Jones / Evans

[TellerMorrow34]

Augh, no. When you have a 32 year old fighter who is not in great shape against a 24 year old fighter with 10 inches reach and in much better condition, this is not what usually happens. He never hurt Evans really and he never pressed the fight at all IMO. Evans had opportunity to take Jones down and he really could not do it.

Rashad Evans WAS made to order for Jon Jones, he just didn't do anything with it IMO. However, well soon see. I'll pass on you break comment. I have a feeling that you won't bringing that up again if in fact this is a quick rematch. Feel free to bring it up repeatedly if I am wrong but I won't be.

I only caught part of the post fight stuff by they were interviewing Hendo as if they expected him to be getting the next shot at Jon Jones.

If that's the case I don't know how Rashad is going to be getting a quick rematch. Of course the people talking with him could have been speaking hypothetically, cause as I said I only caught part of the post fight stuff.

 

[TheCount]

Down the road a little, yes, but I think AG needs a few more fights before he's ready for Jones.

Agreed, he needs some more experience.

Augh, no. When you have a 32 year old fighter who is not in great shape against a 24 year old fighter with 10 inches reach and in much better condition, this is not what usually happens. He never hurt Evans really and he never pressed the fight at all IMO. Evans had opportunity to take Jones down and he really could not do it.

Rashad Evans WAS made to order for Jon Jones, he just didn't do anything with it IMO. However, well soon see. I'll pass on you break comment. I have a feeling that you won't bringing that up again if in fact this is a quick rematch. Feel free to bring it up repeatedly if I am wrong but I won't be.

You want a rematch of, according to you, a fixed boring fight where one opponent was old, out of shape and served to the other on a silver platter? Why, exactly? So he can be reserved? Your argument doesn't even make sense.

And no there won't be a quick rematch because Dan Henderson is already up next for Jones.

I don't care that you may have a different opinion from my own on who is the better fighter, that's part of sports, but the fact that you immediately declare the fight fixed because it didn't go the way you expected is ridiculous.

I think that this is all show. Again, these guys hang out with each other in clubs her in Albuquerque. You see them and it's pretty easy to see that they aren't pissed off with each other.

I think it's all part of the show but it doesn't really matter. Time will eventually tell the tail.

How are they hanging out together in Alburquerque when Rashad lives and trains in Coconut Grove? Maybe they hung out when they were still at the same camp, but Rashad isn't flying all the way to NM to hang out with a rival while he's hyping a fight about how much he hates said rival, even if the whole thing is staged. That's just stupid business, and Rashad isn't stupid.

Man I hope you're right.


Rashad can beat this guy but he's gotta chop him down.

People can blame Rashad for being boring but Jones was equally as boring by just trying to use his length advantage.

I don't find Rashad to be boring at all. I think at times he plays it safe, but he's not a boring fighter. I enjoyed the whole fight, but complaining that Jones relies too much on his length is just hate talking. It's like saying Silva relies too much on his reflexes or Rashad relies too much on his quickness.

 

[ABQCOWBOY]

You want a rematch of, according to you, a fixed boring fight where one opponent was old, out of shape and served to the other on a silver platter? Why, exactly? So he can be reserved? Your argument doesn't even make sense.

Not what I said at all. That's what you just said. I said I bet there will be one. I said I would not be surprised if Jones fought a scrub and then had a rematch with Evans. That is exactly what I said. I never once said I wanted to see one. Good try thou.

And no there won't be a quick rematch because Dan Henderson is already up next for Jones.

Again, I never said they would fight immediately. I said quick. I don't know what that means to you but to me, that's in the next few fights. I can see why you get turned around. You don't really read the posts.

I don't care that you may have a different opinion from my own on who is the better fighter, that's part of sports, but the fact that you immediately declare the fight fixed because it didn't go the way you expected is ridiculous.

Again, you didn't read what I posted. I said that either that fight was fixed or the Jones camp has something to be worried about because he should have killed Evans and he didn't. You should just have this conversation by yourself. you clearly are not interested in what I posted because all you are doing is putting words in my mouth as opposed to actually discussing what I said.

How are they hanging out together in Alburquerque when Rashad lives and trains in Coconut Grove? Maybe they hung out when they were still at the same camp, but Rashad isn't flying all the way to NM to hang out with a rival while he's hyping a fight about how much he hates said rival, even if the whole thing is staged. That's just stupid business, and Rashad isn't stupid.

Because Evans used to train here. Also, yeah, that's exactly what Evans is doing. When he comes to the West coast, he does come and occasionally hang out. That does happen. If you don't want to believe that, that's your thing but that don't mean its wrong. These guys are not mortal enemies. I'm just saying that's not how it is with them but whatever.

 

[TheCount]

You've done an excellent job of backtracking on almost all of your ludicrous statements. Bravo, well done.

 

[ABQCOWBOY]

You've done an excellent job of backtracking on almost all of your ludicrous statements. Bravo, well done.

Why don't you do this. Before you break your own arm patting yourself on your own back, go back and actually read my post. See if anything I told you was a lie.

Post 43, third page. That was my first post in this thread.

 

[TheCount]

Why don't you do this. Before you break your own arm patting yourself on your own back, go back and actually read my post. See if anything I told you was a lie.

Post 43, third page. That was my first post in this thread.

I didn't call you a liar, I said your statements where ludicrous.

 

[ABQCOWBOY]

I didn't call you a liar, I said your statements where ludicrous.

Actually, you said I was back tracking on everything I said which is completely false. You said that I wanted to see a rematch, which is also false. You said all kinds of stuff that was completely untrue. Things that you said, not I.

You didn't call me a liar, you just accused me of saying all kinds of things that are not true.

Ludicrous in your opinion perhaps. That goes about how far do you think?

 

[basstapp]

I think its funny people saying that evans was content not getting knocked out. Some of the shots that Jones landed would of knocked a lot of other guys out. Evans has a a great chin. I think if you had to criticize anything about the fight is the fact that Jones pulled guard at the end of the fight. I don't have a problem with that, but what he said after the fight saying he is a mixed martial artist was crap. He used his reach and kept control of the octagon and never tried to take Evans down. He pulled guard because he was scared of Evans overhand right. Jones will not be beat for years to come,unless he moves up to Heavy Weight. I don't think we will ever see a Silva vs Jones fight.

 

[TheCount]

Actually, you said I was back tracking on everything I said which is completely false. You said that I wanted to see a rematch, which is also false. You said all kinds of stuff that was completely untrue. Things that you said, not I.

You didn't call me a liar, you just accused me of saying all kinds of things that are not true.

Ludicrous in your opinion perhaps. That goes about how far do you think?

Backtracking and lying aren't the same thing, you don't need a dictionary to know that. I don't know why you keep insisting you're a liar, I never said you were one.

Whether or not you actually know as much about MMA as you seem to think you do is another matter entirely. :laugh2:

I think its funny people saying that evans was content not getting knocked out. Some of the shots that Jones landed would of knocked a lot of other guys out. Evans has a a great chin. I think if you had to criticize anything about the fight is the fact that Jones pulled guard at the end of the fight. I don't have a problem with that, but what he said after the fight saying he is a mixed martial artist was crap. He used his reach and kept control of the octagon and never tried to take Evans down. He pulled guard because he was scared of Evans overhand right. Jones will not be beat for years to come,unless he moves up to Heavy Weight. I don't think we will ever see a Silva vs Jones fight.

I don't think he pulled guard because of the overhand right. I think he pulled guard because there was nearly no time left and he knew even if he screwed it up, the bell would save him. He had zero intentions of fighting Rashad on the ground, but you also have to keep in mind that Jones NEVER shoots. His take downs are all Greco based, so he like to sweep, trip, etc. He's not going to go for a double leg.

Rashad was well aware of that, as Rampage was and as all his future opponents will be, and avoided clinching up. It's a hard puzzel to unlock. You want to get close enough to combat his reach and land punches but not so close he can clinch up and start throwing knees or take you down.

 

[ABQCOWBOY]

Backtracking and lying aren't the same thing, you don't need a dictionary to know that. I don't know why you keep insisting you're a liar, I never said you were one.

Why don't you tell me what it is that I backtracked on?

Whether or not you actually know as much about MMA as you seem to think you do is another matter entirely. :laugh2:

Door swings both ways Count. So far, I'm sure you've impressed everybody. Time will certainly tell the story.

 

[TheCount]

Why don't you tell me what it is that I backtracked on?



Door swings both ways Count. So far, I'm sure you've impressed everybody. Time will certainly tell the story.

Who am I trying to impress again?

At least I'm not so insensible I'd bring up the possibility of a fixed fight because someone wasn't knocked out.

 

[ABQCOWBOY]

Who am I trying to impress again?

At least I'm not so insensible I'd bring up the possibility of a fixed fight because someone wasn't knocked out.

Not only was he not knocked out, he was never really hurt or even in trouble. This is not just about getting knocked out. This is about beating somebody who is claimed to be a competitor with bad blood and all you are really able to accomplish is what we saw Saturday night? Yeah, I stand by what I said. Either this was a fixed fight or the Jones Camp has much bigger worries with Jones because he should have won that fight with Evans in much more impressive fashions and probably by knockout.

Now then, about the backtracking thing. Why don't you point out where I did that.

 

[Ren]

I think its funny people saying that evans was content not getting knocked out. Some of the shots that Jones landed would of knocked a lot of other guys out. Evans has a a great chin. I think if you had to criticize anything about the fight is the fact that Jones pulled guard at the end of the fight. I don't have a problem with that, but what he said after the fight saying he is a mixed martial artist was crap. He used his reach and kept control of the octagon and never tried to take Evans down. He pulled guard because he was scared of Evans overhand right. Jones will not be beat for years to come,unless he moves up to Heavy Weight. I don't think we will ever see a Silva vs Jones fight.

No one questioned his chin, it's his hart that's being questioned

 

[TheCount]

Not only was he not knocked out, he was never really hurt or even in trouble. This is not just about getting knocked out. This is about beating somebody who is claimed to be a competitor with bad blood and all you are really able to accomplish is what we saw Saturday night? Yeah, I stand by what I said. Either this was a fixed fight or the Jones Camp has much bigger worries with Jones because he should have won that fight with Evans in much more impressive fashions and probably by knockout.

If you say so.

Now then, about the backtracking thing. Why don't you point out where I did that.

Is it really worth the time to rehash this discussion? Considering your redefined the word "quick" to mean any time between now and 2 years from now, I think it's safe to say you'll use any argument you can to avoid admitting you are wrong or may have misspoke. We could go in circles all day and accomplish zilch.

Let's move on, who do you want to see Rashad fight next?

 

[ABQCOWBOY]

If you say so.

I do say so. I said it then and I think the same now.

Is it really worth the time to rehash this discussion? Considering your redefined the word "quick" to mean any time between now and 2 years from now, I think it's safe to say you'll use any argument you can to avoid admitting you are wrong or may have misspoke. We could go in circles all day and accomplish zilch.

Let's move on, who do you want to see Rashad fight next?

Redefined the word "quick"? No, not hardly. In post 47 of this thread, I said this.

"As I eluded to earlier, it seems as if this fight should have been way different. I can see Bones taking a scrub fight and then giving Evans a rematch. I can also see Evans retiring shortly after that or if they work it so Evans wins the rematch, then Bones getting an immediate rematch and taking the title back and then Evans retiring. This just smells a little too much like payday to me. IDK."

I didn't redefine anything. I said exactly what I thought might happen and at no time did I say quick meant an immediate rematch between Evans and Jones. Nor did I ever say that I wanted to see that happen. I said I could see it happening, not that this was what I ever wanted to see happen etc. I think it's safe to say that you don't want to address the question of what I backtracked on. My posts are all there to read. I haven't taken anything back. If I'm backtracking on statements, then you show me where.

As for your question on Evans, I don't know. If he is interested in retiring with a payday, then he might not do anything. He might just wait for a rematch offer. If he want's to stay in UCF, then maybe he might consider changing weight classes. Unless he gets a rematch with Jones, it's kinda pointless to stay in that weight class IMO. I don't see him ever getting past the younger Jones and his 10 inch reach advantage.

 

[basstapp]

Not only was he not knocked out, he was never really hurt or even in trouble. This is not just about getting knocked out. This is about beating somebody who is claimed to be a competitor with bad blood and all you are really able to accomplish is what we saw Saturday night? Yeah, I stand by what I said. Either this was a fixed fight or the Jones Camp has much bigger worries with Jones because he should have won that fight with Evans in much more impressive fashions and probably by knockout.

Now then, about the backtracking thing. Why don't you point out where I did that.

There was multiple times during the fight where Jones and Evans were rocked. You are looking at the top fighters in the UFC and to say that Evans was content not getting knocked out when there was a belt on the line it ridiculous. Jones is a different specimen and I would not be surprised if he went on an Anderson Silva reign with his belt.

 

[TheCount]

I do say so. I said it then and I think the same now.





Redefined the word "quick"? No, not hardly. In post 47 of this thread, I said this.

"As I eluded to earlier, it seems as if this fight should have been way different. I can see Bones taking a scrub fight and then giving Evans a rematch. I can also see Evans retiring shortly after that or if they work it so Evans wins the rematch, then Bones getting an immediate rematch and taking the title back and then Evans retiring. This just smells a little too much like payday to me. IDK."

I didn't redefine anything. I said exactly what I thought might happen and at no time did I say quick meant an immediate rematch between Evans and Jones. Nor did I ever say that I wanted to see that happen. I said I could see it happening, not that this was what I ever wanted to see happen etc. I think it's safe to say that you don't want to address the question of what I backtracked on. My posts are all there to read. I haven't taken anything back. If I'm backtracking on statements, then you show me where.

It's been addressed. Obviously you won't agree. We get it, you think either the fight was fixed or Jones isn't very good. The beef was fake. Rashad was out of shape, old, and fed to Jones and yet Jones couldn't knock him out, because that's how all fights end. I mean Jones has this long history of knocking people out, right?

As for your question on Evans, I don't know. If he is interested in retiring with a payday, then he might not do anything. He might just wait for a rematch offer. If he want's to stay in UCF, then maybe he might consider changing weight classes. Unless he gets a rematch with Jones, it's kinda pointless to stay in that weight class IMO. I don't see him ever getting past the younger Jones and his 10 inch reach advantage.

Retire? Why, because 32 is so old for an MMA fighter? You keep saying he's old, but 30 is the prime years for most MMA fighters, especially since most had prior disciplines (wrestling, jui jitsu, boxing, muy thai, etc.) and had to learn to be more complete fighters before making the big show.

He's already talked about dropping to 185 for "an opportunity", which I take to mean title shot or #1 contender type fight. Other than that, I fully expect him to keep fighting at 205, where he is still (and has always been) one of the best. We certainly agree that he will probably never beat Jones but Jones has also talked about moving to heavyweight at the end of the year (which I'm not sure he'll do fulltime), which would leave the door open for Rashad once more if he keeps winning fights.

 

[TellerMorrow34]

So now if fights from bad blood, or supposed bad blood, don't end in knock outs or impressive finishes they're fixed?

Sorry man but I'm just not going to buy into stuff like that. I am sure there is a chance it does happen but I'm not going to buy into things like that going on without some really solid evidence proving that it does happening.


Pulling that out of the air because the fight didn't go the way you believe it should is just nonsense, IMHO.

 

[ABQCOWBOY]

There was multiple times during the fight where Jones and Evans were rocked. You are looking at the top fighters in the UFC and to say that Evans was content not getting knocked out when there was a belt on the line it ridiculous. Jones is a different specimen and I would not be surprised if he went on an Anderson Silva reign with his belt.

But not hurt.

 

[ABQCOWBOY]

It's been addressed. Obviously you won't agree. We get it, you think either the fight was fixed or Jones isn't very good. The beef was fake. Rashad was out of shape, old, and fed to Jones and yet Jones couldn't knock him out, because that's how all fights end. I mean Jones has this long history of knocking people out, right?

No. Could not be more wrong. I do think that there is definitely the possibility that the fight was fixed. If you wanted to stage a rematch, this would be exactly what you would want to do. On the other hand, the point you make about me thinking Jones is not any good is so out of the question, I am shocked you could even come to this conclusion. It is because I believe he is so good that I have these doubts and questions. How could you come to this conclusion? He is younger, stronger, more skilled and better conditioned. He should win this fight going away and he didn't. That's the problem. His camp should be worried because this is a fight he should have won much more impressively.

Retire? Why, because 32 is so old for an MMA fighter? You keep saying he's old, but 30 is the prime years for most MMA fighters, especially since most had prior disciplines (wrestling, jui jitsu, boxing, muy thai, etc.) and had to learn to be more complete fighters before making the big show.

That is a question that only Evans can answer but you asked me what he would do, did you not? Well, there are pretty much only two answers here. Retire or continue to fight. How can you be surprised that I gave you the two possible choices? I did not say that he would retire. I said if he wants to do that, then he might do this. BTW, it's not so much age as it is fights. Evans has had like 19 or 20, not including bouts in other disciplines. That's a lot fighting. I don't know what he has left but I will tell you this, from the 1st round to the 3rd round, Evans got old real quick. Time will tell but I don't see him getting better. He will only decline and the question becomes, does he want to do that or not? I would not be surprised to see him continue to fight because it's money but he won't improve from this point on. He will only decline in skills IMO.

He's already talked about dropping to 185 for "an opportunity", which I take to mean title shot or #1 contender type fight. Other than that, I fully expect him to keep fighting at 205, where he is still (and has always been) one of the best. We certainly agree that he will probably never beat Jones but Jones has also talked about moving to heavyweight at the end of the year (which I'm not sure he'll do fulltime), which would leave the door open for Rashad once more if he keeps winning fights.

As I said earlier, I think this is definitely a possibility. He has a history of moving around in weight classes and he's been successful with it. I would not be surprised to see him do this again.