Great trade, great pick in Travis Fredrick

[Cowboys22]

What are you talking about. Even the kid himself said he was a 2nd rounder. I already posted links in another thread from multiple sites that had him 2nd to 3rd rounder and one in the 4th. The National Football Post had him the 71st rated player. I'm not ripping the kid just to hate on the pick. This is the reality. We got caught with our pants down. If you read any of my other posts coming into the draft, I was fine with basically any of the situations at 18. Only getting a 3rd to move down 13 spots and then taking a guy rated lower, when you can get similar talent with the 47th isn't smart. People need to go look at mocks, what players are left today, etc and realize what was out there and how the draft was falling before just taking the team stance.

Look at this mock and the talent and the guys going. I'm just pulling stuff off Twitter alone.

http://www.rotoworld.com/articles/nfl/43149/60/second-day-mock-draft?pg=1

top 20 available

http://www.rotoworld.com/articles/cfb/43153/325/top-20-best-available

As for his grades besides Mayock...4th Round here

http://bleacherreport.com/articles/...board-2013-matt-millers-final-rankings/page/2

Here is the one includes with Mayocks...not glowing

http://www.nfl.com/draft/2013/profiles/travis-frederick?id=2540161

http://www.nfldraftgeek.com/travisfrederick.html

2nd or 3rd Round. #2 Center

http://www.nationalfootballpost.com/college_player_scouting_report.html&player=41697

#1 OC but 71st Overall

Seriously start looking around the NFL landscape. EVERY one of these publications, even the ones with better grades had a slow guy who couldn't get to the 2nd level. Again, there is a difference between not liking a guy and not liking where we picked him. I like the guy, I don't like how they went about getting him because you could do more in this draft.

Prisco mocked him at 24 and footballs future has him at 40 on their top 50 board. You can always come up with scenarios you deem would be better, but then you don't have to face the fire and make the decision. They had him ranked there and didn't want to risk losing him. They liked the value of 31+74 more than anyone available at 18. They may end up being dead wrong but as of now, you and everyone else have no clue whether it was a good move and a good pick. Only the next few years will tell us that so stop acting as if you are the end all be all of draft move evaluations. If he solidifies the middle of our OL which is what almost everyone has been calling for, then it was a great pick.

 

[TheSkaven]

Just can't see it...this laughable to me!!!

We missed the opportunity to Sharrif Floyd. We're going to regret that decision for the next 10 years, I fear.

 

[Cowboys22]

He looks pretty good as long as you dont run sweeps lol. I just thought C was the least one we needed fixed on the oline. Besides rt of course.

They know they have good options at RT after the draft. There are no FA centers that would have the same impact. They may yet draft an OT as well.

 

[DanTanna]

Hopefully it is "Good bye" to the days of Tony and Demarco getting blown up in the backfield one second after the plays starts. I don't like those plays. TF may eliminate some or all of those. So I'm liking this pick more and more.

 

[SMCowboy]

What are you talking about. Even the kid himself said he was a 2nd rounder.

He said he thought he would go in round 2, and we drafted him a whole two picks before round 2, on my gosh, I can't believe we reached an entire 2 picks. If you listen to his interview, he felt he was a 2nd round DP, be he sure sounds like he thought he would have been gone before #47. Because he said he also knew Dallas liked him alot. He even said he thought he would go in the early second round. With the chance of slipping into the late first round.

I already posted links in another thread from multiple sites that had him 2nd to 3rd rounder and one in the 4th. The National Football Post had him the 71st rated player.

And all these posts had Sharrif Floyd as a top 5 pick. Guess what, the opinion of online "draft experts" mean nothing.

I'm not ripping the kid just to hate on the pick. This is the reality. We got caught with our pants down. If you read any of my other posts coming into the draft, I was fine with basically any of the situations at 18. Only getting a 3rd to move down 13 spots and then taking a guy rated lower, when you can get similar talent with the 47th isn't smart. People need to go look at mocks, what players are left today, etc and realize what was out there and how the draft was falling before just taking the team stance.

Look at this mock and the talent and the guys going. I'm just pulling stuff off Twitter alone.

http://www.rotoworld.com/articles/nfl/43149/60/second-day-mock-draft?pg=1

top 20 available

http://www.rotoworld.com/articles/cfb/43153/325/top-20-best-available

As for his grades besides Mayock...4th Round here

http://bleacherreport.com/articles/...board-2013-matt-millers-final-rankings/page/2

Here is the one includes with Mayocks...not glowing

http://www.nfl.com/draft/2013/profiles/travis-frederick?id=2540161

http://www.nfldraftgeek.com/travisfrederick.html

2nd or 3rd Round. #2 Center

http://www.nationalfootballpost.com/college_player_scouting_report.html&player=41697

#1 OC but 71st Overall

Seriously start looking around the NFL landscape. EVERY one of these publications, even the ones with better grades had a slow guy who couldn't get to the 2nd level. Again, there is a difference between not liking a guy and not liking where we picked him. I like the guy, I don't like how they went about getting him because you could do more in this draft.

Yeah, lets use guys that said Sharrif Floyd was by far the best DT in the draft, and a sure top 5 pick as an example of who we should pick. They obviously have a really good grasp on what players will be available when... Oh wait, they sure missed on this draft. How many had EJ Manual going in the first round, oh yeah NONE. How many had Sharrif Floyd lasting to #24, oh yeah once again NONE. How many had Geno Smith falling to the 2nd round, on yeah NONE of them. How many had Kyle Long going in the mid 1st round, once again NONE of them....

 

[Miller]

He said he thought he would go in round 2, and we drafted him a whole two picks before round 2, on my gosh, I can't believe we reached an entire 2 picks. If you listen to his interview, he felt he was a 2nd round DP, be he sure sounds like he thought he would have been gone before #47. Because he said he also knew Dallas liked him alot. He even said he thought he would go in the early second round. With the chance of slipping into the late first round.



And all these posts had Sharrif Floyd as a top 5 pick. Guess what, the opinion of online "draft experts" mean nothing.



Yeah, lets use guys that said Sharrif Floyd was by far the best DT in the draft, and a sure top 5 pick as an example of who we should pick. They obviously have a really good grasp on what players will be available when... Oh wait, they sure missed on this draft. How many had EJ Manual going in the first round, oh yeah NONE. How many had Sharrif Floyd lasting to #24, oh yeah once again NONE. How many had Geno Smith falling to the 2nd round, on yeah NONE of them. How many had Kyle Long going in the mid 1st round, once again NONE of them....

You're telling me to stop speculating but your already saying Floyd isn't a top D-line guy. You don't know that. Funny we could have had him at 18 though and STILL have gotten a similarly rated guy at 47 compared to what we just got. Strange! You are confusing people taking people in the 1st who drop in the first but could be first grade talent and dropping from 18 to 31 and then taking a guy who was VASTLY seen at 2nd or 3rd grade talent. How is that the same?

Prisco mocked him at 24 and footballs future has him at 40 on their top 50 board. You can always come up with scenarios you deem would be better, but then you don't have to face the fire and make the decision. They had him ranked there and didn't want to risk losing him. They liked the value of 31+74 more than anyone available at 18. They may end up being dead wrong but as of now, you and everyone else have no clue whether it was a good move and a good pick. Only the next few years will tell us that so stop acting as if you are the end all be all of draft move evaluations. If he solidifies the middle of our OL which is what almost everyone has been calling for, then it was a great pick.

I'm not. I'm systematically looking at all data and saying that we could have had Floyd AND a guy who was rated just as highly at 47. That simple and pretty much fact if you go on draft grades and what was available. I never said I don't like this guy on our team, its a matter of how you work the draft and the Cowboys got suckered. We need a strong pick with that 3rd.

 

[JohnnyHopkins]

Hopefully it is "Good bye" to the days of Tony and Demarco getting blown up in the backfield one second after the plays starts. I don't like those plays. TF may eliminate some or all of those. So I'm liking this pick more and more.

Personally, I think they need to grab one more guard in the third (Winters or Quisenberry). If they can do that and grab one of the FA Right Tackles "post-draft", then that would be one heck of a turn-around on the weakest spot on last year's team.

 

[Cowboys22]

You're telling me to stop speculating but your already saying Floyd isn't a top D-line guy. You don't know that. Funny we could have had him at 18 though and STILL have gotten a similarly rated guy at 47 compared to what we just got. Strange! You are confusing people taking people in the 1st who drop in the first but could be first grade talent and dropping from 18 to 31 and then taking a guy who was VASTLY seen at 2nd or 3rd grade talent. How is that the same?



I'm not. I'm systematically looking at all data and saying that we could have had Floyd AND a guy who was rated just as highly at 47. That simple and pretty much fact if you go on draft grades and what was available. I never said I don't like this guy on our team, its a matter of how you work the draft and the Cowboys got suckered. We need a strong pick with that 3rd.

Its being reported that Dallas had Frederick rated at #22 on their board so I think it's safe to say they could not have drafted a player they had rated as high as Frederick at 47. All these internet rankings are meaningless. What matter is where a player is on their board. He was at the top of their board when they were on the clock, they didn't think he would still be there at 47, and they didn't want to have to trade way a pick to move up for him. Thus, they made the pick. Its that simple. I guess if you ran things, you would just fire all the scouts, give the coaches draft day off, and simply scour the internet for consensus player ranking when you were on the clock. Thats how you apparently think they should make their picks because you seem to put way more value on non-scout internet rankings than you do on the board put together by the people Jerry employs to identify the players that they think best fit what they are trying to do.

 

[SMCowboy]

You're telling me to stop speculating but your already saying Floyd isn't a top D-line guy. You don't know that. Funny we could have had him at 18 though and STILL have gotten a similarly rated guy at 47 compared to what we just got. Strange! You are confusing people taking people in the 1st who drop in the first but could be first grade talent and dropping from 18 to 31 and then taking a guy who was VASTLY seen at 2nd or 3rd grade talent. How is that the same?

I am not saying that Floyd will not be a great player. I have never seen him play, I have no idea how good he will end up being. All, I am saying that pretty much every, if not every NFL team did not view Floyd was a Top 5 quality player in this draft. If they did, he would not have lasted till #24. Your whole argument is based on value, and how we could have gotten similarly rated guys at #47. But you are using mock draft sites that missed and missed badly on how the NFL teams actually rated guys to make those assumptions.

I'm not. I'm systematically looking at all data and saying that we could have had Floyd AND a guy who was rated just as highly at 47. That simple and pretty much fact if you go on draft grades and what was available. I never said I don't like this guy on our team, its a matter of how you work the draft and the Cowboys got suckered. We need a strong pick with that 3rd.

We could have had a guy who was rated just as highly at Fredrick at #47 according to whom? If you listened to the Draft Press Conference, when we traded out of #18, we had two OL we had rated as value at #31 and both had the exact same grade in our book. When we got to #31, one of them was gone, and Fredrick was the only one left. So the chances of getting someone similarly rated on our draft board at #47 as at #31 would pretty much require Travis Fredrick making it to #47.

And if you listen to the whole conference Call with him, he thought he would go in the early second round, with a chance of slipping into the late first round. While I am not saying that because he felt he was an early second round pick, means that had we not drafted him, he absolutely would have gone in the early second round. But, I am saying given that he actually talked with several teams, and visited several teams, and knows what teams where giving him the most attention, he has a much better idea than Mike Mayock, or any of the other online "draft experts" of where he most likely would have been drafted than they do.

 

[SMCowboy]

Its being reported that Dallas had Frederick rated at #22 on their board so I think it's safe to say they could not have drafted a player they had rated as high as Frederick at 47. All these internet rankings are meaningless. What matter is where a player is on their board. He was at the top of their board when they were on the clock, they didn't think he would still be there at 47, and they didn't want to have to trade way a pick to move up for him. Thus, they made the pick. Its that simple. I guess if you ran things, you would just fire all the scouts, give the coaches draft day off, and simply scour the internet for consensus player ranking when you were on the clock. Thats how you apparently think they should make their picks because you seem to put way more value on non-scout internet rankings than you do on the board put together by the people Jerry employs to identify the players that they think best fit what they are trying to do.

Could not have put it better myself.

There are to many idiots on this board, that treat mock drafts as gospel on where a guys value is. And almost none of these guys are scouts or even ex scouts. At best they are want to be draft experts. These same experts said that Sharrif Floyd was a VALUE pick at #3.

One more thing I will add to your post. If you listen to the Draft Press Conference, we had two interior OL as being value picks when we traded to #31. One was Fredrick, and the other was taken after we drafted, so if I had to guess it was Kyle Long (who BTW went at #20) and they had the exact same grade on our chart.

 

[Miller]

Could not have put it better myself.

There are to many idiots on this board, that treat mock drafts as gospel on where a guys value is. And almost none of these guys are scouts or even ex scouts. At best they are want to be draft experts. These same experts said that Sharrif Floyd was a VALUE pick at #3.

One more thing I will add to your post. If you listen to the Draft Press Conference, we had two interior OL as being value picks when we traded to #31. One was Fredrick, and the other was taken after we drafted, so if I had to guess it was Kyle Long (who BTW went at #20) and they had the exact same grade on our chart.

You should probably calm on the name calling. Secondly, that is OUR board...you know the team with a horrible draft history and who has been sitting at .500. I don't rely on mocks. I try to use them, the scouting grades and everything else available to see where a player might fall. Then you try and figure out the difference between keeping a pick or moving down and where you get value. I like what Seattle has done the last couple of years because they don't listen to the experts. But they were picking 1st round talent higher in the 1st round than some people had their guys ranked. We are talking about taking a guy who was a 2nd to 3rd round grade as our 1st rounder. I don't care what we had him ranked. You have to look where he might fall. As I said, if Floyd was value at 3 by guys wouldn't he be a steal at 18 and THEN we still can get O-line or safety at 47?

 

[DenCWBY]

Prisco mocked him at 24 and footballs future has him at 40 on their top 50 board. You can always come up with scenarios you deem would be better, but then you don't have to face the fire and make the decision. They had him ranked there and didn't want to risk losing him. They liked the value of 31+74 more than anyone available at 18. They may end up being dead wrong but as of now, you and everyone else have no clue whether it was a good move and a good pick. Only the next few years will tell us that so stop acting as if you are the end all be all of draft move evaluations. If he solidifies the middle of our OL which is what almost everyone has been calling for, then it was a great pick.

Dude, think with your head, not your heart.
Everyone can find a board to fit their arguement but these guys (JJ and CO) are paid to prepare to make these decisions in "the heat of the moment" and they apparently slipped where as the rams/vikings/pats apparently didn't. It's all over the radio (Mike and Mike, DP)and TV (MCshey, Mayok) and most "football people" are questioning the pick calling it a "reach".
We're all speculating on the information that is given to us and certainly have the right to voice our pleasure or displeasure on our picks. Move on.

 

[DFWJC]

Its being reported that Dallas had Frederick rated at #22 on their board so I think it's safe to say they could not have drafted a player they had rated as high as Frederick at 47. All these internet rankings are meaningless. What matter is where a player is on their board. He was at the top of their board when they were on the clock, they didn't think he would still be there at 47, and they didn't want to have to trade way a pick to move up for him. Thus, they made the pick. Its that simple. I guess if you ran things, you would just fire all the scouts, give the coaches draft day off, and simply scour the internet for consensus player ranking when you were on the clock. Thats how you apparently think they should make their picks because you seem to put way more value on non-scout internet rankings than you do on the board put together by the people Jerry employs to identify the players that they think best fit what they are trying to do.

It has also been reported that

• Dallas had Floyd as 7th overall (but one said "top 15")
• They had Frederick as a 2nd round grade grouped with about 20 other players. Could have been 22nd or 42nd and the grade would have been almost identical.
• They only had 16-19 graded as 1st rounders.

Hey, if this guy starts for a decade and Dallas picks up a player with that 74th pick, things could be much worse.

I know one thing, Romo feels at least a little better today.

I think most analysts are calling this a reach--some more than others. But very few are saying tis is a bust pick or a disaster. The understand how horrendous the interior of Dallas oline was.

 

[Miller]

It has also been reported that

• Dallas had Floyd as 7th overall (but one said "top 15")
• They had Frederick as a 2nd round grade grouped with about 20 other players.
• They only had 16-19 graded as 1st rounders.

Hey, if this guy starts for a decade and Dallas picks up a player with that 74th pick, things could be much worse.

I know one thing, Romo feels at least a little better today.

THANK YOU!As I said, even if the scouts missed at Floyd being Top 5, him being 18 is a steal. Then you still have your group of 2nd round graded guys...O-line, safety, etc. Same as I said above. I like tough guys like Frederick, just not sure we couldn't have gotten more with 18 and 47.

 

[CowboysFaninHouston]

If that's the way you want to spin it.....

I was positive yesterday. I was fine with the O-linemen. I was fine with the D-linemen. I even liked Vacarro while everyone else ripped him. But getting a 3rd to move down 13 spots isn't getting the proper value. It just isn't and that is fact. The easiest way to explain that, even if you take the points system away is the the worst teams draft 1st and the best teams draft last. We are neither but drafted with the best teams at the bottom and got a guy that most had in the 3rd, some the 2nd and some in the 4th. The run in the 2nd round will be on WR, S, RB and LB. The 3rd we got needs to pan out. The reality of watching the draft last night and seeing the reactions was we got caught with our pants down. Plain and simple. When lesser known linemen went after the trade down they knew they were screwed. So they reached for need instead of taking talent that was there or trying to again trade back...they might have tried. I just refuse to spin this. I'm not a hater. I've been positive about talent being deep in this draft. I'm not positive when we reach big time for a guy that probably would have been there.

ok, for couple of years every one is ready to throw costa to the curb. they want him cut and replaced with dead bodies, who some claimed were better. they wanted to trade costa and give up draft picks some joked. now we draft a center for an ailing line and everyone complains....yet again!!!

 

[RSM94]

New OL: Smith, Livings, Costa, Frederick, Parnell/Draft Pick.......

 

[Miller]

ok, for couple of years every one is ready to throw costa to the curb. they want him cut and replaced with dead bodies, who some claimed were better. they wanted to trade costa and give up draft picks some joked. now we draft a center for an ailing line and everyone complains....yet again!!!

Not complaining about the guy. My thoughts yesterday on here pre-draft were O-line, D-line and then Safety. I think we could have addressed D-line at 18 and then still have taken O-line or Safety at 47, that is all.

 

[Pappa Cheeto]

If the Cowboys stayed true to their board, what is there to complain about? What's the point of having a scouting department if rather then relying on their opinions, we draft who the talking heads tell us we should draft? I'll take our scouts who are scouting for our team and system over Mayock and Kiper any day of the week.

 

[Miller]

If the Cowboys stayed true to their board, what is there to complain about? What's the point of having a scouting department if rather then relying on their opinions, we draft who the talking heads tell us we should draft? I'll take our scouts who are scouting for our team and system over Mayock and Kiper any day of the week.

Well there is many reasons for concern. We haven't exactly nailed many drafts the last decade and in fact have been pretty bad. Thus we are .500 a lot. So why just TRUST their board..or even trust that the info about their board is correct. I also heard from the radio and other posters today that he was rated a 2nd rounder with 20 other guys.

 

[Bleu Star]

He looks pretty good as long as you dont run sweeps lol. I just thought C was the least one we needed fixed on the oline. Besides rt of course.

Wrong. We're drafting the guy to most likely fit into a Guard slot.... Where he will dominate... A weak side guard does not have far to reach in a sweep. Watch some film. He will do just fine with the Cowboys.

We'll draft a Center today. I can feel it in my bones.