La el Collins RT / OG

[Galian Beast]

The issue with Free is that his entire game if based on quick feet. He has very limited upper body strength and compensates by having very quick feet to keep himself in front of the pass rusher and avoid having to reach. If Free loses any foot quickness, then he will have big problems. Some big nasty RTs like Loadholt in Minn can play without quick feet because he compensates with overwhelming power and a long reach. Free can't do that.

Giving Free time to recover from his injuries is also a plus. Making him a career backup at this point could also prolong his career for some time in case Green and Gibson don't work out.

 

[xwalker]

There are definitely several options with Collins.

— If he's a slow starter and not better than Free or Leary, then he becomes just the swing tackle. (I think this is the least likely scenario.)
Agree; although, if he spends all of TC at LG, then he's not going to be well prepared as the backup OT because he really needs reps on the right side after always playing on the Left in college.

— If Free isn't healthy during OTAs and the start of camp, then Collins likely works with the starters and might just hold on to the position to become the starting RT.
Agree. Normally they will move players around during OTAs/min-camp and the 1st week of TC, then they will tend to get them to their primary position by the 2nd week in camp.

— Whether Free is healthy at the start of camp or gets healthy before the season, Dallas might consider the RT spot his no matter what because of the money they are paying him, his leadership, his savvy, whatever, which would shift Collins over to LG where he'd most likely win the starting job. (Not that Leary is a bad player; simply that Collins is a more gifted player.)
They most likely consider Free the starter if healthy; however, if he is not ready that puts a much bigger emphasis on getting the best possible backup and Collins would seem to be the best option between himself, Weems and Green. If Collins focuses on playing Tackle for most of training camp, it will be really difficult for him to beat out Leary. It would be difficult for him as a rookie to beat out Leary even if he takes all practice reps at LG.

— If Collins wins the starting job at LG, he also could end up as the swing tackle on game days. It would likely depend on what he showed at RT compared to the other candidates considering that Leary and Bernadeau would be our next-best linemen.
This seems like the least likely scenario. He is a rookie and needs a lot of reps at whatever position he is going to play. If he wins the LG spot he probably spent most of TC practicing there and will not be prepared to play on the right side at Tackle.

 

[xwalker]

Giving Free time to recover from his injuries is also a plus. Making him a career backup at this point could also prolong his career for some time in case Green and Gibson don't work out.

If Free is healthy enough to suit up for the game, the only way Collins starts over him is if Jerry and the front office force Garrett to do it. IMO, Garrett will start Free no matter how poorly he performs. Garrett has 4 players that he has allowed to basically do what they want to do. Romo, Witten, Murray and Free. Garrett could never bring himself to force Romo to quit changing runs plays to pass plays until Linehan took over the play calling. Garrett let Witten and Murray play as many snaps as they wanted even in blow out wins. Garrett insisted that Free remain the starter even in 2012 when he was terrible and despite the objections of the OLine coach.

I've have been and continue to be a fan of Garrett as the Head Coach, but his weakness is his attachment to certain players.

 

[CashMan]

If Free is healthy enough to suit up for the game, the only way Collins starts over him is if Jerry and the front office force Garrett to do it. IMO, Garrett will start Free no matter how poorly he performs. Garrett has 4 players that he has allowed to basically do what they want to do. Romo, Witten, Murray and Free. Garrett could never bring himself to force Romo to quit changing runs plays to pass plays until Linehan took over the play calling. Garrett let Witten and Murray play as many snaps as they wanted even in blow out wins. Garrett insisted that Free remain the starter even in 2012 when he was terrible and despite the objections of the OLine coach.

I've have been and continue to be a fan of Garrett as the Head Coach, but his weakness is his attachment to certain players.

I think you mean, stubbornness.

 

[BoysWin]

People forget that he played LT all year at LSU and that switching sides, as D.Free or TSmith would tell you, takes some adjusting to the footwork. In all likelihood, Collins will beat out R. Leary in camp while spending time preparing for RT for year 3 and be paid as a RT.

2 years of this line: T.Smith Collins Fredbeard Martin Free - just unbelievable.

COLLINS played LT well at LSU - but them 33 1/4" arm length scares me for an NFL tackle - He can become a dominating OG and maybe suspect challenge as an OT. Chaz Green, I have same reservation for as an OT. His arm length is just 33 3/8. Zach Martin - even shorter 32 7/8" All 3 players best position may be inside at OG. The raw and project player - Lawrence Gibson, physically is the best athlete and has 35 1/8" arms. He just may be the RT in 3 years.

SMITH - COLLINS - FREDBEARD - MARTIN - FREE
collins leary bernadeau green/gibson
that's 9 OL for the 53-man roster

 

[xwalker]

COLLINS played LT well at LSU - but them 33 1/4" arm length scares me for an NFL tackle - He can become a dominating OG and maybe suspect challenge as an OT. Chaz Green, I have same reservation for as an OT. His arm length is just 33 3/8. Zach Martin - even shorter 32 7/8" All 3 players best position may be inside at OG. The raw and project player - Lawrence Gibson, physically is the best athlete and has 35 1/8" arms. He just may be the RT in 3 years.

SMITH - COLLINS - FREDBEARD - MARTIN - FREE
collins leary bernadeau green/gibson
that's 9 OL for the 53-man roster

It can be done. Joe Thomas arm length is 32-1/2" and he is an 8x Pro Bowler and 7x All-Pro. I can't find the wingspan for Thomas, but I think it is still relatively large despite the short arms.

As started earlier, Collins has a good wingspan at 82" while Zack Martin's wingspan is not ideal for OT as 76-7/8".

 

[GimmeTheBall!]

That's so clever- no wait ...

I would call it a tie, Chachi: mein post and yo response.

 

[BoysWin]

It can be done. Joe Thomas arm length is 32-1/2" and he is an 8x Pro Bowler and 7x All-Pro. I can't find the wingspan for Thomas, but I think it is still relatively large despite the short arms.

As started earlier, Collins has a good wingspan at 82" while Zack Martin's wingspan is not ideal for OT as 76-7/8".

82" wingspan is large. Must be one very thick man....... SMITH and COLLINS anchored on edges in the future won't be bad. just reinsert Leary back into LG when FREE is done..........

 

[Galian Beast]

If Free is healthy enough to suit up for the game, the only way Collins starts over him is if Jerry and the front office force Garrett to do it. IMO, Garrett will start Free no matter how poorly he performs. Garrett has 4 players that he has allowed to basically do what they want to do. Romo, Witten, Murray and Free. Garrett could never bring himself to force Romo to quit changing runs plays to pass plays until Linehan took over the play calling. Garrett let Witten and Murray play as many snaps as they wanted even in blow out wins. Garrett insisted that Free remain the starter even in 2012 when he was terrible and despite the objections of the OLine coach.

I've have been and continue to be a fan of Garrett as the Head Coach, but his weakness is his attachment to certain players.

Good ol' boys club.

Reason why the head coach shouldn't be going to basketball games with players...

 

[Brooksey]

The issue with Free is that his entire game if based on quick feet. He has very limited upper body strength and compensates by having very quick feet to keep himself in front of the pass rusher and avoid having to reach. If Free loses any foot quickness, then he will have big problems. Some big nasty RTs like Loadholt in Minn can play without quick feet because he compensates with overwhelming power and a long reach. Free can't do that.

His strength was his feet and now he has bad feet. He will start some games this year and he will sit some games, it will be a transition year. I see no reason to get rid of a 24-25 year old Ron Leary.

 

[Stash]

COLLINS played LT well at LSU - but them 33 1/4" arm length scares me for an NFL tackle - He can become a dominating OG and maybe suspect challenge as an OT. Chaz Green, I have same reservation for as an OT. His arm length is just 33 3/8. Zach Martin - even shorter 32 7/8" All 3 players best position may be inside at OG. The raw and project player - Lawrence Gibson, physically is the best athlete and has 35 1/8" arms. He just may be the RT in 3 years.

SMITH - COLLINS - FREDBEARD - MARTIN - FREE
collins leary bernadeau green/gibson
that's 9 OL for the 53-man roster

I think that ideally this is the starting lineup the Cowboys would prefer. I think they want Green to be an adequate swing tackle this year with an eye on taking the starting RT job in 2016. With Free then assuming a backup role for as long as he's still here and Gibson as a fallback option with big upside.

 

[plasticman]

What is interesring about this topic is the automatic assumption that this squad will not have any long term injuries in 2016.

Hate to discuss it but if we truly want to be realistic we have to factor in the possibility of a season ending injury to a current starter......

...which makes the signing of Collins even more spectacular. Imagine losing a Pro Bowl lineman, an event that could really cripple a contender. Now imagine replacing that player with Collins.

 

[Doomsday101]

If Free is healthy enough to suit up for the game, the only way Collins starts over him is if Jerry and the front office force Garrett to do it. IMO, Garrett will start Free no matter how poorly he performs. Garrett has 4 players that he has allowed to basically do what they want to do. Romo, Witten, Murray and Free. Garrett could never bring himself to force Romo to quit changing runs plays to pass plays until Linehan took over the play calling. Garrett let Witten and Murray play as many snaps as they wanted even in blow out wins. Garrett insisted that Free remain the starter even in 2012 when he was terrible and despite the objections of the OLine coach.

I've have been and continue to be a fan of Garrett as the Head Coach, but his weakness is his attachment to certain players.

I think he will play the best and the Free comment doing what he wants? come on. Evidently this goes back to your own views of Parnell and feeling he was better, Cowboys did not think so and many of us did not think so. Free has had his ups and downs and the move the LT I think hurt him but as a RT he has held his own. If Collins comes in and produces he very well could take the job of Free or Leary but it will come down to which grouping forms the best OL

 

[jrumann59]

I just explained that wingspan is not just arm length.
Wingspan:
Martin: 76-7/8"
Collins: 82"

Wingspan is a useless number because finger tip to finger tip is not a measure of a good reach since it also include the width of the chest. Not that arm length is indicative of ability either but at least it is a good measurement of pass blacking. Now if your guy gets beat and the guy besides him gets beat wingspan may come in handy when you try and clothesline two guys.

 

[xwalker]

I think he will play the best and the Free comment doing what he wants? come on. Evidently this goes back to your own views of Parnell and feeling he was better, Cowboys did not think so and many of us did not think so. Free has had his ups and downs and the move the LT I think hurt him but as a RT he has held his own. If Collins comes in and produces he very well could take the job of Free or Leary but it will come down to which grouping forms the best OL

Didn't everybody complain for years that Romo would audible out run plays? Didn't many people comment that Romo quit doing that in 2014?

Didn't Witten play 100% of the snaps in some games that were already decided by the 4th quarter?

Didn't Murray play more snaps than was necessary in games that were already decided by the 4th quarter when they really needed to be developing a backup?

Didn't Romo, Witten and Murray play late into the final game which was a meaningless blowout?

Didn't Free come back and play in 2014 after missing a couple of games with an injury only to re-injure himself? Once Free was re-injured, Tony Hills was the backup to Parnell. If they had let Parnell continue to start, then Free could have been the backup until he was 110% ready to return. Letting Free return too early instead of making him the backup caused them to have Tony Hills as the backup to Parnell. That whole ordeal could have been a disaster if Parnell had been injured.

 

[jnday]

Collins is better

I keep reading this in this thread and there is no way that anybody knows how Collins will turn out. We do know that Leary is the starting LG for one of the best lines in the league. Leary is not going to just step aside and let Collins have his job. Leary is a good guard that proved his worth against JJ Watt and others. Collins hasn't proved he can do that against pro players. I think Collins will be a good player, but at this stage of his career it is impossible to say that Collins can start in his rookie year. I would like to see him at RT. Free is overrated on this board and an upgrade/replacement is needed.

 

[Doomsday101]

Didn't everybody complain for years that Romo would audible out run plays? Didn't many people comment that Romo quit doing that in 2014?

Didn't Witten play 100% of the snaps in some games that were already decided by the 4th quarter?

Didn't Murray play more snaps than was necessary in games that were already decided by the 4th quarter when they really needed to be developing a backup?

Didn't Romo, Witten and Murray play late into the final game which was a meaningless blowout?

Didn't Free come back and play in 2014 after missing a couple of games with an injury only to re-injure himself? Once Free was re-injured, Tony Hills was the backup to Parnell. If they had let Parnell continue to start, then Free could have been the backup until he was 110% ready to return. Letting Free return too early instead of making him the backup caused them to have Tony Hills as the backup to Parnell. That whole ordeal could have been a disaster if Parnell had been injured.

Those comments could be said about any number of players. The notion that somehow Free is getting a free ride, come on. Parnell was not as good as you make him out to be Free beat him out plain and simple and just because you watched some type does not mean anything. Free like many players will come back as soon as they can because they are important to the team this is not just Dallas this is all across the NFL.

As for Romo, yes he audibles out of plays he did that last year as well most every QB does it is not out of the norm.

Witten plays 100% of the snap and?
Murray the same thing yes they gave him the carries heck I'm sure we can come up with others guys on this team and around the league.

 

[Doomsday101]

I keep reading this in this thread and there is no way that anybody knows how Collins will turn out. We do know that Leary is the starting LG for one of the best lines in the league. Leary is not going to just step aside and let Collins have his job. Leary is a good guard that proved his worth against JJ Watt and others. Collins hasn't proved he can do that against pro players. I think Collins will be a good player, but at this stage of his career it is impossible to say that Collins can start in his rookie year. I would like to see him at RT. Free is overrated on this board and an upgrade/replacement is needed.

I have no issue if he takes Free or Leary starting job, I want the best OL out there and the best way to find that out is having guys compete that is what makes this team it's best when you have guys out there competing for it.

 

[xwalker]

Those comments could be said about any number of players. The notion that somehow Free is getting a free ride, come on. Parnell was not as good as you make him out to be Free beat him out plain and simple and just because you watched some type does not mean anything. Free like many players will come back as soon as they can because they are important to the team this is not just Dallas this is all across the NFL.

As for Romo, yes he audibles out of plays he did that last year as well most every QB does it is not out of the norm.

Witten plays 100% of the snap and?
Murray the same thing yes they gave him the carries heck I'm sure we can come up with others guys on this team and around the league.

If you're going to pretend that Romo changing run plays to pass plays was not a big problem, then nothing else you say can have any validity. Everybody knows that was an issue above and beyond what is "normal" in the NFL.

 

[Doomsday101]

If you're going to pretend that Romo changing run plays to pass plays was not a big problem, then nothing else you say can have any validity. Everybody knows that was an issue above and beyond what is "normal" in the NFL.

Not saying it was not a problem at times but does not change the fact QB including Romo still change the calls at the line of scrimmage based on defensive alignments, defensive fronts and coverage’s, sorry you don’t get that most NFL QB do make changes based on these things. And yes Dallas was not doing anything out of the norm by having Witten play the snaps he does or Murray. This BS of Free somehow gets a free pass by Garrett is non sense. Cowboys disagreed with you on Parnell and now all of a sudden it is because Free was given the job. Maybe they know a bit more than you do about the ability and quality of a player. You have gone on and on about Parnell as being so much better than Free well that is your opinion it is not some NFL expert opinion