If Not for Injuries...

[ABQCOWBOY]

Sorry, but that is not true. Tillman is a great person, but he was not a great player. He was a hard hitter especially for a guy that was 5'-11" and 202 lbs. One of the hardest, but he could not cover at all. People complain about Roy Williams and Roy was a much better safety than Tillman. Pat had 3 INTs and 2 passes defended in 4 years. I can appreciate what he sacrificed, but it doesn't change my opinion of him as a player. An opinion I had while he was still playing and before he ever announced he was joining the military.

Fair enough. Everybody is entitled to his or her opinion.

 

[BeWare94]

Been reading a lot of "what if" or "greatest ever" type threads in the fan forum, and those are great to pass time in the off season. So I figured I'd start my own.

What players do you think, if it wasn't for injury, would have been at least stars, if not potential Hall of Famers in the NFL?


First one that comes to mind for me would be Ki Jana Carter. The guy was a stud at Penn State, the #1 pick in the draft, then suffered torn knee ligaments his first practice in Cincinatti, only to come back a year later and suffer torn knee ligaments in his other knee (I believe). He recovered a few years and went on to be somewhat of a serviceable role player with Washington. But I really thought he was going to be good when he was drafted.

really? Ki-Jana Carter? I was thinking more along the lines of Bo Jackson

 

[Sonny#9]

Kinda like Jerome Brown: Sean Taylor.

 

[JohnnyHopkins]

Fair enough. Everybody is entitled to his or her opinion.

We really like your work around here, though!

 

[zrinkill]

Sean Taylor.

Oh Wow ....

I am sorry ..... but not even close.

 

[HoleInTheRoof]

Oh Wow ....

I am sorry ..... but not even close.

I think Sean Taylor would've been a star. I don't know about Hall of Fame worthy.

He's an enigma. And with all due respect, he's a touch overrated by Commanders fans. He was pretty inconsistent early in his career, to include being attrocious in 2006. He was having a stellar 2007 season before his life was tragically cut short.

 

[Sonny#9]

I think Sean Taylor would've been a star. I don't know about Hall of Fame worthy.

He's an enigma. And with all due respect, he's a touch overrated by Commanders fans. He was pretty inconsistent early in his career, to include being attrocious in 2006. He was having a stellar 2007 season before his life was tragically cut short.

His preparation after that horrid 2006 season is what really did it for me. A lot of players struggle in their 2nd season. He changed his diet, the way he trained, his overall approach to the offseason. And the result was: He was all over the field in 2007. Take a look at the GB game where he had 2 picks (and damned near could have had two more). His range in that game was unbelievable.

Yeah, he is probably overrated by Skins fans for good reason. However, while no one can say HOF worthy for ANY player, he was definitely on his way to multiple All-Pro sections, in my humble, expert opinion.

 

[zrinkill]

Yeah, he is probably overrated by Skins fans for good reason. However, while no one can say HOF worthy for ANY player, he was definitely on his way to multiple All-Pro sections, in my humble, expert opinion.

Maybe

But in the 55 games Sean Taylor played in the NFL he had

238 tackles
2 sacks
34 passes defended
12 interceptions
0 Td's
8 forced fumbles

In the corresponding 55 games for Roy Williams in his first 4 seasons he had

245 tackles
6.5 sacks
25 passes defended
11 interceptions
3 Td's
8 forced fumbles

And you can see how the public perception turned on Roy even though he was having a better career at the same point.

 

[HoleInTheRoof]

Maybe

But in the 55 games Sean Taylor played in the NFL he had

238 tackles
2 sacks
34 passes defended
12 interceptions
0 Td's
8 forced fumbles

In the corresponding 55 games for Roy Williams in his first 4 seasons he had

245 tackles
6.5 sacks
25 passes defended
11 interceptions
3 Td's
8 forced fumbles

And you can see how the public perception turned on Roy even though he was having a better career at the same point.

I've never seen a single player go from being so dominant, to so horrid, in such short time without suffering an injury.

I literally thought Roy would win the NFL's Defensive MVP award at least once in his career. That's laughable now.

 

[Sonny#9]

I've never seen a single player go from being so dominant, to so horrid, in such short time without suffering an injury.

I literally thought Roy would win the NFL's Defensive MVP award at least once in his career. That's laughable now.

I agree with you on Williams. That was shocking...a quick question: at what point in his career did the Cowboys switch to the 3-4?

It's not surprising a certain poster is so adamant against Taylor...and would resort to pulling up the stats comparison between Taylor and Williams. I don't think he ever displayed the range that Taylor was capable of...I could be wrong. It seemed to me Taylor was a far superior athlete in general.

 

[zrinkill]

It's not surprising a certain poster is so adamant against Taylor...and would resort to pulling up the stats comparison between Taylor and Williams. I don't think he ever displayed the range that Taylor was capable of...I could be wrong. It seemed to me Taylor was a far superior athlete in general.

I am not against Taylor.

Just do not think he is hall of fame good.

Neither is Williams.

Guys like Darrell Green and Darren Woodson are.

 

[Ren]

2005 was the first year in the 3-4, it was around that time Roys decline really started for full but i don't buy it for a second that that's the reason for it. His job didn't change enough for that to be a valid excuse.
His 2 best seasons was next to Darren Woodson he was never anything more then average at best without him

 

[Sonny#9]

2005 was the first year in the 3-4, it was around that time Roys decline really started for full but i don't buy it for a second that that's the reason for it. His job didn't change enough for that to be a valid excuse.
His 2 best seasons was next to Darren Woodson he was never anything more then average at best without him

I actually forgot about Woodson...that would make sense. The Cowboys have been looking for a half-decent FS since him

 

[Sonny#9]

Just do not think he is hall of fame good.

Neither did I:

Yeah, he is probably overrated by Skins fans for good reason. However, while no one can say HOF worthy for ANY player, he was definitely on his way to multiple All-Pro sections, in my humble, expert opinion.

 

[HoleInTheRoof]

I agree with you on Williams. That was shocking...a quick question: at what point in his career did the Cowboys switch to the 3-4?[/qupte]

I want to say it was 2004, Parcells 2nd year. Roy didn't have that great of a season in 2004, but he really seemed to fall off the map in 2005.

Besides, I'm not sure safety responsibilities change so much in either defense where it would lead to such a dramatic drop off. Instead, I think he just got content. It was roughly around that time he started dating the girl from Destiny's Child. I think he lost his hunger.

It's not surprising a certain poster is so adamant against Taylor...and would resort to pulling up the stats comparison between Taylor and Williams. I don't think he ever displayed the range that Taylor was capable of...I could be wrong. It seemed to me Taylor was a far superior athlete in general.

Taylor was the better athlete, I believe as well. At least I know he was faster. Not that Roy was unathletic. If you watch his highlights from college and the first few seasons in the NFL, he was all over the place with sacks and interceptions. And he hit like few others. There were a lot of valid comparisons to Ronnie Lott - even from Ronnie Lott.

It's a damn shame. Really bothers me as a fan.

 

[Cover 2]

Billy Sims

 

[Cover 2]

Kinda like Jerome Brown: Sean Taylor.

I disagree. There's two things I remember about Sean Taylor.

It seemed like every time we played the Commanders we burned him for a touchdown.

Also if I remember correctly he set an NFL record for most missed tackles in a season.

To me he is a highly overrated player. I thought he was going to be an elite safety the year he came out and was disappointed you guys took him, but he never panned out IMO.

 

[Sonny#9]

I think he lost his hunger.

And this is why I believe Taylor was on his way to being an elite player. His naysayers blindly point to his terrible 2006, and that's all they remember. They seem to just ignore 2007. However that 2006 season seemed to fuel Taylor. He completely changed his attitude towards training, diet, the game itself. He dropped something like 20 lbs and came into 2007 a different player.

It's a damn shame. Really bothers me as a fan.

Me too -- well about Taylor anyway...