Greg Ellis, a T.O. apologist? Is this why it's time to move on?

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Chocolate Lab;2785832 said:


Did I sugar coat it? :)

Thanks, Chocolate Lab.

Another thing:


Anthony Henry got torched on that 52 yard TD, too (a 12 yard curl). He was giving a huge cushion, because he was scared of getting beat on the post route. He missed the tackle on that play and looked terrible, too. Amonte Toomer hung 4-80-2 TDs on Henry in that playoff game. I was callling for him to get the boot, too.

He wasn't a malcontent, but he was overrated by some in the fanbase. He was a good player, but he wasn't even close to being worth what he was paid.

Henry should have been benched after Mike Jenkins' play in the Tampa Bay and New York Giants game, but Philips yanked him. Jenkins held Plaxico Buress to 3-34-0 while covering him all over the field. Before that, Anthony Henry was getting roasted on post routes for TDs, getting leaped over by Larry Fitzgerald, ect...

There is nothing like seeing Anthony Henry and Roy Williams point at each other.

Overrated players like Ellis and Henry block younger, more talented players like Anthony Spencer and Mike Jenkins if the coach allows them to do so.

There was no reason not to start Mike Jenkins when Terence Newman came back.

Would any other team in the NFL do that?

I applaud the Cowboys for getting this thing right. It may be a year late, but better late, than never.

Again, the overrated players or malcontents, or both are getting their butts kicked out the door.

I'm loving it.
 

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Hostile;2785857 said:
Barely registers? It's 19 minutes old for crying out loud.

Nice post 41gy#. Really nice post.


Thank you, Hostile.

I'm looking forward to seeing this young team on the field, because I like this team. Jerry Jones and Stephen Jones are making the right moves.
 

Alexander

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Hostile;2785857 said:
Barely registers? It's 19 minutes old for crying out loud.

Nice post 41gy#. Really nice post.

19 minutes a year ago would have met with 19 posts and ten times the number of smilies.
 

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Alexander;2785881 said:
19 minutes a year ago would have met with 19 posts and ten times the number of smilies.
A year ago we had hope. This year we still don't know what we've got.
 

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Alexander;2785851 said:
A year ago, this post would have been met with a board beatdown.

Now, it barely registers.

Amazing what the truth can do and how people behave when they finally get it.


Thanks, Alexander.
 

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41gy#;2785878 said:
Thank you, Hostile.

I'm looking forward to seeing this young team on the field, because I like this team. Jerry Jones and Stephen Jones are making the right moves.
Did you bother making quotes from everyone on the team, including coaches and FO folks?

Until then, you sort of wasted your time, "no disrespect". My point is, most players have concerns and lots of players have issues with contracts, playing roles, etc... Problem is, if you're a nobody, the media doesn't care.

If I were in that locker room, I could give you plenty to write about. Don't think it's just Ellis, or you're living in wonderland.
 

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41gy#;2785878 said:
Thank you, Hostile.

.
BTW, your guy #41 has said some of the same things your boy Ellis has said, probably more hot opinions last year, I guess having talent makes you untouchable (unless you're TO) respectfully.
 

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Judas;2785903 said:
BTW, your guy #41 has said some of the same things your boy Ellis has said, probably more hot opinions last year, I guess having talent makes you untouchable (unless you're TO) respectfully.
Let's discuss that for one minute Iscariot.

How bad a jerk was he if the Cowboys walked away from his contract 1 year after they gave it to him?

Maybe things are a whole lot worse than ya'll are imagining. His talent could save him because his attitude sunk him.
 

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Hostile;2785921 said:
Let's discuss that for one minute Iscariot.

How bad a jerk was he if the Cowboys walked away from his contract 1 year after they gave it to him?

Maybe things are a whole lot worse than ya'll are imagining. His talent could save him because his attitude sunk him.
All of those things, but being his age did him in.

I'm sure that he'd still be here if he were let's say, 28 years old.
 

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Judas;2785924 said:
All of those things, but being his age did him in.

I'm sure that he'd still be here if he were let's say, 28 years old.
Yeah, and I'm pretty sure he wouldn't be.
 

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Hostile;2785933 said:
Yeah, and I'm pretty sure he wouldn't be.
Then that would make him the dumbest owner in history, sending a #1 draft pick away for nothing, because that's what he was worth at 28.
 

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Judas;2785903 said:
BTW, your guy #41 has said some of the same things your boy Ellis has said, probably more hot opinions last year, I guess having talent makes you untouchable (unless you're TO) respectfully.

You have a point here, but I doubt it will get much play. He's very much like Ellis, outspoken and still a fan favorite regardless because he plays the media extremely well.
 

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Judas;2785956 said:
Then that would make him the dumbest owner in history, sending a #1 draft pick away for nothing, because that's what he was worth at 28.
Typical. Divert attention away from how bad Owens really was to another topic.
 

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Hostile;2785986 said:
Typical. Divert attention away from how bad Owens really was to another topic.
Trying to stay out of the Owens stuff if possible.

Alexander;2785972 said:
You have a point here, but I doubt it will get much play. He's very much like Ellis, outspoken and still a fan favorite regardless because he plays the media extremely well.
It's really because he's a shut down corner, hard to find.
 

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Judas;2785989 said:
It's really because he's a shut down corner, hard to find.

Unless your first name is Deion and your last name is Sanders, that doesn't exist. He's a good player, well above Ellis' best level, but he's nothing close to the elite talent that he's imagined to be.
 

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Judas;2785903 said:
BTW, your guy #41 has said some of the same things your boy Ellis has said, probably more hot opinions last year, I guess having talent makes you untouchable (unless you're TO) respectfully.


Comparing Terence Newman to Greg Ellis is laughable.

Terence Newman challenged the coaches and players to be accountable for their play on the field. Some didn't agree with the way he delivered the message, but it must have worked. Dallas and Newman played one of their very best games of the season against the Giants on national t.v.

He called the unnamed sources "cowards".

Newman was taken out of context by JJT at the DMN after his interview was a non-story and old news. The NFL Network ran with it.

This isn't about Owens.

It's about Greg Ellis' declining, overrated play on the field.
 

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Judas, the question regarding team sports wasn't meant as an insult, it was a genuine curiousity, because if Ellis was on my team, and we wanted to be elite as a group, I'd find him quite a whiner and a downer, and just wondered if you would. Sounds like you wouldn't, which is fine. I'm sensitive to that sort of thing, I guess.

I didn't imply earning $6 Million is comparable to anyone typical, I meant that I think it would be wise for someone earning that, and having, as you clearly point out, a small window of opportunity, to not "bite the hands that are feeding them".

I think Ellis was a bit dumb because:

He stated out loud, year after year that he was likely done in Dallas, because other linebackers were drafted, or played more in preseason or given an extra blue lollypop during team meetings.

He whined about his contract over and over, and then was never quoted as saying he appreciated Jones and the Cowboys much when they at least did some renegotiating for him.

He doesn't balance (and this is a media issue too, because how much coverage do the good quotes get, I agree) his pouting and whining with positive statements or ever seem to challenge himself or the players around him to be better. In short he's paranoid, cynical, and negative, or at least comes across that way. That isn't positive leadership (again, this is just my opinion on a forum board).

He has mentioned that perhaps being elsewhere would be better often over the years, would you say this at your employer for everyone to hear? As you said, he does and has wanted out. BUT, it isn't like he says I'd like to leave and go to TEAM X because I want to win a superbowl, no he says he wants to leave because he wants more money or wants to be guaranteed a starting position. I'd rather have a guy that wants the ring after a decade in league, doesn't he have enough money by now?

I have mentioned many of Ellis's positives too.

As for being "nice" and "respectful" to posters, I too, try to do this, and I appreciate it, and my comments and questions are intended for debate not "bait", but you mentioned basically biting your tongue which seemed to indicate a nerve was struck somehow.

As for what have the Cowboys done, well, Ellis has been a Cowboy for almost the entire period they haven't done much. Mind you he complained while they were recently on the upswing and a favourite super bowl pick of many, and he still wasn't happy. 13-3 not happy. That is just his personality I guess.

Me, I prefer the Marion Barber approach, keep it quiet or don't say anything, if you can be sucked into the soap opera.

Newman has said some things, but when I dig a little and see the interviews or get the quotes, I just like his attitude a lot more, because he seems to care about winning and takes care of his own personal business in a manner I find I respect a lot more than Ellis's demeanor. Again that is all opinion.

Age is for sure a factor in this though, and I'd agree that if Ellis was 28, he would be on the team as he would still have upside or at very least would be counted on to remain consistent. He might also get less of the benefit of the doubt or the thought "that's just Ellis being paranoid again" and have his arse hauled in an office, fined, and chewed out nicely.

LarryCanadian
 

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41gy#;2786004 said:
Comparing Terence Newman to Greg Ellis is laughable.

Terence Newman challenged the coaches and players to be accountable for their play on the field. Some didn't agree with the way he delivered the message, but it must have worked. Dallas and Newman played one of their very best games of the season against the Giants on national t.v.

He called the unnamed sources "cowards".

Newman was taken out of context by JJT at the DMN after his interview was a non-story and old news. The NFL Network ran with it.

This isn't about Owens.

It's about Greg Ellis' declining, overrated play on the field.
I never said it was about Owens, I mentioned something in my post and Hos responded to it, but Owens wasn't my point.


Player {A} - complained about team issues
Player {B} - complained about team issues

Player {A} - sucks, therefore get him out of here.
Player {B} - Is a stud, so no one cares.
 

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Alexander;2785997 said:
Unless your first name is Deion and your last name is Sanders, that doesn't exist. He's a good player, well above Ellis' best level, but he's nothing close to the elite talent that he's imagined to be.


That is where you are wrong, Alexander.

Bill Parcells isn't the ultimate you make him out to be.

He's the guy that paid Anthony Henry $ 25 million dollars and drafted Bobby Carpenter.

Terence Newman doesn't have to take a backseat to anyone.

Terence Newman is an elite player.

He has proven it on the field.

Do you honestly think DeAngelo Hall deserved the Pro Bowl over Terence Newman, twice.

What a joke.

Newman has been the best slot defender in the NFL since 2005, and I dare you to name one better.

Who has taken Steve Smith all over the field twice and shut him down?

Newman has shut down elite receivers and TEs, and he's done it for 6 years. His four year YPA, from 2004-2007, was second only to Shawn Springs. He's consistently been one of the best cornerbacks in the NFL.

Newman has been rated Dallas' best player by GM votes more than one time.

Go ask Asante Samuel to take Steve Smith all over the field and see how many times he gets torched.

Ask Charles Woodson, he got torched last year.
 

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41gy#;2786017 said:
Newman has been the best slot defender in the NFL since 2005, and I dare you to name one better.
I will when the top corners start playing in the slot.

And for Larrycanadian, I'm sorry I just don't feel like responding, maybe tomorrow but it's too big to mess with right now.
 
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