Jaylon Smith on Mike & Mike ESPN radio recently

[Fla Cowpoke]

@CyberB0b

Since when does the nerve could be healed equal any kind of guarantee that it would be healed?

 

[waldoputty]

https://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2011/10/111003131423.htm

Also this article does a good job showing what the issue is. The nerve regrows but the synapses have issues forming on the muscle.

I would feel alot better if I knew that they were continuing to stimulate the muscle artificially to prevent atrophy. There is also some talk of protein interference and the like. It doesn't seem to be a well understood process as of 10 years ago. There has been a lot of study in the last ten years alone though. I don't know what cutting edge is nowadays.

I dont think the time frame is the issue.
The doctor would clearly know that if it is an issue.
Then Cowboys would not have taken the risk.

My question is still if the neurons go to the right place.
The nerve needs to reinnervate more than 1 muscle.
Is there such as thing as the wrong muscle getting reinervated?
I cannot get a clear answer.
From some of the doctors here, it did not sound like that is a concern.

 

[jobberone]

I dont think the time frame is the issue.
The doctor would clearly know that if it is an issue.
Then Cowboys would not have taken the risk.

My question is still if the neurons go to the right place.
The nerve needs to reinnervate more than 1 muscle.
Is there such as thing as the wrong muscle getting reinervated?
I cannot get a clear answer.
From some of the doctors here, it did not sound like that is a concern.

If the axon is torn away from the motor neuron junction then I believe you must reattach the two torn ends and allow for regeneration along the axons. Typically the nerve is stretched and is not working and the amount of regeneration is substantially less albeit not inconsequential. My data is not recent and this is not my field of endeavor.

 

[waldoputty]

If the axon is torn away from the motor neuron junction then I believe you must reattach the two torn ends and allow for regeneration along the axons. Typically the nerve is stretched and is not working and the amount of regeneration is substantially less albeit not inconsequential. My data is not recent and this is not my field of endeavor.

from what i read, i dont think the axons were torn, but the axons died distal of the damage area.
i think the wall of the nerve was not torn either.

 

[FuzzyLumpkins]

from what i read, i dont think the axons were torn, but the axons died distal of the damage area.
i think the wall of the nerve was not torn either.

When a nerve is severed then everything to the extremity dies including the synapses that link to the muscle. Because the sheath is intact the nerve has a highway to follow and will reach the muscle but the synapse to the muscle itself can be problematic. There are a whole lot of them and it's common that it doesn't return total function.

I read quite a bit on it but all the new stuff is hidden behind pay walls that I am not going to pay for access. I don't care all that much for something that might not tell me what I'm looking for. The stuff from 2011 and before all seemed to agree on one thing: if the muscle atrophies then you are pretty much guaranteed to have problems. That isn't it though and they were exploring multiple hypothesis for cause such as proteins and lymphocytes interfering. Apparently the muscle can produce axons on that end that block the link and such.

Regardless he likely will start retaining some function in July but how much and how quickly who knows. There were some surgical options to assist the reennervation as well. One study said that if it doesn't reenervate quickly that you should intercede and not wait. If he goes under the knife again in July then the season is likely lost.

Were just going to be in a position of ignorance. Garrett doesn't say anything specific about injury status and makes claims about how he isn't a doctor to dodge direct questions. Dr. Miller won't be made available and were just going to have to wait and see. I doubt the DFW press corps would know the right questions to ask anyway.

 

[waldoputty]

When a nerve is severed then everything to the extremity dies including the synapses that link to the muscle. Because the sheath is intact the nerve has a highway to follow and will reach the muscle but the synapse to the muscle itself can be problematic. There are a whole lot of them and it's common that it doesn't return total function.

I read quite a bit on it but all the new stuff is hidden behind pay walls that I am not going to pay for access. I don't care all that much for something that might not tell me what I'm looking for. The stuff from 2011 and before all seemed to agree on one thing: if the muscle atrophies then you are pretty much guaranteed to have problems. That isn't it though and they were exploring multiple hypothesis for cause such as proteins and lymphocytes interfering. Apparently the muscle can produce axons on that end that block the link and such.

Regardless he likely will start retaining some function in July but how much and how quickly who knows. There were some surgical options to assist the reennervation as well. One study said that if it doesn't reenervate quickly that you should intercede and not wait. If he goes under the knife again in July then the season is likely lost.

Were just going to be in a position of ignorance. Garrett doesn't say anything specific about injury status and makes claims about how he isn't a doctor to dodge direct questions. Dr. Miller won't be made available and were just going to have to wait and see. I doubt the DFW press corps would know the right questions to ask anyway.

Fuzzy

The nerve was not severed - it was stretched?
But I think the neuron axons die distal of the injury.
Though I think the sheath does not lie.

 

[FuzzyLumpkins]

Fuzzy

The nerve was not severed - it was stretched?
But I think the neuron axons die distal of the injury.
Though I think the sheath does not lie.

The exterior of the sheath was intact but the stretching severed the axonal connection on the interior. Else it would have been a class 1 injury and he would have already regained function.

They do die. That is what the white blood cells are to do. Take out all the dead axons before scar tissue forms. But yeah the sheath itself is the highway the axons will follow in regrowing to the muscle and getting there will not be a problem. I am confident at minimum a partial recovery. Once the nerve reaches the muscle though there is a different synaptic connection and for reasons that remain somewhat unclear they don't all always reconnect properly.

 

[waldoputty]

The exterior of the sheath was intact but the stretching severed the axonal connection on the interior. Else it would have been a class 1 injury and he would have already regained function.

They do die. That is what the white blood cells are to do. Take out all the dead axons before scar tissue forms. But yeah the sheath itself is the highway the axons will follow in regrowing to the muscle and getting there will not be a problem. I am confident at minimum a partial recovery. Once the nerve reaches the muscle though there is a different synaptic connection and for reasons that remain somewhat unclear they don't all always reconnect properly.

I think the peroneal nerve splits into 2.
Then each innervates 2 or 3 muscles?
I think there is a highway to each muscle.
But how does the neuron send the right axon to the right muscle.
Or does that matter?

 

[jobberone]

Axons are the innervating part of a neuron. Axons in bundles form nerves. Where the axon meets a muscle is the neuromuscular junction a type of synapse. If the body of the neuron remains viable and intact then it is possible for the axon to regenerate, particularly a myelinated axon, from proximal to the injury all the way to the synapse. There are many modifiers to the process and likely many more we don't know or understand. I'd have to study this topic in detail to say much more. Proteins, actin, and helper cells all assist among others to help the axon get to where it belongs.

 

[Bleu Star]

Sounds good... One thing that has bothered me since we drafted Smith, is that I've heard numerous people compare him to Sean Lee, except they would say that if healthy he's much better than Lee, and I just find that hard to stomach, given the fact that Sean lee is already a stud in the NFL.. I just hope we see the day where Smith and Lee play together...

He's much better than Lee. He is a bona-fide superstar on the defensive side of the ball. Patience will be a virtue with this one.

 

[Spectre]

He's much better than Lee. He is a bona-fide superstar on the defensive side of the ball. Patience will be a virtue with this one.

Think you're terribly underrating a healthy Lee. Guy is an absolute beast. We'll see when/if Smith ever plays, but I have my doubts he'll be as good as Lee.

 

[Bleu Star]

Think you're terribly underrating a healthy Lee. Guy is an absolute beast. We'll see when/if Smith ever plays, but I have my doubts he'll be as good as Lee.

Lee is never healthy. Jayson has never had injury issues... Let's not go there though. Just based upon raw talent, Jayson is going to be the best pure athlete on the defensive side of the ball.

 

[Bleu Star]

& just to make sure it's clear, I love me some Lee. I hope that he and Jaylon get the opportunity to play together. That'll be special to watch.

 

[Spectre]

Lee is never healthy. Jayson has never had injury issues... Let's not go there though. Just based upon raw talent, Jayson is going to be the best pure athlete on the defensive side of the ball.

(Lee IS healthy...
Smith is sidelined for a year by possible career-ending injury)
...

Also, you referred to him as 'Jayson' twice so I'm not really convinced you have any real idea what you're talking about regarding this player.

 

[Bleu Star]

(Lee IS healthy...
Smith is sidelined for a year by possible career-ending injury)
...

Also, you referred to him as 'Jayson' twice so I'm not really convinced you have any real idea what you're talking about regarding this player.

Lmao. Ok. No one here is trying to convince you.. But, just for kicks, I got one of those cute lil GS7 Edges a week ago and it is a little smarter than I expected. Almost too smart for its own good. Let me type his name correctly again and see how the phone interprets it.

Jayson

 

[Bleu Star]

Yup. Wasn't paying attention earlier.

Let's try again.

Jaylon

There.

Is the mensa society happy now?