CFZ Is it hope or is it fact?

[ArtClink]

Cautiously optimistic? Wow Art, where’s your fandom here? Jk…

Lol - three decades will make even the most avid fan skeptical.

 

[xwalker]

I’ve been amazed at how many times I’ve read lately on our forum that “our new OL is going to be better this year than last year.” I find that comment as fans hope rather than a statement of fact. Nothing wrong with hope at all. It’s just different than fact.

Lets take off the fan glasses for a moment and compare two new rookie players to the players they replaced along with our RB position compared to last year:

• Tyler Guyton and Tyron Smith- I really like Guyton as our first round pick. His athleticism and size give him huge long term upside at the most important position on the OL. But will Guyton be better than Tyron Smith, both immediately and down the road? At best that remains to be seen. Smith was a 2nd team All Pro last year despite his decline due to injuries. He’s probably headed to Canton at some point. I’m going to tap the brakes on thinking Guyton is going to be instantly as good as Smith. Maybe eventually.

• Cooper Bebee and Tyler Biadaz- Bebee is an underrated pick in my view and has instant “ plug and play” potential. Probably even more than Guyton. But he’s learning the center position this year and although Biadaz was not great, he was good. Bebee may have a learning curve to start the year at least.
  
  
• The RB position - We are hoping the combination of Zeke Elliott, Rico Dowdle and Deuce Vaughn are collectively better than Tony Pollard was last year. Objectively, that seems like a stretch of hope, not fact. Maybe we still have a RB move in the near future that will upgrade this position because I can’t realistically call this position as a strength.

Bottom line for me- I like the guys we drafted this year. Especially Guyton and Bebee. But expecting those two guys along with a diminished RB position to make our running game and offense immediately better is hope, but we can’t call it a fact yet. Right?

Hope is a good thing. I have it. But I don’t consider hope the same as fact.

There are no facts regarding future performance. That would put Vegas out of business.

The issues in 2023:
Zack Martin's worst season.

Steele sucked early but was rounding back into form by the end of the season.

Biadasz was average at best.

Tyler Smith was in his 1st full season at OG and was often dominant.

Tyron was good in pass pro. He was up/down in run blocking. He missed 4 games and didn't play 100% of snaps in some others.

 

[Sandyf]

Reading though the posts, there were some very good points on either side of hope and despair but the one thing I didn't see was anything on what the analytics played in all the evaluations .

IF the analytics told them that the guys they drafted can start and make differences right away then willing to wait and see how it plays out once the season starts. Those first six games are going to tell the tell for the season.

The analytics are supposed to make drafting better. We are about to find out if it worked.

 

[xwalker]

I’ve been amazed at how many times I’ve read lately on our forum that “our new OL is going to be better this year than last year.” I find that comment as fans hope rather than a statement of fact. Nothing wrong with hope at all. It’s just different than fact.

Lets take off the fan glasses for a moment and compare two new rookie players to the players they replaced along with our RB position compared to last year:

• Tyler Guyton and Tyron Smith- I really like Guyton as our first round pick. His athleticism and size give him huge long term upside at the most important position on the OL. But will Guyton be better than Tyron Smith, both immediately and down the road? At best that remains to be seen. Smith was a 2nd team All Pro last year despite his decline due to injuries. He’s probably headed to Canton at some point. I’m going to tap the brakes on thinking Guyton is going to be instantly as good as Smith. Maybe eventually.

• Cooper Bebee and Tyler Biadaz- Bebee is an underrated pick in my view and has instant “ plug and play” potential. Probably even more than Guyton. But he’s learning the center position this year and although Biadaz was not great, he was good. Bebee may have a learning curve to start the year at least.
  
  
• The RB position - We are hoping the combination of Zeke Elliott, Rico Dowdle and Deuce Vaughn are collectively better than Tony Pollard was last year. Objectively, that seems like a stretch of hope, not fact. Maybe we still have a RB move in the near future that will upgrade this position because I can’t realistically call this position as a strength.

Bottom line for me- I like the guys we drafted this year. Especially Guyton and Bebee. But expecting those two guys along with a diminished RB position to make our running game and offense immediately better is hope, but we can’t call it a fact yet. Right?

Hope is a good thing. I have it. But I don’t consider hope the same as fact.

2024 Hope:
Zack Martin does not hold out like weasel and comes to camp in top condition.

The Center can actually move somebody in the run game. Note, Beebe vs Biadasz in sumo wrestling would be similar watching Larry Allen block a Linebacker...just not fair.

Steele is 100% healthy. Steele looked healthy by the end of the season. They should have started him on PUP last year. A testament to his work ethic and attitude to come back ahead of schedule.

Guyton. Obviously won't step in and play like Tyron on Tyron's best days but a full 17 games is possible with Guyton. One of the most freakishly athletic college OTs I've seen since Tyron at USC. Guyton's ability to step outside then back inside in sync with the pass rusher is insane. Like Deion mirroring a WR.

Note: Guyton and Tyron were college freaks due to movement skills. Tyler Smith was the most freakishly powerful OT that I've ever seen in college (I didn't have Sonoma State games back in the day...).

Side Note:
Tyron is one of my favorite players ever, but it was time to move on.

Favs:
Erik Williams
Randy White
Travis Frederick
Tyler Smith
Tyron Smith

 

[kskboys]

While I see this OL starting off a bit slow, once they get in synch I believe they'll be at least decent. What I do really like is that both Guyton and Beebe are mean ol' dogs. We've been needing that for a while now.

Also, hope Martin has at least one good year left, and that we're not forced to move Tyler outside, where he is only decent. He's a dominant OG.

 

[gtb1943]

I dont think it’s very realistic to think the OL will be better this year. Guyton and Beebe will be rookies…and no matter how high you are on them they aren’t going to come in and be instant upgrades. Our fans love to trash on Tyler B for some reason but he just signed a contract with a top 10 AYV.

The big hope for me is a bounce back from Steele. If he can be good as a run blocker again that will help our RB room which at the moment is laughable.

TB simply did not have the strength and anchor to do really well in our system. We needed to move on and we did

 

[Redsfan_83]

I’ve been amazed at how many times I’ve read lately on our forum that “our new OL is going to be better this year than last year.” I find that comment as fans hope rather than a statement of fact. Nothing wrong with hope at all. It’s just different than fact.

Lets take off the fan glasses for a moment and compare two new rookie players to the players they replaced along with our RB position compared to last year:

• Tyler Guyton and Tyron Smith- I really like Guyton as our first round pick. His athleticism and size give him huge long term upside at the most important position on the OL. But will Guyton be better than Tyron Smith, both immediately and down the road? At best that remains to be seen. Smith was a 2nd team All Pro last year despite his decline due to injuries. He’s probably headed to Canton at some point. I’m going to tap the brakes on thinking Guyton is going to be instantly as good as Smith. Maybe eventually.

• Cooper Bebee and Tyler Biadaz- Bebee is an underrated pick in my view and has instant “ plug and play” potential. Probably even more than Guyton. But he’s learning the center position this year and although Biadaz was not great, he was good. Bebee may have a learning curve to start the year at least.
  
  
• The RB position - We are hoping the combination of Zeke Elliott, Rico Dowdle and Deuce Vaughn are collectively better than Tony Pollard was last year. Objectively, that seems like a stretch of hope, not fact. Maybe we still have a RB move in the near future that will upgrade this position because I can’t realistically call this position as a strength.

Bottom line for me- I like the guys we drafted this year. Especially Guyton and Bebee. But expecting those two guys along with a diminished RB position to make our running game and offense immediately better is hope, but we can’t call it a fact yet. Right?

Hope is a good thing. I have it. But I don’t consider hope the same as fact.

If I wrote this statement of fact I would be called a hater. You forgot or left out the fact that we have a possibly disgruntled WR1 and no WR2. All the questions on our O that you mention will be glorified because of this, let alone we could have a sitting duck at QB and HC

 

[Creeper]

I’ve been amazed at how many times I’ve read lately on our forum that “our new OL is going to be better this year than last year.” I find that comment as fans hope rather than a statement of fact. Nothing wrong with hope at all. It’s just different than fact.

Lets take off the fan glasses for a moment and compare two new rookie players to the players they replaced along with our RB position compared to last year:

• Tyler Guyton and Tyron Smith- I really like Guyton as our first round pick. His athleticism and size give him huge long term upside at the most important position on the OL. But will Guyton be better than Tyron Smith, both immediately and down the road? At best that remains to be seen. Smith was a 2nd team All Pro last year despite his decline due to injuries. He’s probably headed to Canton at some point. I’m going to tap the brakes on thinking Guyton is going to be instantly as good as Smith. Maybe eventually.

• Cooper Bebee and Tyler Biadaz- Bebee is an underrated pick in my view and has instant “ plug and play” potential. Probably even more than Guyton. But he’s learning the center position this year and although Biadaz was not great, he was good. Bebee may have a learning curve to start the year at least.
  
  
• The RB position - We are hoping the combination of Zeke Elliott, Rico Dowdle and Deuce Vaughn are collectively better than Tony Pollard was last year. Objectively, that seems like a stretch of hope, not fact. Maybe we still have a RB move in the near future that will upgrade this position because I can’t realistically call this position as a strength.

Bottom line for me- I like the guys we drafted this year. Especially Guyton and Bebee. But expecting those two guys along with a diminished RB position to make our running game and offense immediately better is hope, but we can’t call it a fact yet. Right?

Hope is a good thing. I have it. But I don’t consider hope the same as fact.

Tyron Smith is a future Hall of Fame LT. Expecting Tyler Guyton to equal Smith is a fools errand. I cannot say he definitely won't be, but odds are he will never be as good as Tyron. But, he doesn't have to be. Still, I worry about him as our starting LT. The guys playing outside in this league are really good. He starts the season against the best in the league in Myles Garrett.

I was never a big fan of Biadasz. He was adequate but nothing special. I actually think he was a liability in the running game because he is not strong enough to move big DTs. We have no idea what Beebe will be but he has a great opportunity to be better than Biadasz. First, he has to beat out Brock Hoffman and I think Hoffman is going to surprise some people with how good he can be.

Right now the RB position is a disaster. No one on the roster moves the needle. The Cowboys are going to struggle running the football. One thing that is not mentioned enough is the re-emergence of Terence Steele. Is he going to return to 2022 level of play, or is 2023 his new high water mark? Unless Steele and Martin show some dominance again, I don't see Zeke or anyone else gaining more than 3 yards per carry. The Cowboys backfield lacks real speed now and that is going to be a problem.

But overall, I agree with you. We set expectations very high for some of these draft picks without having seen them play in the NFL. That is more hope than anything else. Its like when we expect aging free agents to return to their youth because they put a star on their helmet.

 

[Plankton]

The potential is certainly there for guys like Guyton and Beebe to be good, long term answers for the Cowboys on the offensive line. Guyton has limited experience, period. Forget about only seeing snaps at LT in 2 games - he has only started 14 games in college. He's a raw lump of clay that needs a lot of molding. He has a lot of physical ability, but the seasoning will be a work in progress.

As for Beebe, he is moving to a position that he has never played. Seeing things in real time, and having to make line calls on top of it will be a real challenge for a rookie. He's an absolute bulldozer when he gets his hands on you, but he really needs to improve his conditioning if he's going to be able to consistently execute reach blocking as a center. He also has short arms, which is somewhat mitigated by playing center, but it can hamper his ability to quickly get his hands on a DT coming off the ball. It wouldn't shock me to see Brock Hoffman start the season as center on this team, with Beebe working in the wings to take over down the road.

 

[offlimits]

Hope is pretty much all many have here to cling to. TBH. I think this OL could be worse this season. You are expecting inexperienced rookies to perform against experienced defensive fronts? Keep hope alive.

 

[offlimits]

As immobile as Dak is... he had better put on a pair of roller skates this season.

 

[cnuball21]

TB simply did not have the strength and anchor to do really well in our system. We needed to move on and we did

He wasn’t the most powerful dude…but he was league average at worst and his new contract speaks to that.

I know everyone wants a pro bowl player at every position but he was a solid pro.

I love Beebes upside, but again, expecting a rookie to come in and be better in year 1 is unrealistic IMO. If he progresses throughout the season and is solid towards the end of the year that’d be great.