even when Portis doesn't play?

Anyone have a rundown of that trade -- it is more compicated than a 3 and 4 -- I think that it goes something like either they flip firsts or get a 3 and a 4.

Here is how I understood the deal -- but I'm not sure this is correct.

I think this is based on the draft value board -- a 3rd and 4th usually yields about 300 points. If the distance between the team's first rounders exceeded that value then I think the Broncos got to flip. Of course, the Broncos and Skins are going to be about 20 picks apart by the end of the year -- so if Denver does have the flip option they will have scored big time.

 

[BrAinPaiNt]

maybe in hindsight, but you have to remember that bailey is playing better now than he ever did in DC. he would make a nice play, then give up a huge one. rocket ismail, anyone?

that, and you have to consider that at the time, bailey wanted out. portis is very good, when healthy, and if champ was still the inconsistent DB he was in DC and his first year in denver when he was getting torched, i would like the deal. i think denvers line has helped him tremendously.

I don't think he is playing any better now than he was at Washington.

He had games where he is good and there are times when he gets burned.

The important part that you brought up, that most seem to forget here, is that Bailey wanted OUT.

They offered him a good contract, IMO it was not a short changed contract, but he wanted out.

So in that regard they were smart to trade him.

Now some could argue that they should have forced him to play but than they get nothing for him in return the following season.

So they had someone that did NOT want to be there and they traded to get a player that did want to be there and whether people like Portis or not he is a very good running back.

The problem as I see it was that they actually overpaid in the trade.

In other words a Top 5 CB is normally worth more in a trade than a Top 5 RB.

It is much easier to find a good starting RB than it is to find a good starting DB.

But instead of it being a situation where they had the harder position to find so they should have had the upper hand, the screwed the pooch (even if denver knew bailey did not want to be in washington) and ALSO sent a pick to Denver in the trade.

Value wise the CB should have been worth more than the RB...however the skins gave the player AND the pick for the RB.

That was just not smart on their end and no matter how anyone defends it they got bad trade value in that regard.

 

[HTownCowboysFan]

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2006/11/19/AR2006111901214.html




The Commanders gave Archuleta a $5 million signing bonus, and have a $5 million option bonus on his contract due in March, according to sources with knowledge of the deal. However, should the team not exercise that option in March, Archuleta's base salaries over the next three seasons would escalate and become guaranteed, with that total equaling $5 million as well. If they cut him after the season, besides owing the guaranteed money, the Commanders would take a $9 million salary cap hit in total, a sum that could be spread over two seasons -- with about $7 million due in 2008 -- depending on the timing of his release.

And people here go off the deep end when we don't go a a FA spending spree every year. This is proof that doing just that leads to the ruination of your team.

 

[AbeBeta]

And people here go off the deep end when we don't go a a FA spending spree every year. This is proof that doing just that leads to the ruination of your team.

It is more about how you do it -- the big name guys are going to kill you if they don't pan out. This off-season, we focused more on (aside from TO & Vanderjagt), solid lower priced guys. Ayodele and Kosier being good pickups. Hannam and Boiman being a waste of $$. If you bat .500 with high priced guys you get hurt not so with the cheaper guys.

 

[Hostile]

It is more about how you do it -- the big name guys are going to kill you if they don't pan out. This off-season, we focused more on (aside from TO & Vanderjagt), solid lower priced guys. Ayodele and Kosier being good pickups. Hannam and Boiman being a waste of $$. If you bat .500 with high priced guys you get hurt not so with the cheaper guys.

That's the model the Patriots were using. The difference seems to be that we try to hang on to our impact guys like Roy, Witten, Bradie, etc. While they've been letting their guys walk, like Branch, Milloy, etc.

 

[AbeBeta]

That's the model the Patriots were using. The difference seems to be that we try to hang on to our impact guys like Roy, Witten, Bradie, etc. While they've been letting their guys walk, like Branch, Milloy, etc.

That is a difference in ownership. Bill and Beli are cut from the same mold -- You wanna hold out? Screw you. You don't want to redo your deal? Screw you too.

Kraft goes along with that - Jerry though is more inclined to take care of guys before it gets to that stage. Of course he is also inclined to let loyalty lock the team into long-term deals with guys on the backside of their careers.

 

[CATCH17]

What do the Commanders lose in the Duckett trade?

Do they have a 1st round pick this year?

 

[Hostile]

What do the Commanders lose in the Duckett trade?

Do they have a 1st round pick this year?

Yes, they do.

They lose their 3rd in 2007, and 4th in 2008.

 

[AbeBeta]

Yes, they do.

They lose their 3rd in 2007, and 4th in 2008.

Is there a provision in that deal about flipping picks?

 

[Yakuza Rich]

That post was a clinic about why their strategy (which worked in the Allen & Gibbs/Beathard days) is a recipe for failure in today's NFL. I have been trying to explain that to Skins fans for 4 years. No luck.

One thing I mentioned before the season started was that I researched and found that of the last 20 teams that *went* to the Super Bowl, they roughly averaged 14-15 starters that the team originally drafted or signed as an undrafted free agent. The Skins were starting off the season with 7 starters that fit that category. Assuming that Campbell and McIntosh are the starters next season, they would still only have 9 starters that fit that category.

Without sounding too biased, I like the way Jerry and Parcells have attempted to go about building the roster in recent years, building mainly through the draft, using FA to supplement the roster and occasionally go after a high profile FA here and there without breaking the bank or completely relying on the player to win football games for your team.

For me, I think the Eagles are too cheap for my tastes and to pull off what the Steelers and the Patriots do in terms of roster developmental is likely to be more successful than what Washington does....but still very difficult to pull off the same type of success they have had.



YAKUZA

 

[Yakuza Rich]

Is there a provision in that deal about flipping picks?

There's a provision about the first round picks between them and Denver. It's kind of funky, but in layman's terms....from what I've been told is that if they are top 5 draft pick team based on their record and the Broncos go to the playoffs, their draft order would remain that way.

But let's say Washington finishes 8th in draft order and the Broncos make the playoffs, they would then switch first rounders.

Essentially, we would just like to see the Skins win just enough games to finish outside the top 5 of the draft.



YAKUZA

 

[AbeBeta]

Essentially, we would just like to see the Skins win just enough games to finish outside the top 5 of the draft.

YAKUZA

with 4 home games left, two against NFC east teams, I'd expect them to be able to get to 5 wins or so.